Hot Rods learning about the 352 FE + transmissions

Hey Everyone,
I'm new to the H.A.M.B and I have a 1966 Ford F100.

I'm new to the older model truck scene (I've been into late models 2004 SRT-4, 2005 GTO, 2010 v6 Camaro...), but I am looking to dive into it with the help of some friends!

My F100 has the 352FE motor and it's got a 3 speed on the tree.

I have a little extra money and I'm planning to get the motor rebuilt by a shop (nothing crazy, but just something simple good for 300-350hp...) and I'd love to switch out transmissions. My three speed has limited life left in it, and even though 300hp wont be much, I know it'll be more than that tranny can handle. Also I want to switch to a floor shifter.
Would anyone lend some advice on what 4 or 5 speed (floor mounted) tranny will bolt up to the 352 FE? My budget is limited, so hopefully something in the $400-500 range is attainable.

I'm not an old hot rodder by any means, so this is all new for me. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you,
David (stand-al0ne)

 

Your budget is going to limit your options. Your best bet would be to find a heavy duty 3 spd + OD manual. They were put in Galaxies and Pickups behind FE's. The light duty versions behind sixes, y-blocks, and windsor small blocks won't help you much. You should be able to find a good one for a couple hundred. A Hurst floor shifter will bolt right up.

In the $500+ range along with a new bell housing, will get you a good used 4 speed top loader, or a truck 4 speed (think New Process 435 or similar, granny low, heavy ass iron box). No overdrive though.

In the $3000+ range you can get a brand new Tremec TKO 5 or 6 speed manual and a Quicktime Bellhousing to mate it to the FE. Overdrive, bullet proof and requires the removal of your favorite money tree.

As far as automatics, you should be able to a find good used Cruis-O-Matic or C6 for under $500, but you will have to switch fly wheels, starters, and buy a Lokar floor shifter, but no overdrive. Hell, I will sell you the C6 out of my F-250 cheap, since I am planning on replacing it with an AOD shortly, because I can't stand not having OD.

You can get adapters to put AOD's or Chebbie overdrive autos behind an FE, but the adapter alone will run you $850 + the transmission. I put a Broader Performance built AOD adapted to the Cruis-O bellhousing behind the 352 in my '62 Merc. It wasn't cheap ($2800, 4 years ago), but it was worth every penny.

 

I'd go C-6 or BW T-10. Nice easy bolt ins.

 

I love the sound of a cammed FE. Even though it is an O/T year, it is a nice truck. Welcome to the HAMB.

 

Change the front suspension and data plate and it will On/Topic.

 

The 3 speed manual you have is a fully synchronized 3.03 toploader, the same transmission that GM bought from Ford T&C in the mid sixties to install as standard equipment in the GTO and SS396 Chevelle.

Ford used it behind the 390 in the Fairlane GT, Torino, and full sized Galaxie.

It shares the same architecture as the legendary Ford top loader 4 speed.

A lighter version was used in the small block cars.

I like the idea of retaining the three on the tree.

It's traditional.

 

Damn everyone thanks for all the replies so far! Trust me this is a big help hearing from everyone and seeing what options are available or should be considered. I'm loving the H.A.M.B community already and hope one day I'll be able to give some insight to pass along.

Funny you mention the suspension - its going under the knife in the next week or 2 to have a Crown Vic front suspension sway + disc brakes- still undecided if we're going to put the rear Crown Vic Suspension in it too or just 4 link it. I have friends much smarter than me making the decision.

It'll be during this time that the motor is pulled it will be getting mildly built...Cam, Valve job, Pistons + some other things I'm forgetting. I dont know much as I mentioned before, but I know the 352 in the '66 was kinda rare, so I would like to keep the stock motor. Plus the previous owner already installed Edelbrock Intake manifold and Edelbrock 4barrel carb, and I've added Pertronix Ignitor II, so wouldn't mind keeping down the road she's on.
I know others can make more power, but it'll be a fun truck nonetheless.
Since the clutch already feels weak, and the tranny doesnt like shifting into 2nd very often, I think its during this time she should get the tranny solved too. The goal is to be cruising to the beach on the weekends by end of April!

 

Thanks for spendingt so much time on your profile sheet...

 

Everything you have would work on a 390 just as well as that 352. Something to think about, if you want more power.
Have an old timer look at the truck. You may not have a transmission problem, but a worn out shifter.
Try shifting in a definite H motion going from 1 to 2. If you try to shift it like a Z it aggravates the worn linkage situation, if thats what it is.
Good Luck

 

Its been updated

 

Thanks for the heads up - I'd like it to be just the shifter! And yes, I already do the H pattern - I tried going Z when I first got the truck and she was not too happy at all about that crap, haha

 

Why hasn't anyone mentioned the Top Loader 3+1 trans? It came in Trucks, looks like any top loader 4 speed, takes a Hurst or? floor shifter. 3rd gear is 1 to 1 and 4th position is overdrive. No electronix, no cable to pull and No adapter needed. Seems like a simple choice to me and the last real nice used one I bought I payed $300.oo for with the Shifter.
The Wizzard

 

LOL he didn't install an Edelbrock Street Master did he? They are worth more scrap than as an intake, the only performance gain you will get from one is that it makes your truck weigh less.


it seems odd that a '66 F Truck would come with an FE and 3 on the tree. I have seen odder combos but it still seems odd to me. I would not throw the tranny away but if you get numbers off of it we can decipher what transmission you really have, 3 on the tree was common for 6 cylinder trucks and small block trucks. Not necessarily for a FE powered truck, I would expect a granny 4 gear or an automatic in that truck if it is the original engine.

All FEs are basically the same when it comes to building one, keep your compression up in the 9.5:1 range if you are going to run those cast iron heads. You may get away with 10 to one if you can keep it cool enough. If it were me and I didn't want to spend money on adjustable rockers I would not get crazy with the cam shaft, like in just barely a little more then stock cam shaft or a stock HO cam shaft.

Some of the fellas will say different but that is where I am at with it.

 

Yeah, adjustable rockers really do need to go with the cam, that is what I had on my 390 Galaxie.

 

Not real common, but they were out there. I had a '68 with a 360 and a three on the tree. Got great gas mileage (20+!) with the tall rear gears it had, but would smoke the clutch trying to get out of a hole when loaded... Not so hot for towing heavy loads either.

Those truck toploader three speeds are all but bulletproof. There was two problems with them; first, the die-cast shift collar on the column would wear out causing shifting issues. These can still be replaced, although it's a PITA to do, and they wear out faster than they should. NAPA used to sell a fairly easy to install 'repair collar' that went over the worn original that worked good but looked funky. A good floor-shift conversion will permanently fix this. Two, they were infamous for having noisy input shaft bearings. A new bearing would quiet them for a bit, but the noise would come back. Ignore the noise; it doesn't hurt 'em a bit, I ran one out past 300K miles with no issues and know of more that did the same. While swapping to a C6 has it's good points, it won't do your fuel economy any good at all as they have quite a bit of internal power loss.

The '3+1' OD four speeds are a decent trans (and pretty much a bolt-in, although if you have a two-piece driveshaft you'll have to convert to the later one piece unit) but if you do run the truck loaded or tow, they're very hard on the cluster gear/shaft/bearings as OD is actually the 4-speed 3rd gear. Ford recommended NOT using OD when towing or hauling heavy loads; use '3rd' gear, the original 4th gear. Stay away from the aluminum-cased versions, the FE torque will kill those pretty quickly, besides have a crummy ratio spread.

 

Steve,
A little off topic for the thread but now I am curious and its your fault. The earliest 360 truck I recall working on was a '68 is that the first year for the 360?

 

Yep, '68 was the first year of the 360. It still amazes me that it took Ford 7 years to figure out that it was cheaper to build one block for both the 352 and 390 rather than two. All the 360 is is a 352 with the 390 bore...

 

LOL a 396 is a 427 with a 352 stroke.

I think that after Henry relinquished the reins more stuff got past the geniuses then before. They did do one smart thing (at least for Ford) things don't swap around as easily as GM.

 

66 F100 352 3 on the tree....

 

Those FE toploader three speeds really are tough transmissions; I had one in a '58 Ford wagon with a built FE, and that was the only driveline piece I never broke... When I bought the conversion from the wrecking yard (I wanted a toploader 4-speed, but the $600 cost back then was two months pay...), the guy told me 'Kid, the only way you'll break this will be by running it with no gear lube or missing a shift at 7 grand'. Hell, it even survived a few missed shifts... LOL.

One other thing to watch for if you swap trannys; the FE used a shorter pilot bearing shaft on the input compared to the SBF/385 BBF. If using a trans out of one of those, you need to cut about 3/16" off the pilot shaft; if you don't, it may bottom out against the end of the crankshaft, killing the tranny input bearing and/or the crankshaft thrust bearing. Re-taper the cut edge and you'll be good to go.

 

So,how about Top loader out of a 69 390 Cougar to a 64 T bird 390?Any issues?

 

As long as you have the right '65-up bellhousing, no issues....

 

Thanks Steve.Thought so, but you know them old Fords..

 

transmission be damned !!! I think I would be more concerned about getting that
352 and whatever transmission to sit in the crown vic cradle and what clearance issue's your going to
encounter there !!!

 

Hey folks,

Update - we're in the middle of the build. Have not mocked up motor mounts yet, so not sure how clearance w/ motor/tranny will be, if any. That is on the near future list of having done.
There are some guys running 460 big blocks on the crown vic suspension. I think it'll take a little math to get the right motor mount fabricated, but we're optimistic at this point.
Also, transmission is staying put. Transmission I have is a 3-speed top loader. Hearing all the good things about top loaders has changed my decision on swapping to anything else. At this point, since we have the rear end from a 2007 Town Car with a 2.73 ratio, I think it will be enough to drop the rpms down to a reasonable level at highway cruising speeds. So, going to replace the clutch, convert to a floor shifter, and keep on trucking.
Crazy Steve, I also plan to send you a PM to pick your brain about floor shift conversion kits. I've seen some generic Hurst options, but wanted to get your $0.02 since you're familiar with them.

And yes, I guess it is a bit rare, but this truck is a 1966 with 352 FE + 3 speed top loader. Got a pic of the motor/tranny - will post that up. (and she's dirty, so please don't judge too bad - its getting cleaned up before going back in)

 

Here's a pic of the engine / tranny

 

You were 100% correct my man. I like my transmission more I read about it.

 

Crazy Steve helped direct me to a Hurst Mastershift kit + kit linkage. It's more than I wanted to pay (only more in the sense that I'm cheap lol), but all the parts are new and it should be almost direct bolt-on at this point. Can't wait to create a build thread and post pics when everything is coming back together.

Thanks again for everyone's input.

 

a 360 is a 390 with a 352 crank. The pistons are 390,s they don't come up flush with the deck. You can install a 390 crank in a 360 and use the original 360 rods & pistons.

 

you can put a top from a jeep warner three speed on that trans. and have a floor shift without any external linkage.