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Ray Brown Lakester... More details.

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Jive-Bomber, Dec 29, 2009.

  1. Jive-Bomber
    Joined: Aug 21, 2001
    Posts: 2,587

    Jive-Bomber
    MODERATOR
    from Moraga, Ca

  2. JeffreyJames
    Joined: Jun 13, 2007
    Posts: 16,401

    JeffreyJames
    Member
    from SUGAR CITY

    I love center steer competition roadsters and this one is no exception. In the cut away drawing i noticed the radiator still being utilized up front with the water neck tubes traveling all the way back to the engine. I wonder if that was to increase the water capacity for cooling? I am not sure if my understanding of the principles are correct so any help there would be cool.

    This car is definitely all business!!!
     
  3. That was way over the top thinking for "back in the day".. What a beautiful piece of work! How did it do?
     
  4. sololobo
    Joined: Aug 23, 2006
    Posts: 6,826

    sololobo
    Member

    Captain "R", one of my fave cars of the era, cool to see these rare photos! Muchas Gracious!! ~Sololobo~
     
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  5. Labold
    Joined: Nov 1, 2007
    Posts: 1,203

    Labold
    Member

    So simple yet way ahead of it's time.
    ....well, maybe not so simple....
     
  6. scottybaccus
    Joined: Mar 13, 2006
    Posts: 4,132

    scottybaccus
    Member

    Ingenius setup! I wish I knew more about setting up for the salt. My mind snapped to the question of unsprung weight right off the bat, but with so many successful cars running no suspension at all, I can't reconcile this in my head.

    Nice shots to look back in time.
     
  7. Kevin Lee
    Joined: Nov 12, 2001
    Posts: 7,188

    Kevin Lee
    Super Moderator
    Staff Member

  8. lorodz
    Joined: Jul 26, 2009
    Posts: 3,688

    lorodz
    Member

    question how was the clutch engaged and the tranny shifter in these rear mounted motors and trans ??
     
  9. blitz
    Joined: Jun 15, 2009
    Posts: 139

    blitz
    Member

    i love that car, i started my love for the model t, and every time i see it it just gets worse
     
  10. autobilly
    Joined: May 23, 2007
    Posts: 2,924

    autobilly
    Member

    So it would seem and important to note. Still gives a good indication of the design principle and set up of the Brown car though.
     
  11. catdad49
    Joined: Sep 25, 2005
    Posts: 379

    catdad49
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Things were so much simpler back then. Many purpose built cars of today are simple,but way more complicated. Dig? Cat
     
  12. jangleguy
    Joined: Dec 26, 2004
    Posts: 2,620

    jangleguy
    Member

    I just read the chapter on Ray's car last night, in the Edelbrock book. Always loved it and now I want to marry it! Thanks for posting this, Jay!



    Scotty
     
  13. Jive-Bomber
    Joined: Aug 21, 2001
    Posts: 2,587

    Jive-Bomber
    MODERATOR
    from Moraga, Ca


    HA!
    No wonder I had never seen that pic of Ray Brown's car-- it isn't his!! Thanks for the correction & and the scan, Kevin- The Don Waite 27 is a GOOD LOOKING car!
     
  14. These rear engined roadsters used an in and out box like sprint cars. They were pushed up to a certain speed and the box engaged.

    As you say that is Don Waite's drivetrain. Ray Brown's roadster had a solid mounted rear and engine. Ray later converted his roadster to a cradle setup similar to that of Don Waite's.
    1948
    [​IMG]
    As you can see above Ray did something other lake roadster builders didn't do, he retained the body subrails. To channel the body Ray simply built the chassis on top the subrails.

    1949-50
    Below you can see how Ray built his cradle.
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    There are great construction shots of Ray's roadster on the AHRF
     
  15. Paul
    Joined: Aug 29, 2002
    Posts: 12,312

    Paul
    Editor

  16. It is an amazing car, Don raced it for around 10-11 years. It started in '47 with a Crager 4 in front. In 1948 the roadster was converted to a rear engine setup with the same 4-pot Crager. 1949 it was rebuilt again with the Merc in the cradle, channelled and track nose added. Early 50s saw the track nose replaced with what Alex Xydias called a knife nose and the flathead replaced with a hemi by 1953
    This pic was posted on the HAMB about 5 years ago of how Don Waite's car looked at the time, restoration was under way, a few members questioned the car as being the original & called it a clone, that offended the owner and nothing else has been posted.
    [​IMG]
    1949
    [​IMG]

    Back to Ray Brown's roadster
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  17. sr
    Joined: Feb 12, 2007
    Posts: 351

    sr
    Member
    from Monterey

    Here is a photo of the Hemi that was in the 27 roadster when it had, what Don called the "canoe" nose........... It was removed from the roadster when rear engine modifieds were banned and it found its way into the 29 roadster that he built.
     

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  18. Retro Jim
    Joined: May 27, 2007
    Posts: 3,862

    Retro Jim
    Member

    Doesn't mater who's picture it is . Just shows you how they used their heads to figure out how to make something work better !
    Both were very smart in the design !

    RetroJim
     
  19. fab32
    Joined: May 14, 2002
    Posts: 13,995

    fab32
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    The installation of that hemi is about as sanitary as any I've seen. One of the things I've noticed about the guys back then is that they are as capable of terrific engineering and execution as any one around today. They were able to do thier magic with hacksaws and SAE bolts and without the "advantage" of a plasma cutter and heliarc welders. Their accomplisments were truely amazing.

    Frank
     
  20. Angry Frenchman
    Joined: Feb 12, 2006
    Posts: 1,618

    Angry Frenchman
    Member

    Cool to see racer brown stuff on here. / also wasn't Don waite 19 or 20 years old when he built his model T? cool guys
     
  21. sr
    Joined: Feb 12, 2007
    Posts: 351

    sr
    Member
    from Monterey

    Just a few other shots I found........
     

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  22. Federico
    Joined: Feb 27, 2010
    Posts: 8

    Federico
    Member
    from California

    Any of the iterations of the two cars - Only the Best Hot Rods of the day were worthy of the Rex Burnett cutaway drawings...Hot Rod Magazine just did not feature these cutaways for anything other than the absolute 'State of the Art'...the cradle ball-joint set-up, and yes considering technology of the time, is genius.
     

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