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History Vintage "Cageless" Midget Picture Thread

Discussion in 'Traditional Hot Rods' started by KKx125, Feb 22, 2009.

  1. the shadow
    Joined: Mar 5, 2005
    Posts: 1,104

    the shadow
    Member


    V8-60 with mid-plate (rear bell machined off) & In/Out box.

    Paul
     
  2. sideways27
    Joined: Jan 4, 2009
    Posts: 285

    sideways27
    Member

    Here are a few pictures of different throttle peddles. The first is a 1970 Edmunds copy midget, the second is a 1937 Hillagass Midget with a V8 60 and the third is a 1958 USAC Sprinter. When I restored this car I left the carved out 2x4 for the drivers heal. I thought this was a very primitive way to do this but effective. I also think the reason for the 2x4 was Bud Tinglestade drove the car in the late 50’s and early 60’s and the next driver was Bobby Black who was much taller and needed to raise his heal to make it more comfortable for his longer legs plus to keep his heal off the floor pan which would collect oil in the pan during a race and would slide around on the floor pan.
     

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  3. the shadow
    Joined: Mar 5, 2005
    Posts: 1,104

    the shadow
    Member

    thanks sideways, I think I will be able to come up with something by using those 3 for refferance.

    Paul
     
  4. Dr Dirt
    Joined: Oct 2, 2008
    Posts: 69

    Dr Dirt
    Member

    Full linkage and pedal mounting
     

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  5. 28dreyer
    Joined: Jan 23, 2008
    Posts: 1,128

    28dreyer
    Member
    from Minnesota

    Here's one constructed of light aluminum angles on the sides, a cross over piece under the ball of my foot with an aluminum curved toe strap arched over the top.

    The aluminum side angles each pivot around the belly pan former tube using a nylon tubing support clamp that captures the tube but does not tighten on the tube.
     

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  6. the shadow
    Joined: Mar 5, 2005
    Posts: 1,104

    the shadow
    Member

    Ok, I have to throw some paint on my midget, tired of looking at it as blasted steel. the original color of the body was a dark red almost maroon in color. I have no history on the car but though if I repainted it that color maybe someone would recognize it? my question is if the body was "marron/drak red" what do you think the chassis would have been?
    I want to put some primer & color on the frame rails,front & rear ends and I am drawing a blank as to a color. If you were me and knew the body was a deep red/maroon color what would you pain the frame?
    and before you ask, the frame was already media blasted before I got it. I thought of making the frame the same as the body but that would look like one big blob of color, what do you guys think, I value your in put. as stated in previous posts I just want it to look 1940'sh (period) no flashy metalic paint or chrome etc.
    one of you must have seen a car or two that was a dark red, what was the frame & suspension?
    Paul
     
  7. BZNEIL
    Joined: May 28, 2005
    Posts: 659

    BZNEIL
    Member

    I have see a few rail cars that were dark red/maroon with cream rails and axles. Always liked that combo. Thought I had a pic or two but can't find them.
     
  8. sideways27
    Joined: Jan 4, 2009
    Posts: 285

    sideways27
    Member

    I have came across a very rare set of midget photos from 1945 to 1950. Most were taken on the west coast and are URA Red and Blue. I received these from the origional photographer's collection. They have never been seen before. I would like to share these with other vintage midget racing fans but am worried about them being copied and sold on the internet. I own all the rights to these photos and the collection. I am going to post a couple of the photos to see how they come out as I am doing this in a low res pic.
    The first pic is from Gilmore 1949, #36 Eli Vukovich in the Ruiz Midget, #22 Pee Wee Distarce in his own car and #25 Dean Meltger in the A Krzuse midget.
    The second photo is the Fass Cars around 1946 with Walt Faulkner in the #16 not sure who is in the #15 car. Dick Atkins drove it on and off but I don't think it is him. Track is San Berdoo Ca.
     

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  9. trentesept
    Joined: Mar 15, 2008
    Posts: 120

    trentesept
    Member
    from Australia

    For Blackie Suede, Carrol, if you still need long drive pins there are some on e-XXX at the moment under "Halibrand" $30 for quite a few.
    Cheers Greg
     
  10. Blacki-Suede
    Joined: May 19, 2008
    Posts: 202

    Blacki-Suede
    Member

    Thanks, I saw those and will bid. Have some, but those look better than what I have. Thanks for thinking of me.

    Blacki-Suede

    ''Life's tough, pilgrim, and it's even tougher if you're stupid.''-- John Wayne<?xml:namespace prefix = "o" ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:eek:ffice:eek:ffice" /><o:p></o:p>
     
  11. memaerobilia
    Joined: Mar 24, 2004
    Posts: 191

    memaerobilia
    Member

    Was going through the files and wondering where/who has this LeGendre v8/60 midget, today? A 95% Original, that we restored to get a Senior, AACA, National First Prize at Hershey, back when...

    Just put the last two of our long run of 38 midget and sprint cars (in the 70s and 80s revival)in the HAMB classifieds. The end of an Era..Dad was building them since the 30's
     

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  12. memaerobilia
    Joined: Mar 24, 2004
    Posts: 191

    memaerobilia
    Member

    Well THAT seems odd? Not one post in this thread yesterday.:confused:

    I'll try to keep it moving with these two vintage shots of a couple midgets Dad built, "back in the Day," at Raceway Garage, in The Bronx, that addressed the cooling problems with V8/60 engines. There were lots of tricks to try to keep them from overheating. Most obvious way was LOTS! of air, with big open grilles.
     

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  13. tarcoleo
    Joined: Mar 28, 2013
    Posts: 36

    tarcoleo
    Member

    Hi everybody,

    This is my first post and glad to be here. I am wondering if anyone knows
    if there is any part of my Dad's original JAP-powered midget still in existence. Before he sold it in 1948, the car had been repowered with an Austin engine for use on public roads. Otherwise, at the time of sale, it looked just as seen here in the attached, albeit in fire-engine red.

    Through the Thirties, in racing form, it was driven by Bill Morrissey with considerable success in the East and in South America. It was driven to a
    championship in Argentina in 1938/39. Any information will be appreciated. Additional history can be provided to interested historians.

    Thomas F. Arcoleo, Jr.
     

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  14. TommyA19
    Joined: Dec 3, 2010
    Posts: 240

    TommyA19
    Member

    An example of what went on back here in the Northeast - June 1, 1948:

    1948:

    Bone Stadium, PA
    1st June 1948
    1 Bill Baker
    2 Vic Sloane
    3 Carl Miller
    Midget races

    Freeport Stadium, NY
    1st June 1948
    1 Dutch Schaefer
    2 Ted Tappett
    3 Johnny Zeke
    ARDC Midget races.

    Hinchliffe Stadium, NJ
    1st June 1948
    1 George Rice
    2 Bill Schindler
    3 Rex Records
    Midget races

    Princess Anne Speedway, VA
    1st June 1948
    1 Mike Jospehs
    2 Charlie Miller
    3 Shorty McAndrews
    ARDC Southern midget races.

    Rhinebeck Speedway, NY
    1st June 1948
    1 Tony Bonadies
    2 Stan Disbrow
    3 Larry Shurter
    ARDC Midget races.

    And, keep in mind, no Interstate highway system, either.
     
  15. the shadow
    Joined: Mar 5, 2005
    Posts: 1,104

    the shadow
    Member

    whats the deal with these guys posting midget models on ebay made by bob mccoy, yeah they're super nice & detailed but I don't see
    $10-$12,000.00! maybe thats why they are always listed on there either no one wants them or now one will pay that much?

    Paul
     
  16. lobuktruk
    Joined: Oct 2, 2007
    Posts: 75

    lobuktruk
    Member
    from Cayuga In.

    I'm looking at a couple of midgets I'm trying to buy. I've looked at them once and didn't see any markings on either one that would give me any clues so I'm going to the experts. In my opinion they both look like low budget racers and may not be anything special (except that they are 70 year old race cars that are still basically intact). They look like they have gone through a lot of changes in their time. The rail car looks pretty early as there is no headrest but it has a Crosley engine and maybe a Crosley rear end. It looks like a full size midget but I didn't have a tape measure to check the wheelbase. This thing is just begging for a V8-60. The tube frame car looks like a Studebaker 6cyl. I've always thought of tube frame cars as post war so correct me if I'm wrong. Any information would be appreciated.
     

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  17. 28dreyer
    Joined: Jan 23, 2008
    Posts: 1,128

    28dreyer
    Member
    from Minnesota

    The rail car is very likely a TQ midget unless it's wheelbase is 72" give or take a few. Crosley engine and 4 bolt rear wheel showing with only two bolts in it (but also drilled for 6 bolt midget pattern). It is not begging for a V8-60.

    The tube frame car could be a Studebaker. the picture showing the engine is not clear or near enough to tell but the intake and exhaust are on the proper side. The 6 cyl. (intake and) exhaust manifold laying in the forground of the picture appears to curve to the right which means it's a left side mount on the engine which means it's not a Studebaker, possibly a Continental 6.

    The majority of tube frame cars were post war emulating the Kurtis which was all tube post war (with the exception of four in process rails that were completed post war).

    However Kurtis was not the originator of the tube frame as Reichenbach, Marchese, Pete Neilsen and perhaps others built them in the mid and late 30's.
     
  18. 28dreyer
    Joined: Jan 23, 2008
    Posts: 1,128

    28dreyer
    Member
    from Minnesota

    Mentioning Reichenbach above, this past Tuesday I took these photos while visiting the owner and viewing this car for the first time.

    This is the Landy Scott Studebaker and the name plate is soldered to the left side of the radiator top tank.

    For the complete wonderful story on Landy and the car here is the link

    www.landyscott.com
     

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  19. gearguy
    Joined: Jan 27, 2010
    Posts: 286

    gearguy
    Member

    One of my long delayed projects is writing a magazine piece on Max Reichenbach. His son-in-law watches this thread occasionally. I've been unable to devote any time to researching Max, a mainstay of Chicagoland midget racing pre and post war. I met him only once;when buying a roll cage kit for our much crashed Hamburger-Chevy II way back in 1973.
    Please post any Max stories here or contact me via pm.
     
  20. lobuktruk
    Joined: Oct 2, 2007
    Posts: 75

    lobuktruk
    Member
    from Cayuga In.

    I looked at these again tonight, the rail car has about a 70" wheelbase, the inner width of the frame at the front was about 13" I don't know if that helps with thinking about engine options. The tube frame car is probably a Studebaker as the owner was a Studebaker collector. I do remember it being a 6cyl with 4 exhaust ports and it looks like the engine in your car.
     
  21. sideways27
    Joined: Jan 4, 2009
    Posts: 285

    sideways27
    Member

    <!--[if gte mso 9]><xml> <w:WordDocument> <w:View>Normal</w:View> <w:Zoom>0</w:Zoom> <w:punctuationKerning/> <w:ValidateAgainstSchemas/> <w:SaveIfXMLInvalid>false</w:SaveIfXMLInvalid> <w:IgnoreMixedContent>false</w:IgnoreMixedContent> <w:AlwaysShowPlaceholderText>false</w:AlwaysShowPlaceholderText> <w:Compatibility> <w:BreakWrappedTables/> <w:SnapToGridInCell/> <w:WrapTextWithPunct/> <w:UseAsianBreakRules/> <w:DontGrowAutofit/> </w:Compatibility> <w:BrowserLevel>MicrosoftInternetExplorer4</w:BrowserLevel> </w:WordDocument> </xml><![endif]--> Need to get this site going so I thought I would throw this out there. For all you racing historians, we all know that Frank Kurtis started his shop right after the war and his first midget suspension was quarter elliptical springs or if the buyer wanted he could order cross spring. What famous person convinced Frank Kurtis to try torsion bars? This made the Kurtis Kraft midget famous and changed midget racing forever. Some say for the good and some bad.
    <!--[if gte mso 9]><xml> <w:LatentStyles DefLockedState="false" LatentStyleCount="156"> </w:LatentStyles> </xml><![endif]--><!--[if gte mso 10]> <style> /* Style Definitions */ table.MsoNormalTable {mso-style-name:"Table Normal"; mso-tstyle-rowband-size:0; mso-tstyle-colband-size:0; mso-style-noshow:yes; mso-style-parent:""; mso-padding-alt:0in 5.4pt 0in 5.4pt; mso-para-margin:0in; mso-para-margin-bottom:.0001pt; mso-pagination:widow-orphan; font-size:10.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman"; mso-ansi-language:#0400; mso-fareast-language:#0400; mso-bidi-language:#0400;} </style> <![endif]-->
     
  22. I can't answer your question, but I can tell you this was the first 4 bar Kurtis midget. My Dad's V8-60 was chassis #120. It worked great on asphalt, but not as good as a cross spring front/torsion bar rear chassis. So, after running the car for a month, Dad had Frank remove the front bars, and add a perch for a cross spring. If you look at the front end today, you will see the bar mounts are still on the frame.

    [​IMG]
     
  23. sideways27
    Joined: Jan 4, 2009
    Posts: 285

    sideways27
    Member

    I do know about your dads cars and one of which he purchased in 1947 but the answer to the question will surprise you if no one gets it. The first 4 bar was ordered by this person in 1945 before the first 10 KK cars were built. And I know you know Roy Russing received his car around March of 1946.





     
  24. Dr Dirt
    Joined: Oct 2, 2008
    Posts: 69

    Dr Dirt
    Member

    Kurtisinthebushes2.jpg

    chassis.JPG

    chassis1.JPG

    # close up.JPG OK so after trying for 15yrs to get this chassis I was able to pick it up 2 weeks ago. In bill's book it is under chassis numbers unknown. I was allways told it was east coast car that harry got a good deal on because the guy that ordered it backed out. It was a 4 bar car without front spring mtg and had a rounded dash hoop and a different hood. It stayed a 4bar car the whole time Pop drove it.And Pops did pretty good in it on dirt and pavement. When I picked it up Tom said he thought it was a shalila because of the rounded dash and other shalila hardware on it.Which would be normal for hardware replaced in the late 50s and 60s.
    Tom said the car came with a front spring mtg so he added his own bar mounts in front, we turned the chassis over and you could see where the front mounts had been torched off. Tom cut the dash hoop for a different style hood.

    So another Kurtis Kraft chassis found and it's number 38 built in 1946
     
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2013
  25. Dr Dirt
    Joined: Oct 2, 2008
    Posts: 69

    Dr Dirt
    Member

    107.jpg

    shilling.jpg The rest of the story
     
  26. ...better than finding treasure.... ;)
     
  27. sideways27
    Joined: Jan 4, 2009
    Posts: 285

    sideways27
    Member

  28. sideways27
    Joined: Jan 4, 2009
    Posts: 285

    sideways27
    Member

    As no one has answered the question regarding the Kurtis 4 bar question well here it goes. The first person that ordered a 4 bar car was none other than Rex Mays. He called Frank Kurtis in 1945 when he found out Frank was starting to build his cars. This was before the first car was built for Roy Russing. Rex got the idea from the Mercedes-Benz and Auto Union cars at Indy. This information and pictures of the car are the book "Pole Position Rex Mays" by Bob Schilling on pages 329 and 330. I showed this to Arlen Kurtis and he remembered his dad telling him the same story. I thought this was very interesting and wanted to share with you guys.
     
  29. racinfool
    Joined: Mar 19, 2008
    Posts: 190

    racinfool
    Member
    from Indy

    I have a Vintage flat top midget tank I'm selling, Located in Indy 'Brownsburg area. Great resto piece $400 Tom (315)403-4139
     

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    Last edited: Jun 24, 2013
  30. sideways27
    Joined: Jan 4, 2009
    Posts: 285

    sideways27
    Member

    It's that time of year once again. You are invited to Isky's 93 Birthday party. If you have not been to this yearly event you are missing out on a great one. Last year I was told there were over 800 attendees over the 3 day event. Lots of race cars and show cars along with many famous racing people. There is lot's of bench racing and tours of LTC engine shop. There will also be food and beverages served. Hope to see some of you there like last year I met some of you that are on here. The main date is Saturday Aug, 17th 2013. If you are bringing a race car, hot rod or want to spend the night please let me know in advance so I can reserve a spot.
     

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