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Monster 318 Poly build (Tons of tech info)

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Appleseed, Nov 29, 2005.

  1. Appleseed
    Joined: Feb 21, 2005
    Posts: 1,053

    Appleseed
    Member

    I'm cribing this directly from Mopar Muscle. Earlier talk about Mopar polys made me did through some back issues. Here goes!
    1962 318 poly.
    .090 overbore for an even 4.0 size
    Mopar performance 4in. stroker crank for LA318/340 (PN P5007256)
    = 402c.i. poly engine!!!
    Honed and decked the block. Deck height was 8.248
    ARP studs and bolts used. Special order dpt. (805) 525-1497
    Parts like 4 bolt mains from RAM Racing Engines.(804) 846-0043
    360 rods shot peened, polished and bushed.
    ARP rod bolts (PN ARP 144-6001)
    Hardened Clevite rod berings (PN CB481H)
    JE pistons. no part number given. Might be custom jobs.
    At .010 in the hole with 74cc chambers, yeilds 10.1 to 1 compression.
    Small .927 wrist pin + Childs & Alberta Dura Moly rings (PN 9343-35)
    Internaly balenced the crank
    Clevite 340 berings (PN MS1344P)
    Minor block clearancing.
    Melling High volume oil pump (PN M72HV)
    Milodon windage tray (PN 32230)
    Rollmaster timing set (PN MRE1262)
    BHJ damper (PN BHJMP-IB816)
    hydraulic cam 290 deg./492in lift cam (234 @.500 with 110 LDA)
    from ChrisNeilson. (800)341-2267
    Crower valve springs (PN 68305-1)
    Crower keepers (PN 86107-1)
    Crower bushings (PN 90927)
    Manley retainers (PN 23645-16)
    Sealed Power stem seals (rubber PC type PN ST2012)
    Rocker Arm Specialists blueprinted arms at 1.5 ratio (530) 378-1075
    Port and polish (yer on yer own for this one)
    custom Ferra Valves 2.02/1.60 with a narrow 5/16th stem
    3 angle valve job with Nylen guides (PN 6850)
    Wieand Steath intake (PN 7503)
    Holly 750 double pumper
    Your on your own for headers. Splitfire Headers have some aplications.
    Fel-Pro full gasket set (PN FS7734PT-2) Use RTV on intate ends.
    70 primary jets. 83 secondary jets. 34 deg. advance

    All in all this will give you 397 HP @6,000 RPM
    and 442 FT of torque @ 4400RPM

    Well I hope that gives some leads to poly parts. I may have some things listed wrong (don't shout!) If you need more info on phone numbers or other things just ask. I'm lazy and heavly paraphrased this magazine feature. Just one more reason not to run a 350 SBC.
     
  2. Bugman
    Joined: Nov 17, 2001
    Posts: 3,483

    Bugman
    Member

    I've often thought of building this very engine. I know Mel wants one for her '59 Dodge too. I don't suppose you could scan the pages and e-mail them to me?
     
  3. Appleseed
    Joined: Feb 21, 2005
    Posts: 1,053

    Appleseed
    Member

    Sorry I don't have the internet. I know your thinking "how the hell are you writing this?" I'm at school. But the Mopar muscle issue I'm looking at is the Sept/Oct 2001. I'd say just look on their web site, but its been on the fritz lately. If I can find some one to scan it I will, but don't hold your breath, as most of my budies are unreliable turds or anti-computer cavemen.
     
  4. Go here...

    http://www.1962to1965mopar.ornocar.com/poly318.html

    It's got all the parts and what he did.

    Jay
     

  5. CheatersPete
    Joined: Sep 25, 2002
    Posts: 1,264

    CheatersPete
    Member

  6. ian
    Joined: Aug 6, 2005
    Posts: 782

    ian
    Member

    i have a spare 318 in the garage and a 360 thats going into my 54' Plymouth....oooh the possibilities. :D
     
  7. Devin
    Joined: Dec 28, 2004
    Posts: 2,352

    Devin
    Member
    from Napa, CA

    Where'd you dig up that picture? It's great! Got any history on the car?
     
  8. CheatersPete
    Joined: Sep 25, 2002
    Posts: 1,264

    CheatersPete
    Member

  9. Gary Pavlovich
    Joined: Dec 9, 2005
    Posts: 16

    Gary Pavlovich
    Member
    from CA

    Appleseed,
    Very good! It was 405HP at 5600rpm though and I am building another version with a dual quad and some "improvements."
    Gary Pavlovich
    402" Poly stroker
    Mopar Muscle Magazine articles 9/01 and 10/01.
    I may do another run of articles if time permits.
     
  10. I remember a few years ago, when you posted the build on the 62-65 mopar mail list, and it was met with mixed reviews.... Seems like half the people said "you could build a big block for half the money with twice the power" and the other half said "awesome!". Good to see you found your way to the HAMB, Gary. David



     
  11. Gary Pavlovich
    Joined: Dec 9, 2005
    Posts: 16

    Gary Pavlovich
    Member
    from CA

    David,

    Thank you for the "welcome" to the HAMB. Sure, anyone can build a big block with tons of torque and HP and I would like the space for in my garage to do it, but I like to be different (as I think most HAMB members will agree) and build power another way. However, 400HP+ is easy in a Poly and you can do it with less cam/less compression than is needed for a wedge chamber; better BMEP with a Poly than a Wedge. Notice how the "New" Dodge uses a Polyspherical chamber?
    We can also make 500-600HP with a Poly and the engines are free for the taking as opposed to $500 or better for a core 440 long block.
    Just a little Poly plug here!
    Gary
     
  12. Abomination
    Joined: Oct 5, 2006
    Posts: 6,701

    Abomination
    Member

    For posterity!

    Go to the Polyspherical Engine Association home page here:
    http://www.geocities.com/polyman64/

    At the top of the page, you'll find a link to the 318 Poly Yahoo Group (which is where we all are, and you can even contact Gary, the guy that wrote this there):
    http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/318poly/

    There's also a link to the Poly Forum, where we all mostly just lurk. :)
    http://www.diamondbackengines.com/forums/index.php/board,6.0.html

    ~Jason


     

    Attached Files:

  13. vexner
    Joined: Dec 11, 2006
    Posts: 126

    vexner
    Member

    Thanks for posting these Poly site Jason I didn't even know there where any!
     
  14. Abomination
    Joined: Oct 5, 2006
    Posts: 6,701

    Abomination
    Member

    That's why I post 'em, man. ;)

    You'll see me online all around posting about the same info on several boards. Every once in a while I head out and pick up the strays... besides, the more places the link is seen, the more folks will know where to go for the info.

    Who knows? Maybe we can all pool together and get some new intakes made!

    :D

    ~Jason

     
  15. panic
    Joined: Jan 3, 2004
    Posts: 1,450

    panic

    "Honed and decked the block. Deck height was 8.248"

    What???

    That's very respectable power considering the mild tune.
    Where's the rest of the power?

    1. not enough cam, need closer to 250° @ .050", 108° LSA
    With the .500" cam used, unless about .050" longer valve stems were used (i.e., the installed height of the new valve is greater than the original factory height) you need .050" lash caps to correct the geometry (.500" vs. .405" original lift, ÷ 2, corrected by cosine of stem angle).
    Was that done?

    2. yes, I know that the only "performance" manifold on the market, but it's a 360° - the same as the factory manifold. Has anyone tried a 2" open spacer?

    I'd be inclined to use the Weiand or even a factory 2 × 4 manifold.
     
  16. Abomination
    Joined: Oct 5, 2006
    Posts: 6,701

    Abomination
    Member

    I seem to remember that there was a big "to do" about this, and it turned out to be something Gary fixed later. I vaguely remember a story about some shop screwing him over...

    He's a real nice guy - you should hit him up for some info over at the Yahoo Group. I'l sure he'll tell you. Hell, he emails folks all the time, and might have a Word .DOC he can send if you're interested...

    I also seem to remember him mentioning that not everything went into the article, but I'm not sure...

    ~Jason

     
  17. Abomination
    Joined: Oct 5, 2006
    Posts: 6,701

    Abomination
    Member

    Simple... elegant... why in the HELL didn't I think of that?? Right in front of my face the whole time!

    I guess that's why you have a book, and I don't. :D

    I don't believe I've heard of anyone doing that. Then again, I'm not privy to all the stories. :)

    ~Jason

     
  18. panic
    Joined: Jan 3, 2004
    Posts: 1,450

    panic

    Re: WHAT

    I meant that's got to be a typo in the magazine - you can't just take an inch off the deck. 9.248"? Still a huge chunk (.352", almost 3/8").
     
  19. Abomination
    Joined: Oct 5, 2006
    Posts: 6,701

    Abomination
    Member

    Oh, hell... yeah, I saw that. I dismissed it as a typo, and never thought to ask the guy about it. I haven't read the article since like 2002. I juts had it emailed to me somewhere along the line, and figured I'd add 'em to this post.

    But yeah, now that you mention it, I remember reading that and wondering...

    ~Jason

     
  20. panic
    Joined: Jan 3, 2004
    Posts: 1,450

    panic

    Got a few e-mails about the 2 × 4 manifolds, thought it might be useful to more people.

    The preferred modern V8 design is a single open plenum with runners all aiming at a common point, and lengths as close as possible without making bad port entry curves. You just can't do this to an existing manifold, and certainly not to a O-O-O-O manifold. The runners appear about the same length to the plenum - but not to the carb discharge area.

    The Weiand 7503 is certainly a nice weight saving over the similar design iron Power Pack 260 hp manifold and easier to modify and repair, the top looks taller (i.e., higher runner roof), but I'm not sure there's any internal improvement re: plenum volume, runner radii, etc. and very hard to modify because of the closed top. It's also not free, duh.

    The Weiand 2 × 4 manifold, on the other hand (giving up the thought of finding/using/cutting up a V800 factory aluminum manifold), although of same design, is easier to modify, and needs less work.
    1. more carb openings means more tool access
    2. higher total CFM with somewhat better mixture distribution
    3. can run the rear carb on small primary & choke for mileage
    4. runners are better aimed to the carb barrels (although front and rear are different - I suspect this is a compromise to put the rear primary in a good spot, allow clearance between carbs, and front carb to thermostat), and are all about the same length.
     
  21. Abomination
    Joined: Oct 5, 2006
    Posts: 6,701

    Abomination
    Member

    I know Ray & Gary (From the Yahoo Group) were trying to get Edelbrock to make one of their new-ish RPM Performer Air Gap manifolds to suit Poly 318s.
    http://www.forwardlook.net/forums/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=5736&posts=13

    I believe that project has been axed, and that Ray is gearing up to build his own while we wait with baited breath! :D

    ~Jason

     

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