Projects Modified Lakester Build (THUNDERCASKET)

I ACTUALLY DO HAVE A FLAG FOR THAT!

The wheel well issue is on my mind too but I had plans to fill them or run exhaust tips up there if it doesn't line up right. If I can't get it where I'm happy with it once the chassis is set up, Plan B is to pull the center panels on the touring body and put the rear quarters behind the doors like this scabbed together POS from post #141 OR Plan C, just the front part of the touring (like most folks do).

 

I like where you are coming from, and where you going.

Just to be clear, do you want the doors to work or is they to just to good to not use? Because if you run the doors I would make them longer and run a long tub, with the tank inside the tub. And put it on top of the rails.

The only other option I see is running it as a bare shell with no doors and a body you step in to, and then I would channel it over the frame.

And when you have decided you can start on the frame. Because it also defines how your rear end shall be set up.
You could go the other way around and set your full frame up with the right wheelbase and modify everything on the basic frame, but leave out everything that sits on the outside of the frame, like tank mounts and body mounts and do that afterwards.


But then you should be able to do a damn good frame set up, and do you thinking in the shower regarding the body and keep your head on frame when working.

And remember to use the BELCOM method! It's very important on a car with so few pieces, that every flows well together!

And hole in non structural items is a most and don't use to mush do-da, because it goes against the look of a modified.
But you seems to know your stuff, so keep at it, lad.

 

I'm going to run the front doors, not the back doors this time, either way I build it, I think. There is an opportunity there to make LONG doors, but that's getting more into 60's show rod territory which I'm not going for this time (but probably will on another car). If I decide it needs it when I'm set down on the chassis as it needs to be, and if I have time, I may channel it.

here's a sketch I did a while back to study taking advantage of the wheel wells for exhaust:



Just placed the order for a set of those C channel boxing plates because I'll need them tacked into the back rails to keep them in line with the planned pie cut kick up.

Yes, Much BELCOM going on. There are grease stains on my lawn chair now.

 

I like the sketch ( get rid of the mufflers; flatheads sound perfect running WIDE OPEN). Big thing is to not OVER think some of this ( " Pork and Beaner" mentioned this). Mock everything up with clamps and tack welds because it can be a real juggling act getting everything ( pedals, steering, exhaust) in a narrow "A" frame. The wheelbase will kind of figure itself out once you've got it all lined up. They're tight from the get-go , and occasionally you have to "rob Peter to pay Paul" to squeeze all the good stuff in. If you're going to keep it , make sure the steering position is comfy , and that you can work the clutch without having your knees up around your ears! This is one I made out of junk a couple of years ago- Model "A" cowel, '33 P.U. back panel from a doodlebug my neighbor was trashing, flat sheetmetal "doors" (fake) , etc. Keep it simple , have fun , and build it for safety and reliability. No frills! It's a hot rod! Good luck! You're being watched!!

 

Steering wheel is a good point. The way that our columns usually end up a big wheel either gets us in the belly or gets our knuckles into the side of the car or both.

 

All I've got right now for steering is an A box with a crispy wheel and an 18" truck wheel (knuckle scraper).

I'd like to run a F1 box but have not found one locally yet. I DO have a couple 40 steering boxes if I decide to go over to cross steering though.

@mike bowling did you lengthen that frame in the pix?

 

You could slide the body out over the rear, line the wheelwell up with the the wheel. Line the cowl up with the engine, and make the door fit the gap. That could be a nice body and a little different. And you could run a Chevy AD truck tank inside the body. And run a tonneau cover on top.

But can only be done, if the frame is done forehand. But it should be possible to do a frame that lands between 100-103 inch.

But do you plan to run the 39 box or the Lasalle box?

 

LOL I have always been a fan of smaller wheels and cal custom is always my go to wheel. That doesn't really fit with a tub unless you are building s show rod or a '60s dragster and I don't think it would look as good as some sort of a stockish wheel anyway.

I have a volvo box converted to cowl steer here that I eventually use. I like an F100 box over an F 1 box personally but that is just because that is what I came up with I think. The F100 box was the hot setup when I was a kid.

 

Yeah, @porknbeaner I passed on a F100 box recently that @Mikel50 ended up snagging. It felt really nice but at the moment I wasn't all in on the idea but it'was and still is an option.

@volvobrynk I've got a couple tanks that are in the running. That red button on the back in the sketch represents one I have that looks like an old tractor tank that I'd mount like a spare tire. If I need to go inside, I have another tractor tank that would probably work.

Running a tonneau is on the agenda with either length body configuration if I use the rear touring quarters. Either way that makes a much roomier cab and I don't want to be scooping air, I want to be deflecting it. If I go the long body route I'll probably do it in Aluminum or 20/24ga steel. I'm going to mock that up in paperboard when I start fiddling with it and have a better idea of seating in mind.

 

The ol man always ran a tonneau on his roadsters. They all had a zipper in the middle and if he was alone in the car his was the only spot open. he never ran a roof that I recall and we lived in the San Francisco bay area. So not only chilly but foggy and rainy. On an open car I think that they are just a good idea.

 

I always liked the look of Pete Flaven's Modified. (I know it is an A)
I don't know if this helps.

 

Okay that is such a cool little modified! Is that a Chevy/Jimmy six, in a model A frame, with a 32 grill in front, featuring a very short non touring body with no doors and interior wrapped over the top edge.
There are a lot of nice features: steering wheel, positioning of steering wheel, collum, Model A dash and split windshield.

Please tell me that is a three pedal rod!

 

235 Iron Power Glide.

Pete sold it I think.

 

Watching this with interest. I found a pretty good Hudson cowl with id plate and gauges, I need to do something with. So many projects and so little time and money.

 

Hey Patmanta, I like the car but I think the easiest way to get that modified wheelbase & body is to go to an open driveline. A T5 with a modern rearend & a custom length driveshaft wouldn't be bad.
If you do want the old-school driveline because its what you want & its what you have then you may just have to build a fullsize car. It can be done with a reasonable wheelbase. Mines like 109" WITH the big 300 straight six. Either way, good luck & I'm rooting for you.

 

Find a straight frame that looks cool and nobody wants and make a 3-springer! Then find or make some other pieces for a bucket like @mike bowling did up in post #154. Use it as a "break" project when you're frustrated with whatever your main build is.

@chessterd5 I've gone off the original build. This is really a new build entirely but I haven't given it its own thread. I still plan to do the big six build but I'm doing this flathead closed drive build first. I've got the 6, 3.03, vette shaft, and F1 open drive banjo all ready to fit in another A frame at a 113" -ish WB when I get back to it. I just got tired driving myself crazy with the motor mounts on that one and I wanted to try to build something I might have a chance at entering into TROG. The big 6 is another idea alltogether.

 

Sorry , Pat, I didn't see that question about the frame length on the clunker I posted pics of- it wasn't lengthened, it was cut on a 45* angle and "stacked" so it kept the STOCK wheelbase.( easier to work with, and I don't need to reinvent the wheel!) That frame is now living under my coupe. The "Flaven & Flaven" roadster build is done the same way , I believe.

 

Thanks! Yeah I'm leaning towards that as the way to go. Since I'm doing spring ahead on the rear, I think that since I'm not going to re-cut the torque tube, this will be the way I need to go to keep my sanity. The Flaven & Flaven Model A build is done that way but shortened to accommodate the same configuration but open drive. It looks like they're using the same size spring I am too.

What I think I'm going to do is put the frame on stands, do the 45° cut & attach the rear, then roll forward and mate the torque tube to the transmission and lay down tacks & cut the difference when everything's square.

Seems that will save me a lot of over-thinking and possibly an ugly mistake trying to pull in and up with pie cuts.

 

I was talking with my dad about your dilemma.
Why not bolt the rear in. Dummy the transmission and engine on blocks, then put the body on the frame.

 

I did the low impact version of that with the strapping and it was indicating I'd be too far forward or the engine could come into the cowl, which isn't where I wanna go with this car.

The bum knee and hip slowed me down quite a bit too so I just used a case and a bell.

 

Something has always bothered me about the Tardel Drop and I've never asked the question or stumbled upon the answer, so please bear with me here.

The bottom of a Model A rail is tapered. So, when you move the cut section (45° cut) up and sit it on top of the rail flat, it would have a backward tilt to it.

Is this just something that's negligible or is it something that gets corrected with a spacer I've just not seen mentioned?

 

Not enough to worry about- and that's a "Mike Bowling offset" ( I got the idea for on the HAMB)- no Tardel involvement on this baby. I got his book from a friend to locate my flattie motor mounts and found out it was BAD info ( so did 'em twice) Book went back, and "trial and error" was the name of the game. Besides , you learn more figuring things out yourself ( and I don't need no stinkin' directions!) Keep thrashin" my friend.

 

Afterthought- the top of the rail in back IS flat, so using a straight edge, make the tops parallel and everything should be finest kind. You also heed to remember the front to back taper and make sure everything is good that way too before welding it home. I always use angle iron to clamp and tack weld stuff, then check it 10 times ( diagonal measurements are always good to take). And I still wake up in the middle of the night and second guess myself!

 

I'm working up a plan to deepen the drop and correct the angle. Since I'm taking material out of the frame, I will have frame material to work with. I can flip & swap the cut sections and place them top to top on the rail, which with the crossmember section on top, will kick the frame up another 2-3" AND absorb the angle from the bottom of the rail. See where I'm going with this?

 

Yup- you're going DOWN! Also consider- it might be easier ( and stronger) to do an 8 to 10" kick with 2x4 rectangular tube stock, gusseted and slid inside the "A" frame rails? Sounds like it's all going to be buried under the body , and if you don't tell , I won't! Sounds like a fun project whatever you do!

 

How low can you go? Where do YOU want it, Pat? When I mocked up the body on my model a frame, I measured (many times) where the quarter was in relation with the rear tire. That was 5 1/2 inches too high in my opinion sooooo. . . . .I used 2x4 rectangle tubing leaned rearward 45 degrees for my drop. I am running a spring behind axle so the rear tilt also made up the needed space. I can't post pics but you are welcome to visit the "double u" garage anytime to check it out. Mike Bowling and others have seen my work and there were no gasps of horror so I think its ok

 

We'll see how far I get today. The boxing channel arrived and I'm on my way to get a 7/8 socket to get the rear torn down.

 

Pat, please post pics of rear teardown. I am scared of doing mine

 

I have this thread saved because it was a nice, bare bones, "build it on jack stands" kind of build. As you know, I'm a huge fan of the hard cut frame angles, and chose to make my rear frame section using 10ga. sheet metal. Personally, I'd work on getting you engine mounts and front end in place before I started on the rear. Those two things will help tell you where the rear end should be. Roller tires with the height you plan to run are also important.

http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/threads/build-the-60s-style-t-build.103232/

 

Well guys, I did not get any work in this weekend. Sat. was a wash due to a LATE night that was a little too much fun on Friday and Sunday was WAY too hot after a very cool spring. I went about my yard work in the morning and after a couple hours had to just sit drinking water and gatorade for about an hour before I could move again. So I decided that moving heavy iron around was going to do more harm than good most likely. I did at least pick up that socket I needed.

So, the plan now is to pull the body off and clamp in these boxing plates and locate the engine mounts in the frame. I may just use bolt-in Speedway mounts for now, not sure yet, I've got some weld-ins from RJays too as well as some old school bolt-ins from another frame (but they're for an unboxed rail).

I'm going to put the block in there along with the transmission on blocks like @Robert J. Palmer suggested. That way I can float the body with the old fan on the block and a mockup radiator in there. Once I get the block located in the frame, I can put the frame on stands, unhook the rolling rear, and make my cut.

I'm planning 32" rear tires, 760-16's, because I have a rotten old set of them on wheels and they have deep lugs. I like this since the design concept is about racing on sand or dirt. I've got a set of 600-16 snow tires for the front which are about 29" to balance it out. The relationship should be equivalent to the radials that are on there now (roughly 28" & 25"). I can always buy smaller rear tires if these are just too much (I've been advised that I may launch better with 650/700's) since these are probably too cracked for even off-road duty.

So, with the wheels, tires, spring, & rear end I intend to use clamped to the cut rear frame section, I will roll that forward until the torque tube meets the transmission and then mate the two, giving me my final (hopefully) wheelbase.

Then I'm going to assess what material needs to come out of the frame and if I can add that extra material to the frame and sit level or at a slight rake. If I end up sitting gasser it's a no-go and I'll either scrap the idea or add leaves to the rear spring pack.