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**Horray for the star spangled Banger** July 2013 Banger meet

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Crazydaddyo, Jul 1, 2013.

  1. Crazydaddyo
    Joined: Apr 6, 2008
    Posts: 3,130

    Crazydaddyo
    Member

    Here is the banger link list .


    For the HAMB banger newbies, here are some links to a lot of banger info:

    Flat Ernie maintains the monthly link list. Every month is listed:

    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/s...d.php?t=161498



    Banger basics. another info link list:

    http://www.fordgarage.com/

    http://www.billsbangers.com

    http://www.plucks329s.org/index.htm

    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/s...d.php?t=251717

    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/s...ad.php?t=42480

    Post #105 of link below shows flywheel lightening dimensions
    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=470853&page=6

    Model B rod bearing insert numbers
    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?p=6992484#post6992484


    Engine tuning with a Vacuum gauge
    http://www.centuryperformance.com/tuning-with-a-vacuum-gauge-spg-148.html

    Adjusting dual Strombergs:
    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?p=6638461#post6638461

    Helpful Model A tools and tips:

    http://www.maurer-markus.ch/ford_a/tipps.index.en.html

    Elrod's stuck head tech:

    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=218487

    Model A generator to alternator conversion:

    http://ejwhitneyco.com/automotive.html

    Gear ratio / speed and RPM calculator:

    http://www.accuautoparts.com/calculator.php


    Model A master cylinder mounting bracket ideas:

    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/s...73#post4953173

    Go here to read the 1931 edition of Harry Ricardo's book "The High Speed Internal Combustion Engine"

    http://www.scribd.com/full/40610101?access_key=key-w2bcjicdancrnxypd05


    Chevy Banger Stuff

    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/s...d.php?t=463465

    http://www.scribd.com/doc/22469332/The-High-Speed-Internal-Combustion-Engine-Ricardo-1931

    Post 198 starts a great discussion of the shape of a flat head combustion chamber

    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=470853&page=10

    Maybe these links should be posted early in each months meeting.

    If anyone knows of more, please post them.
     
    Last edited: Jul 3, 2013
  2. Bluto
    Joined: Feb 15, 2005
    Posts: 5,114

    Bluto
    Member Emeritus

    Thank you Dan
     
  3. Subscribed. Happy 4th to all!
     
  4. noboD
    Joined: Jan 29, 2004
    Posts: 6,911

    noboD
    Member

    yup, thank you.
     
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  5. modelAsteve
    Joined: Jan 9, 2009
    Posts: 341

    modelAsteve
    Member

    FYI- There is a Star Spangled Banger- runs at Bonneville with Offy motor. A very beautiful and very, very fast! As I remember it was in F class. I heard that it was back to the original builder and going to run again.
     
  6. V4F
    Joined: Aug 8, 2008
    Posts: 3,889

    V4F
    Member
    from middle ca.

    great steve ..................... steve
     
  7. johnneilson
    Joined: Apr 12, 2011
    Posts: 932

    johnneilson
    Member

    there is another indy500 roadster with a 270 offy, maybe the same.

    Dan, sorry, missed you at Antique Nats, I was sidetracked with Isky and Moore.

    J


    Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!
     
  8. I got my new engine! I can't wait to get it installed and fired up. I'll post pictures this evening. How should I break it in? same as other more modern engines?
     
  9. I tried two 94's on a Cragar manifold on my '29 cabriolet as a teenager back in the early sixties, but never got it sorted out to idle well. ...and the power combined with a too fast idle scared me enough that I thought I would quickly blow up my daily driver's motor, so I pulled it and went back to the original updraft. After nearly fifty years of storage, I am making good progress in rebuilding my first car, and am in the process of planning out the motor build now.

    Snyder's Auto Parts sells the finned aluminum Thomas head and manifolds. They have both dual and triple carb manifolds. I doubt that any four banger I would ever build could benefit from running three 97's, but would that triple manifold work well with the two ends capped and running a single 97 for normal use, and being able to occasionally switch to two 97's by capping the center off? Or is running two 97's all the time easy enough?

    Thanks for your thoughts.
     
  10. Kensey
    Joined: Sep 25, 2006
    Posts: 735

    Kensey
    Member
    from Pittsburgh

    My dad told me he had trips on his 58 chevy back in the day. Only the middle one was functional. OLD SCHOOL!

    On another note, I installed my B police head over the weekend. WHAT A DIFFERENCE!!!!
    This is my first banger motor and I stinkin' love it! Seems to idle higher, still getting used to the new head and my new found get up and GO!
     


  11. Details please.....
     
  12. Magnus B
    Joined: Jun 19, 2005
    Posts: 885

    Magnus B
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Hello

    This is a little post about my latest engine build. Only a year or so delayed, but now it's running, or at least it was. Ths build has taken some time, I've changed my mind a few times and I've had loads of setbacks.

    The base engine is nothing spectacular just a normal build, but I did most of it myself. It's a model B fully pressurized including drilled crank of course. I modified the oilpump with a relief valve. I also have two relief valves in the valve gallery. Insert main bearings, inserted Gerber rods, 1.7" intake valves, stock exhaust valves, Isky flathead valve springs. I'm running a Cyclone head with combustion chambers mimicking the Harley Davidson KR. Forgot to take any pics after they were machined. For induction I run 2 Stromberg 48's on a Tornado intake and for ignition I use a Scintilla magneto.

    What makes this a bit special is the camshaft. I'm running a specially made 4 piece camshaft with about 0.472" lift and about 265 degrees duration. It's made in pieces so it's possible to even mount it without machinig the cam bores. Due to the profile I needed to use some 30's Mopar tappets. They've been mentioned here before. I did have to take some material out of the underside of the valve chamber floor due to the high lift cam.

    I have the engine in the coupe now and I have drivven it 200-250 miles so far. It runs pretty good. By far the best banger I've drivven. It has the most aggressive idle tone I've heard from a banger :D It pulls really hard and I did have it up to 65 mph in 2nd gear (model B transmission) and it still wanted to rev more. I have not had it above 75 mph since the front tires starts to bounce bad, but it really wants to go way faster.

    As I said I did most of it myself, only things I could not do myself was line boring the mains, boring the cylinders, grinding the crank, machining the top deck and doing the rods. I like to do things myself and challenge myself to see if I' able to get it done.

    I've had some setbacks and the biggest one is the connecting rods. I think I went thru 18 stock rods before I found 4 good anough for machining. But they were still a bit thin so I pulled the trigger and bought a set from Dan Eubanks. Beautiful, lightweight things... Except they are twisted more then 3 degrees when compareing the crank pin to the piston pin. The caps have nothing that aligns them to the rod. The caps can be pushed 4-5 thousands side to side so it's no way to line them up on the crank pin. The bore of the caps are about 2.5 thousands larger then the bores of the rods, as they've sprung out after machining. Also you can see by naked eye that the actual rod is not straight but a bit wavy. That would probably not be a problem, but it does not add up to a better impression. After ventilating some of my concerns about these rods I heard it was a known fact that Dan had some rods machined with a twist in them. Thank you for selling them to Sweden. So I now have some really expensive paper weights and Dan refuses to answer my e-mails. I can not recommend buying from Dan Eubanks. I'd much rather had him send me some blanks to machine myself. Sorry for the rant and exposing Dan, but I did send him lots of e-mails and I did tell him that I would post my experiances here.

    Anyway, I'm happy to finally have a good strong engine and I have already many new ideas for the next engine and the one after that... and so on.

    Regards,
    Magnus
     

    Attached Files:

  13. Crazydaddyo
    Joined: Apr 6, 2008
    Posts: 3,130

    Crazydaddyo
    Member

    You need to post a video of it running, otherwise we just have to take your word that it runs. :D.

    Great build!!!!

    .
     
  14. It's probably pretty mild. It came from a estate sale. A rebuild that was never run. Popped the oil pan and it still has assembly lube on the cam. It's a A motor. stock head. Counterbalanced crank. Lightened flywheel( unsure of actual amount) but looks very similar to a picture of a 35 pound I saw. Unsure of the cam. Still babbit. It came with what appears to be a rebuilt distributor, generator and starter.

    I have a Thomas 2x2 intake and either 97's or 94's, a vintage Mallory distributor. I bought a Winfield 6.7-1 head and reds header. I will probably have a Winfield cam ground by Delta cams.

    I'd like to do some oil system mods before putting it in, and was thinking about bigger valves...

    But I may just swap it in to keep me on the road, break it in. Bolt everything on, and look for a B core to build 100% the way I want.
     
  15. Crazydaddyo
    Joined: Apr 6, 2008
    Posts: 3,130

    Crazydaddyo
    Member

    It's a good idea to dab some fresh assembly grease on the cam lobes before you button it up. If the engine has been sitting for some time, the grease can dry out.

    .
     
  16. nosdan
    Joined: Mar 27, 2009
    Posts: 228

    nosdan
    Member

    Any tricks to getting an original banger head off? Picked up a barn find, all original, but the water pump wheel was rust to pieces and the pump wheel area of the head is rotted. Motor is free.. but trying to get the head off is a bugger. Tips or tricks?
    Thanks!
     
  17. Planning on it, Thanks!

    BTW does anyone know where I can get a manifold linkage arm kit for a downdraft manifold. Sacramento Vintage Ford no longer has them and was the only place I had found that sells them.
     
  18. http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=218487
     
  19. nosdan
    Joined: Mar 27, 2009
    Posts: 228

    nosdan
    Member

    Perfect, thanks!
     
  20. nosdan
    Joined: Mar 27, 2009
    Posts: 228

    nosdan
    Member

  21. Timberbeast
    Joined: Jun 28, 2009
    Posts: 74

    Timberbeast
    Member

    Most of the replacement parts catalogs have studs listed singlely or in sets.
    I would replace all of them since you had a rust problem with the head. They aren't that expensive. If you are going to use a High Compression Head use hardened studs.
     
  22. skryla
    Joined: Oct 22, 2012
    Posts: 120

    skryla
    Member
    from Brick, NJ

  23. Crazydaddyo
    Joined: Apr 6, 2008
    Posts: 3,130

    Crazydaddyo
    Member



    Try here:

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Jul 3, 2013
  24. nosdan
    Joined: Mar 27, 2009
    Posts: 228

    nosdan
    Member

    Would like to use the existing factory rear for the banger project... what rear gears are out there to get the top speed (dual carb, 6:1 head, headers, stock trans)... Thanks!
     
  25. Crazydaddyo
    Joined: Apr 6, 2008
    Posts: 3,130

    Crazydaddyo
    Member

    A quick search of one of the Model A parts suppliers netted this:

    http://www.snydersantiqueauto.com/modelaparts/rearaxle-1?page=2

    These gears will increase your speed slightly. Fits all Model A cars and small trucks!
    <table style=""><tbody><tr> <th>Part Number</th> <th>Specifics</th> <th>Price</th> </tr> <tr> <td class="part"><label><input size="3" name="9487" class="auto" type="text"> A-4209-HS</label></td> <td>11-39 3:54 to 1
    1928-31</td> <td>$465.00 / ea.</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="part"><label><input size="3" name="6671" class="auto" type="text"> A-4209-HSS</label></td> <td>3:27 to 1
    </td> <td>$635.00 / set</td></tr></tbody></table>
     
  26. nosdan
    Joined: Mar 27, 2009
    Posts: 228

    nosdan
    Member

    Thanks, I guess mostly looking to see what the 3:54 and 3:27 would produce top end wise... Sorry for the confusion and thanks for the link. I'm new with the original items and wanted to build a 40's traditional rod. 3:27 cause too much gap for driving? ect... thanks Crazydaddyo!!
     
  27. If period authenticity is a concern, try Roy Nacewicz at www.fordbolts.com - he makes correct fasteners (high-point restoration quality) for the A motors. The suppliers sell modern style studs which differ substantially in appearance from the original fasteners IMO.
     
  28. 3.27 gears were sold in the mid-40's if not earlier. JimmyB posted some '47 & 48 vintage SCTA programs with advertisements for 3.27 gears, so they are era-correct if that's a concern.
     
  29. Let me know how that works out...I may need to rig something up for my Winfield carb setup.
     
  30. Crazydaddyo
    Joined: Apr 6, 2008
    Posts: 3,130

    Crazydaddyo
    Member


    Here is a link from the list of links I post at the start of each month:

    http://www.accuautoparts.com/calculator.php

    Plug in your info and compare the results.

    I run a quick change with a final drive of 3.48. I can run 70 mph in 4th gear. (I run a 5 speed. 4th is 1-1 like the stock 3rd gear)
    I can take off in 2nd gear (2.18 gear ratio) .


    .
     

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