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Quarter eliptic rear

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by willowbilly3, Aug 11, 2012.

  1. willowbilly3
    Joined: Jun 18, 2004
    Posts: 4,356

    willowbilly3
    Member Emeritus
    from Sturgis

    Few, if any, of you probably remember a few years ago when I posted (better) pictures of my rear suspension when I first designed it. It is a triangulated 4 bar of sorts but the lower links are actually the quarter elliptic springs. Well, the car is finally getting almost done and I drove it a few days ago. I am pleased to say the rear suspension seems to behave very well on the first shake down. I did end up putting a little stiffer springs in after the dirst run but more because the back of the car sat about an inch low for my liking.

    [​IMG]
     
  2. Ruggie
    Joined: Sep 23, 2011
    Posts: 131

    Ruggie
    Member

    Got any more pics of this setup?
     
  3. shotrod
    Joined: May 14, 2005
    Posts: 90

    shotrod
    Member

    they ride good,i'm very pleased with mine and its set up pretty much like yours
     
  4. willowbilly3
    Joined: Jun 18, 2004
    Posts: 4,356

    willowbilly3
    Member Emeritus
    from Sturgis

    I did have but I can't seem to find them. Where the springs bolt in is actually the end of the 3x3 frame tube. I just made a plate with threaded holes and a hole for the center bolt. Then bolt up through the bottom of the frame to sandwich in the springs. The widest spring I can get in there is 1 3/4". It took a little snooping to find. I started out which cheap tractor supply trailer springs but when I decided to stretch the wheelbase a little they were too short so I used front leafs from a 47 Ford pickup. Then yesterday when I wanted it stiffer, I just changed out the other 2 leafs for ones from the back of a 39 International which are about .040 thicker each. Top links were made from a tie rod I pirated from a Massey combine.
    One thing that I can smile about now is how many people on this board told me it wouldn't work and only a couple members were positive. At that time nobody seemed to have seen it done. Even I wasn't sure it wouldn't wrap the springs and wheel hop. I haven't tried any hard launches yet but I did goose it hard coming out of a corner in second and kick the ass end out, let off the gas and it squared right up, no wheel hop or other negative behavior..
     
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  5. Looks good,,,sorta' like a Spridget rear,,,,
     
  6. JEM
    Joined: Feb 6, 2007
    Posts: 1,041

    JEM
    Member

    Actually looking at doing something a *little* like this, a pair of floating cantilever springs as lower links for a torque-arm setup with a Watts for lateral location.
     
  7. This is what I am thinking of doing, thanks for posting

    Brad
     
  8. Tim
    Joined: Mar 2, 2001
    Posts: 10,600

    Tim
    Member
    from Raytown Mo

    Cool, I'm pretty sure that's the same style of rear suspension that Malcolm is running in his roadster that he's been running the wheels off of. There are pix on his thread if anyone is looking for more pix of this style of set up
     
  9. willowbilly3
    Joined: Jun 18, 2004
    Posts: 4,356

    willowbilly3
    Member Emeritus
    from Sturgis

    I'd like to see those, got a link?
     
  10. Tim
    Joined: Mar 2, 2001
    Posts: 10,600

    Tim
    Member
    from Raytown Mo

  11. dickster27
    Joined: Feb 28, 2004
    Posts: 3,097

    dickster27
    Member
    from Texas

    A few years back I had a '32 3W that had a Dave Gale chassis under it with both rear and front quarter elliptical suspension. Unlike yours though, mine had straight top rods and a panhard bar. Of all the hot rods I have owned that one rode without a doubt the smoothest. I never had any issues "launching" it. Drove it for over 4 years without a hiccup.
     
  12. willowbilly3
    Joined: Jun 18, 2004
    Posts: 4,356

    willowbilly3
    Member Emeritus
    from Sturgis

    How does yours drive out? I haven't had mine very far yet since I don't have a serial number yet. But so far I like it. I designed mine with the lower tabs as short as possible because I was worried about the spring wrap on acceleration and wheel hop.
    Very nice work btw, in a whole different league than mine.
     
  13. Six Ball
    Joined: Oct 8, 2007
    Posts: 3,014

    Six Ball
    Member
    from Nevada

    Willowbilly3, have you had a chance to drive it more? That is how I'd like to set up the rear of my '26 Chevy roadster. I'm using the stock Chevy style front end.
     
  14. falcongeorge
    Joined: Aug 26, 2010
    Posts: 18,341

    falcongeorge
    Member
    from BC

    So no shackles at the mounting points on the rear-end housing, right? Same basic idea as I am planning on, but the torque tube will serve as the third link. We discussed this off-forum, a while back.
    I was greeted by a bunch of naysayers and predictors of doom as well. On the other hand, i ran it by my old man, mechanical engineer by vocation, long-time road-racer by avocation. he loved it, thought it was slicker than gooseshit. Which is what I thought...
     
  15. charlesf
    Joined: Jan 14, 2009
    Posts: 142

    charlesf
    Member

    My under construction modified will use quad quarter eliptics, a la Miller Indy cars. The Millers used over and under quarter eliptics front and rear, check out the Miller V 16 in particular. We'll see how it works in practice.
     
  16. wsdad
    Joined: Dec 31, 2005
    Posts: 1,252

    wsdad
    Member

    Congratulations!
     
  17. 32coupedeville
    Joined: Dec 10, 2006
    Posts: 1,253

    32coupedeville
    Member
    from cincy

    i have done tow cars this way . they ride great!
     
  18. willowbilly3
    Joined: Jun 18, 2004
    Posts: 4,356

    willowbilly3
    Member Emeritus
    from Sturgis

    I've got a couple hundred miles on it and no complaints at all. It launches straight, hooks up great and rides real nice. I haven't did any canyon bending with it yet, kinda want to work my way into that and keep an eye on everything to check for fatigue, loose bolts or what ever. I've only had it through the gears all the way to fifth real hard once due to some death wobble in the front that has cropped up a couple times and makes me a little nervous.
    The one thing I was most concerned about was spring wrap and wheel hop but it hasn't given the slightest hint of that. I kept the spring eyes real close to the axle to minimize the leverage the axle wrap would put on the springs, seems to have been the right geometry (so far).
     
  19. Six Ball
    Joined: Oct 8, 2007
    Posts: 3,014

    Six Ball
    Member
    from Nevada

    Thanks for the up date. I'm trying to get the shop and parts ready to start my roadster. I had hoped to have a roller by spring or early summer. As always other stuff happens. Your design will serve me just fine.
     
  20. fossilfish
    Joined: Dec 16, 2010
    Posts: 320

    fossilfish
    Member
    from Texas

  21. willowbilly3
    Joined: Jun 18, 2004
    Posts: 4,356

    willowbilly3
    Member Emeritus
    from Sturgis

    Not sure if it's the right thing but I chose to have the wider end of the triangulation on the axle rather than the frame. I figured the upper mountings on the axle would take a lot less abuse fore and aft if the mounting point was closer to the wheel, if that makes any sense.
     
  22. Six Ball
    Joined: Oct 8, 2007
    Posts: 3,014

    Six Ball
    Member
    from Nevada

    It does make sense to me. It would seem to give them more leverage to manage both the side and twisting movement. It would probably work the other way too but it wouldn't look like it would work.:eek:
     
  23. seb fontana
    Joined: Sep 1, 2005
    Posts: 6,193

    seb fontana
    Member
    from ct

    The triangle upper link will work about the same in either position..However there is a roll center created at the single point created when the upper arms are extended to meet which imparts more sideways flexing to the springs which acts/results in the spring also functioning as a sway bar [only] because the front of the spring is solid mounted..Not necessarilly a bad thing...
     
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2013
  24. topfuel55
    Joined: Apr 18, 2010
    Posts: 145

    topfuel55
    Member
    from Hebron IN

    I run a quarter elliptic car. I got ‘em on both ends. The fronts are trailer springs from TSC the rears are from who knows what, I got them out of a pile in the scrap yard. Don’t believe the nay Sayers mine rides like a Caddy. My buddy who helped with the build was not impressed with the suspension until we got back from the first Cruz night. He said “I take my hat off to you sir that thing rides way better than I ever thought”. My set up runs a third link or torque arm . The springs mount quite a bit lower than the centerline of the axle but the torque arm’s lower link is in line with the lower spring mounts. The front of the springs are captured in a box that allows for ride height adjustment. The front of the torque arm is a tie rod end hooked to a shackle that allows the axle to swing thru a different arc than the long torque arm . So far so good drives straight turns in well and burns the tires with no hop. I don’t have to many miles on her yet, being we got her done just in time to put up for the winter. The front got new king pins to calm down a death wobble problem , that is made worse by having Bike tires on the front, that’s gonna change also. Good luck with your set up and laugh in the face of the naysayer.
     
  25. topfuel55
    Joined: Apr 18, 2010
    Posts: 145

    topfuel55
    Member
    from Hebron IN

    My Pics seemed to have fallen off
     

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  26. fossilfish
    Joined: Dec 16, 2010
    Posts: 320

    fossilfish
    Member
    from Texas

    I race a quarter elliptic car..on the rear. 1959 bugeye road racing, works great. Love the feel and yes the springs and the upper links ..on the bugeye do act as a sway bar. If done right the quarter elliptic stuff puts all the mass of the rear suspension in front of the rear axle..lower polar moment of enertia. Moving the upper link front mounting point up or down can have a very positive affect on traction and weight transfer.
    Bobby Knighton here in Houston use quarter elliptic rear springs on his yellow 32 coupe that was very hard to beat for many years in the altered class.
     
  27. willowbilly3
    Joined: Jun 18, 2004
    Posts: 4,356

    willowbilly3
    Member Emeritus
    from Sturgis

    It was my thought from study diagrams of both designs that with the upper control arms located on top center of the rear end housing there would be more torsional loading/flex on the mounts, probably a moot point if they are strong enough.
     

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