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Projects Timm builds a model A

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Tim, Mar 8, 2016.

  1. Tim
    Joined: Mar 2, 2001
    Posts: 8,112

    Tim
    Member
    from Raytown Mo

    image.jpeg
    Well with our 46' nearing completion, my extra funds exhausted I've decided to do what any red blooded hot rodder would do.

    Build another car haha.

    So what are we doing here? Well basically this will be a no dead line slowish build as I try to spend more time than money. Using it as an excuse to visit friends, learn something new and take road trips for cheap parts.

    It is also a way to keep me from driving my wife up the wall. If I havnt got a project to keep me focused I can be a bit much to be around. By spending more time than money I'm hoping to turn any simple task into a small project in itself.

    Gues that was a fair bit of text, add a photo now? Sure why not
    image.jpeg

    So as seen above Sarah really digs full fendered model A sedans. I vastly prefere the early ones and as the first images that pop into my head when I hear "full fenders and a hood" are tagged with Early Times cc I wasn't to hard to talk into that set up.

    So we will be building a 28/9 sedan with full fenders and a hood. Nose down and full of additude it won't quite be period correct to the early Pete and Jakes stuff I love so much or period correct to the late 40's stuff I drool over either.

    But it will be cool :)

    Here's a friends car that gives a good bit of inspiration.
    image.jpeg

    Alright, well I suppose that's a good enough first post! I'll be updating as I find a minute here or there and try to get everyone up to speed and give you a look at the plan :)
     
    3340, quick85, mctim64 and 2 others like this.
  2. barrnone50
    Joined: Oct 24, 2010
    Posts: 427

    barrnone50
    Member
    from texas

    You better hold on that Gal !! She likes Hot Rods!! Back to business what are you going to do with your new ride?
     
    hounddogjake likes this.
  3. Tim
    Joined: Mar 2, 2001
    Posts: 8,112

    Tim
    Member
    from Raytown Mo

    Well as all good things go I wanted to take it slow and carefully pick my parts. I had figured that if I had a strong plan in place I wouldn't be wasting money on parts I didn't need.

    But you know, things snow ball sometimes....

    The first thing we aquired were these seats.... That I apparently don't have a photo of on my phone.

    They are the stock seats front and back from @porknbeaner 's project model A. I really like the stock seats in just about everything so when he said he was ditching them for something a little less crusty I was quick to offer them a new home.

    image.jpeg

    Not long after Beaner and I road tripped for a couple hours for some
    Model A stuff, got a pretty good haul from a great Hamber who's name escapes me right now. Either way we didn't get his truck stuck in a gully and made it home with more stuff than We left with :)
     
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  4. Tim
    Joined: Mar 2, 2001
    Posts: 8,112

    Tim
    Member
    from Raytown Mo

    Then A great friend found me this!

    image.jpeg
    It's more complete than this but it's the best photo I've got on hand, I think all it's missing is the door caps. I think that's what they are called? The bit of roof above the doors. I think I've got a pair sourced in Texas but he's busy building a roadster so I'll let him do that until I actualy need them :)
     
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  5. I'm diggin' it!
     
    Tim likes this.
  6. Atwater Mike
    Joined: May 31, 2002
    Posts: 8,274

    Atwater Mike
    Member

    Reminds me of the first HRM feature on Chrisman's Model A sedan: "Torrid '29 Tudor!"
    At which time I took a hot needle to my 1/32 scale Revell Highway Pioneer Center Door 'T', removing hood, chopping/reshaping top, and adding '32 'Hot Rod' roadster big-n-littles, flathead V8 w/front and rear axles, Oh that '29 Tudor!
    Gave me a case of 'Sedan Fever'!
     
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  7. Tim
    Joined: Mar 2, 2001
    Posts: 8,112

    Tim
    Member
    from Raytown Mo

    Thanks Bret, it's currently a bunch of parts in a bunch of piles in a few different places but someday I hope for it to be one one in one place. A guys gotta have goals ;)
    image.jpeg

    More inspiration pics ;)
     
  8. Your buddy's sedan nails the stance, and I dig his wheel/tire choice. The Flatty is a BONUS! Thanks for bucking the current trend and having the vision to build a fendered A sedan!
     
    Tim likes this.
  9. cool30-31.jpg
    While this is a 30-31, and my pref is the 28-29's, this guy nailed the look I'd be going for if I were building an A sedan.
     
    juan motime, BradinNC, n847 and 4 others like this.
  10. and one more for morning inspiration. speed-week-2009-143.jpg
     
  11. porknbeaner
    Joined: Sep 12, 2003
    Posts: 40,135

    porknbeaner
    Member

    I think that Tim is actually running wheels that look like these on his heap.
    wheel.jpg

    There is actually an entire thread now dedicated to full fender cars:

    http://jalopyjournal.com/forum/threads/full-fendered-forever.1011112/

    Just in case anyone needs a little inspiration. ;)
     
    n847 and bchrismer like this.
  12. Beaner, I totally forgot that is what Timm told me a while back. I'd probably run '40 wheels, because I have a plethora of them. LOL
     
  13. porknbeaner
    Joined: Sep 12, 2003
    Posts: 40,135

    porknbeaner
    Member

    I like '40 wheels. But I am more of a steel wheel sort anyway.
    Tim's build really needs the wires at least the picture in my head when he talks to me about it sees it with wires. ;)
     
  14. belair
    Joined: Jul 10, 2006
    Posts: 7,433

    belair
    Member
    1. H.A.M.B. Chapel

    I think fenders are back. I have an A coupe that I have waited two years to start on, was gonna buck the trend and go with fenders. By the time I get it done, fenders will be out of style again. But who cares. Im going for an early to mid 60s drag vibe with mine. Good luck with yours.
     
    bchrismer and Tim like this.
  15. Tim
    Joined: Mar 2, 2001
    Posts: 8,112

    Tim
    Member
    from Raytown Mo

    Dang Bret you hit it! image.jpeg That's getting pretty close! I've got to do some house work but I suppose I can give you guys the quick run down of the build plan while I'm here.

    ~while I do have specific years listed things are always subject to change, obviously~

    •28/9 Tudor
    •Full stock hood and fenders*
    •Un plated grill
    •No stock bumpers, possibly some nerfs that boarder on little push bars.
    •no chop
    •Stock seats
    •32 dash full of black faced sw gauges
    •Roof insert done in more of a 32 style not wrapped to the rain gutters as stock would be
    •dropped head light bar, lights to be decided after mock up. Only think I'm set on is no lights with the little ones on top
    •35 wire wheels, I'll be running a combination that should allow me to swap out some 40's should I want or need to
    •500/750 fire stones. Black walls
    •32 or is it 34 ford 4 cylinder center caps
    •un boxed A frame with 37 ish X member
    •dropped and narrowed A axle
    •square back spindles
    •f-1/f-100 front brakes
    •vega cross steer box mounted so it's not that noticeable
    •late wishbone un split bit modified to fit my chassis
    •open rear axle with ladder bars locating towards the tail shaft
    • model A springs front and back with leaves pulled and eyes reversed
    •tube shocks
    •hot 4 cylinder and manual trans
    •not sure on gas tank placement, thought about the rear like a 32 but I think with that space open the car doesn't feel so heavy, see the primer sedan I posted the rest shot of. ~ as a side note that's the car that sold me on not chopping it. With that chop and rubber rake all I can see out of the windshield is the hood lol. With as hard as I like to hit the curvey roads I don't like the idea of saddle tanks either. Oh well enough ramble.
    •some sort of emerald/jade green body. Sea foam accent color on the pin striping. Talking about the wheels being that color also but I'm not
    Sold on it. Maybe black wheels with a sea foam Pinstriping on the lip and the stamped logo? Black running boards, black roof insert, glossy stained wood floors.
    •4 spoke bell steering wheel
    •some sort of tail light arrangement with the stock lamps
    •dual fender mount spares, one of each size. Sarah says the rear mount spares look to much like a jeep lol

    So that's the jist so far :)

    *still need all fender irons, splash aprons,running boards and that weird frame horn cover in front.
     
  16. Tim
    Joined: Mar 2, 2001
    Posts: 8,112

    Tim
    Member
    from Raytown Mo

    I think the only way I could do the lighter color wheel is if we did black fenders. But that's been a back and forth conversation, this is really a car for Sarah to drive so she's the one who's gotta be happy being seen it in.

    Here are some shots Travis/ royboyproductions took at Detroit that show the general idea of the colors for paint image.jpeg
     
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  17. Tim
    Joined: Mar 2, 2001
    Posts: 8,112

    Tim
    Member
    from Raytown Mo

    image.jpeg
    I forget his name but a Hamber posted his "test and tune" of suspension tweaks with great comparison side shots to go along with it. With this info I should up sitting close to his car in this photo, however the rear should be a little taller as his tire set up is... I want to say 700/500 and I'm going 750/500. I believe 750/500 is what David is running on his primer sedan up there @flatout51 care to correct me if I'm wrong?
     
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  18. porknbeaner
    Joined: Sep 12, 2003
    Posts: 40,135

    porknbeaner
    Member

    LOL you know where black fenders came from right?

    The old colored lacquer was bad to fade, red was the worse. you could pant one panel today and another tomorrow and they would not match. :eek: Anyway black fenders were easier to match when you crunched one. ;)

    Here is one thing to think about the good Doctor is a lot like me only pretty (pretty being the operative word here) well maybe a little less jaded but give her time ;). Sooo if I like it she will probably like it too. :D :D :D

    Hey is your cowl top solid? If it looks like a leaker lets trade. That way if you decide to go suicide tank you'll be set.
     
  19. I'm liking the plan!!! This 4cyl gonna be a banger, or are you thinking something like a hopped up Pinto 4 cylinder?
     
  20. Tim
    Joined: Mar 2, 2001
    Posts: 8,112

    Tim
    Member
    from Raytown Mo

    Suicide tank (TM)
     
  21. Tim
    Joined: Mar 2, 2001
    Posts: 8,112

    Tim
    Member
    from Raytown Mo

    Well, it'll have a cross flow head and valves that point down not up but that's about all I've got to say right now ;)
     
    bchrismer likes this.
  22. porknbeaner
    Joined: Sep 12, 2003
    Posts: 40,135

    porknbeaner
    Member

    I am trying to talk him into an S-10 ( same architecture as a Nova) motor. But that is only because I don't know where there is a wrecked Alpha Veloce. :D
     
  23. Tim
    Joined: Mar 2, 2001
    Posts: 8,112

    Tim
    Member
    from Raytown Mo

    Alright so this is about to get pretty boring pretty quick. By I have to say it felt pretty rewarding.
    image.jpeg

    So the first piece I've started messing with are the leaf springs, while I realize that every car is different and all springs have settled different I thought I'd start where the above mentioned car is at.
    image.jpeg

    After I got got the clamps and what remained of the shackles off the packs I noticed something the eye eye'd of you may have notice.

    That front pack is huge!

    Well a little searching and it looks like my 13 leaf pack is from an AA chassis and isn't that common.

    image.jpeg

    Thankfully the three extra leaves are pretty obvious as they are just doubled up leaves compared to special "rare" length items. Either way it was about to lose a bunch of them.


    image.jpeg

    All clamped down and all thread at the ready I cut the head of the nub of a bolt and ripped the end off with Pliers.

    image.jpeg

    A can of borrowed liquid wrench, thanks Beaner ;) , and a half hour of heavy hammering and it wasn't budging.
     
  24. Tim
    Joined: Mar 2, 2001
    Posts: 8,112

    Tim
    Member
    from Raytown Mo

    Well it was time for plan B
    image.jpeg

    I added a set of clamps so that the inner set was only holding the top 3 leaves, situated the pack so it would "spring" away from me and shut the radio off.

    At this point it's worth pointing out I've never done this before. I have no idea how much energy is stored in this spring and I'm sure it varies.

    With the radio off I eased the clamps off a quarter turn or less each work side to side. You can hear them groan so I basically stoped at a quarter turn or when it made noise. Which ever happens first.

    Working back and forth you could feel the load shift from side to side ~ to be continued
     
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  25. belair
    Joined: Jul 10, 2006
    Posts: 7,433

    belair
    Member
    1. H.A.M.B. Chapel

    Eek. Coil springs scare me for good reason. Be careful.
     
  26. Tim
    Joined: Mar 2, 2001
    Posts: 8,112

    Tim
    Member
    from Raytown Mo

    ~yeah, I did it on a day that someone was home to hear me scream, I knew it wasn't the best plan, but it was a plan. Anyhow....

    So where was I, ok so taking the first three leafs off. I was really expecting a pop or something dramatic but I basically let the clamps out about 2 or so inches and they were limp on the stud.
    image.jpeg

    Here's a good view of both how I continued to clamp so I was only lossening two or three leaves at a time and all the oil it took to get them lose. Those fuckers were on there damn good. Oh and you can see how to extra leaves were just duplicates

    image.jpeg

    Getting toward the end of the pack you begin to see how in even the tension is. One leaf would move a half inch and the one next to it you'd have to hit with a hammer to break lose of the pack.

    It took about an hour and was pretty filthy but I got it done with no scares. The centering pin was pretty distorted so not only was it not going to come
    Out to replace with all thread but the leaves took 5-10 minutes each to remove from the stud.
    image.jpeg

    Some I actualy had to drive off with a wood block and dead blow.

    In the end this is how many leaves I will have removed from the pack. The top set is the extras, the bottom three are every other from the top*

    image.jpeg

    * so this might need explained. When I read how the side shot I posted got to that height he listed that he had a 5 leaf set up front and back and had removed 3 leafs before reversing the eyes.

    Well a stock pack front and back have 10. So he's counting 5 leaves between the little top leaf and the main. So with it all together you pull - counting all of the leafs and starting from the top- leaf 2,4,6

    I found zero broken or gouged pieces so I will radius the ends, sand blast them and reverse the eyes on the main before painting and re assembling which I will also take to many photos of ;)
     
  27. Tim
    Joined: Mar 2, 2001
    Posts: 8,112

    Tim
    Member
    from Raytown Mo

    Alright so same drill on the back, I did fewer leafs at a time as they were staggard differently than the front so it allowed me to.

    I also thought that the rear may hold more tension so fewer leafs would be better to deal with.

    They did but not by much, I noticed the most movement in the longer leafs just before the main. image.jpeg

    I had a good idea that this one would be stubborn so I hosed it down with penetrating oil hoping with would unlock the leafs from each other and went to talk to my chattiest neighbor figuring that would give it time to soak.
    image.jpeg
    This was about as eventful as it got with the back, the main and additional two Leaves above it have pretty gnarly gouges in them. This had to ride like shit lol.

    image.jpeg
    The main also has this ding on the eye. It seems to have kept round on the inside but between the deep gouges and that I think I'm going to see if Beaners rear spring pack has better ones before I try to clean these ones up.

    He's not going to use them on his build, he's only got one arm and his dog likes me. Long as I can get them out before he gets to that 12 gauge I should be fine ;)

    image.jpeg

    I also pulled 2/4/6 out of this pack just like the front.

    And with out posting more redundant photos that's basically where I'm at right now. Just collecting parts and ideas while I work on little stuff like this in the mornings.

    It's not at all a priority so weekend morning if I have time go to the A and weekends and nights go to the 46
     
    kidcampbell71 likes this.
  28. Tim
    Joined: Mar 2, 2001
    Posts: 8,112

    Tim
    Member
    from Raytown Mo

    * I'd like to add at this point if you can get the stud out that you damn well better put some all thread threw the hole and put some nuts on it to help you keep it all together and much safer coming apart.

    If I had done this with no mushroomed and distorted pin going threw all the leafs it may have gone very different. I'm not advising this as the best way to do it it's just the safest way to do what I needed done with what I had.
     
  29. Mr48chev
    Joined: Dec 28, 2007
    Posts: 23,015

    Mr48chev
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Boy howdy that spring has done some work in it's time to have grooves like that worn into the leaves. make sure you spend some time getting rid of the grooves on the leaves you use.
    It sounds like your build is going to run on along the same lines as I have planned for my 31 Victoria that I am gathering parts for one at a time. Timeless car but not totally set in one rod building era build wise.
     
    Tim likes this.

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