I've got the rear leaf springs out of Clarence (see avatar) and have another set ready to go in. 1. Based on your experiences should I take this set apart and install Teflon/delrin/plastic/etc. spring liners? 2. If I do who makes the best. If I use it I want black and want the edges to have lips on the edges to keep it in place. b-t-w; the springs are 2" wide. Also I've got new spring pins and bushings to go in.
I used the black with edges and really like it. The truck is quieter and smoother riding. Put the edge facing down so the springs don't get water setting in them.
I've never had any luck with those strips that go between the leaves, even the ones with a lip on both sides. They tend to want to squeeze out over time. I use the teflon buttons that you drill a 5/16 hole in the end of the leaf and put the button in that hole, and the button gets trapped by the next leaf. Turns it into sort of a Posies spring, if you will. Those hold up well and work great. Don
The only thing I'm trying to get is information. I don't know why folks use these and want to learn/find out. Thanx; where did you get them? Thanx, Don. What's the secret to drilling in spring steel? I can't imagine having much luck doing so. Also where did you get the buttons?
b-t-w; I've searched both here on the hamb for information and also googled for suppliers. I'm looking for more and better information.
I found the strips squeezed out also.. where do you buy buttons? somebody on here says, to drill spring steel, use Elmers's Glue as a cutting fluid. I have never tried it.
For the last 40 years, we've sanded the wear pattern out of each leaf, de-arched as necessary, coated with a waterproof grease, & taped completely closed with black electrical tape. Lasts for years, any damage to tape easy to fix. Doesn't cost much, works very well.
I used Never-Seize, the silver compound that is typically used on threads. I took the spring apart and coated each section and reassembled the spring. Because of the center bolt and clamps, the spring doesn't really move that much, but the coating of the Never Seize prevented spring bind and allows each lief to move with out friction. I was always concerned about drilling my springs for the buttons and once the Teflon wears thru you are back to steel on steel.
Full length spring liners are available in three designs, the first being a simple flat strip and the other channeled with lips, some single lip like a square "U", the other with lips going up and down, sort of like an "I" beam. The lips help keep the liner from slipping out. The liners are made out of either delrin, poly, or teflon, as are most of the leaf spring buttons that require a hole to be drilled in the ends of the leaf to keep them in place. Installing full length liners does increase the spring pack thickness. Based upon the width of the liner, the thickness varies from .03 to .06 Inches thick. So the overall spring thickness does increase based upon how many full length liners are installed. But the use of liners has no effect on the spring rate. Spring rate is a result of the width of the spring, the thickness of the steel, the number of leaves and how the ends are finished. But the use of liners does have an effect on how the spring performs. Due to interleaf friction all multi-leaf springs suffer what is known as "hysteresis". That is, it takes more force to start the spring to deflect than it does to keep it deflecting. The use of either full length liners or tip inserts greatly reduce interleaf friction which in turn reduces hysteresis. This keeps the working spring rate close to it’s actual rate. Keep in mind, that in order for a liner to be effective the liner must be as wide as the spring. While spring liners help in a spring’s performance, the liner has absolutely no strength. Even though a liner is used in a spring, the spring still requires all of it’s leaves. http://www.speedwaymotors.com/Leaf-Spring-Liner-with-Lip-1-3-4-Inch,2079.html http://www.ebay.com/itm/Leaf-Spring-End-Tip-Pad-Anti-Squeak-6-Pieces-Free-Shipping-/181631623859
when I rebuilt the original rear spring on my 36 I took a grinder to bottom the edge of each lip so the bottom edge of the lip as it sits on on the leaf below is not square but rounded. Think I got it form an old Tex Smith article, those guys just used grease between the leaves. I went to a truck spring place and they gave me a roll of the plastic liner, I added some to each leaf and cut the excess off. They are still fitting in between the leaves fine with no squeezing etc..
I used liners with the lips on the rear spring in 27 roadster. It worked so good I had to add 2 leaves. I used Teflon buttons on the front spring because I did not want to see the liners. On the front spring I had to remove a leaf because the spring got stiffer but slid real well. It works great. Gary
It probably had some kind of brass or plastic sliders when new. Old springs were dimpled for an insert, newer ones are drilled. If it has neither, another old trick is to put window screen and grease between the leaves and wrap with hockey tape.
Rusty beat me to it, I've seen screen and grease. Also saw an old article where they used the needle bearings from a u joint on the tips of each spring
Here is where you get the buttons: http://www.chassisengineeringinc.com/au-2061-button-sliders-for-springs-2-1-4/ I used a cobalt drill bit with a lot of oil, and went very slow. Even at that, I dulled a couple of bits doing the whole job. Spring steel is tough as nails. Here is a picture of a button installed on my 23 spring: Don
I used the U shaped spring liner stuff from Speedway. Has been in around 11K miles and hasnt slipped out, my caddy springs originally had a hard cloth type material between the upper main leaves only. On my current 41 caddy build I am leaving the factory stuff in place since it is all in good shape. This was the original stuff, it looked like cloth and was made with fibers but was pretty stiff. It would snap in half if flexed, probably because of how old it was.
Kind of a strong reaction to Atch's reply, isn't it? All he said was that he was looking for information........
Mine has been in for 10 years and still looks like the day put it there. I greased the springs when I first cleaned them up, a year later I had the fronts out again since they seems to stiffen up. When I pulled them apart, the grease was gone at the contact points and looks as though it was never there. They were not wrapped, but I suspect the grease will still squeeze out due to internal forces. Joe
Springs are painted black. I can only hope that someday I will be able to afford chrome springs on something.
I just PM the OP. But I want to totally embarrass myself to everyone in the hopes of forgiveness. I was completely out of line. I was trying to get more information in order to make constructive suggestions. I misunderstood his reference to my post and over reacted. I thought he was saying I was just posting off topic in order learn how to do what he was asking about. Since I completed a 52 F-1 project long ago, I felt put off being referred to a "some people". As a final low blow appeal for forgiveness, the fact that my wife had to but her cat to sleep the night before might have had something to do with it. My thanks to the OP for the PM, shows the true spirit of the HAMB, which sadly I didn't, and I think it's time up pony up that $50 and join. Best of luck with your project. Dino
Dino, All is good here. Sorry about your pet. AND NOW BACK TO OUR REGULARLY SCHEDULED PROGRAM: Is there any more information anyone cares to share?
I tried to get Eaton Spring to build me some springs, they can't build from scratch to your dimensions, can only alter what you are using.....In the course of looking at their site videos they say to not use ANY lube between leaves as it will attack and weaken the spring material because of the composition of new spring material..I know, WTF..They seem to contradict them selfs..So getting back to lining material, any more suggestions?
how much of the liner are you supposed to let stick out on the longer leaf than the length of the shorter leaf ? I know that as the spring compresses the short leaf rides outward on the longer one in the stack-- but how much teflon should be sticking out for that riding outward ?
GM springs had dimple in some of them. They made a cloth covered pad that went in the dimple. These were easy to replace using a screw driver to open the spring.
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