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Technical Lacquer Paint Questionnaire

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Paint Guru, Jan 7, 2016.

  1. AllLikkeredUp
    Joined: Oct 12, 2017
    Posts: 7

    AllLikkeredUp

    Medium thinner, and shooting inside in in the mid 60s degrees mostly. I been thinking about thinner too, as it's been flashing off fast and if I under-thin by a drop I get lime peel (which in my book is finer and easier to sand out than orange peel). Maybe at these temps slower thinner would burn into the old coats better and flow out better?
     
  2. 97
    Joined: May 18, 2005
    Posts: 1,809

    97
    Member

    Did you check your abrasive carefully, I have recently experienced some paper which had a different feel than the grade printed on it...it had a cheaper feeling and it left some scratches where I did not expect them...Turns out it was made in Asia, and it appears quality control was not what it should have been...I took a careful look at a fresh sheet and I could see some small areas which were spotty and inconsistent...I took it all back to the shop and asked what they thought...without hesitation they took it back and gave me a more recognisable brand .... the counter guy told me they sell the cheaper stuff to most people and have few complaints .
    He told me that there are three or four different ways of grading and manufacturing abrasive paper and that the simple fact is some of them allow incorrect particles of grit to get mixed in which does cause issues which often only become visible in certain paints and always after the finish coat is done.....the short answer according to him is to buy quality brands graded and manufactured under the JIS system? He also told me that one manufacturers 1200 might be another's 1000.
     
    clem and loudbang like this.
  3. AllLikkeredUp
    Joined: Oct 12, 2017
    Posts: 7

    AllLikkeredUp

    A few days later... Dropped in at the local paint shop to pick up another can of lacquer thinner. The guys there said, noooo, don't use lacquer thinner, you gotta use urethane grade reducer for better flow-out. They said never use lacquer thinner to "reduce" my lacquer. Huh? So, I called my lacquer source (TCP Global) and they said what you'd expect them to say. So I bought another gallon of lacquer thinner.

    The deal is that If I can't shoot in the morning the sun comes around and shines into my garage and heats things up, so I have to wait till late afternoon when the sun goes below the trees and things cool a bit - that was 5:30pm tonight before I could whip out the gun. But I had a couple happy days of shooting, sanding, shooting, sanding, and tonight layed on a couple final coats thinned at 125%. Things are looking good - smooooth, super low if any peel, looks like it just needs compounding. But gonna let it sit a week or so before touching it again. Fat chance.

    But really, like who's ever heard if using urethane reducer to shoot lacquer?
     
    loudbang and brad2v like this.
  4. Lacquer is an archaic-nightmare to work with. Lacquer dries by solvent evaporation and only OEM
    (General Motors) factory Thermo-Set Acrylic /21% solids/ lasted very well. All Lacquer you see with cracks or crows feet was sprayed in the aftermarket. If you spill gas / brake fluid or any nasty solvent
    on air dry lacquer it absorbs the solvent and harms the finish. Grasshopper bug-splatter and bird
    droppings harm Lacquer. Lacquer will dissolve with heat. Extensive hot water pressure washers will blow it off.
    It's acrylic content makes it brittle and prone to chipping. Modern paints are simple-durable-but overpriced. Lay down catalyzed Urethane primers...sand them smooth ....final sand the old paint or primers 800#grit. Buy basecoat paint...which is basically INK. 4-5 coats may only be 1-2 mils thick.
    The clearcoat is the film-thickness paint job ....and most 3 coat (50% overlap) clears will give you a 4-mil final overall paint job. You can spray the clear with an orchard sprayer as long as you don't mind
    cutting and buffing the clearcoat. Initial sand 1500# or 2000#. Then use a water-DA with 3000# trizact...then 5000# trizact. At this point the paint is already glossy and only needs a quick final buff with a SOFT sponge pad and compound.
    This thread is nice but LACQUER is troublesome-brittle-and fragile. If it had any value for durability
    it would still be offered other than in peoples dreams. Sorry to those I anger.
     
  5. Paint Guru
    Joined: Sep 9, 2015
    Posts: 522

    Paint Guru
    Member
    from Bowdon, GA

    Well it's actually been a while since I have been on. Just a update, the Lacquer is on the market now and doing very well. We have a few jobbers on the east coast that are mixing (including my wife's store). For the West Coast we have to build at our plant to get to the 2.1 voc requirement.
    I saw a couple of comments about the thinner. We opted for urethane reducer because most urethane reducer goes through a quality control process. Lacquer thinner these days is mostly recycled garbage.
    But a couple of improvements we did on the lacquer, you can use our DTM Reducer in the lacquer for direct to metal applications. Also we have a option to activate the lacquer to create better durability and chemical resistance. This is a option and will make the lacquer take a longer time to dry between coats.
    Out in direct sunlight with no wax the lacquer last 4-6 months before chalking starts. Activated lacquer last a little over a year before it starts to chalk. But either one easily comes back to full gloss very easy.

    Hope this helps and gives you another option in the market.


    Sent from my SM-G955U using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
     
  6. mcsfabrication
    Joined: Nov 26, 2006
    Posts: 933

    mcsfabrication
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Nice to see you back. Your knowledge and openness about the mystery of paint is very much appreciated. You always seem very honest, not just looking to better your personal financial situation. Thanks.
     
    brad2v, loudbang and Paint Guru like this.
  7. JimmyD3234
    Joined: Dec 3, 2015
    Posts: 551

    JimmyD3234
    Member
    from PA

    Thanks for your Time N info. LACQUER paint Still my #1 I will take it any day before the other stuff been painting for a long time 60s
     
    loudbang and Paint Guru like this.
  8. I know it's buried in the thread somewhere, but an you remind us of what company/brand we're looking for? ;)
     
    loudbang likes this.
  9. Paint Guru
    Joined: Sep 9, 2015
    Posts: 522

    Paint Guru
    Member
    from Bowdon, GA

    Color By Design... The 2.1 is called Hammerlac. The regular lacquer is mixed off the MINI-MIX 7 system.

    Sent from my SM-G955U using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
     
    loudbang and Speedy Canuck like this.
  10. Are you saying that the lacquer you make can be reduced with urethane reducer but other manufacturers lacquer cannot?
     
    loudbang likes this.
  11. Paint Guru
    Joined: Sep 9, 2015
    Posts: 522

    Paint Guru
    Member
    from Bowdon, GA

    I am not sure if other companies Lacquer will. We just built ours to accept a PPG, Matrix type urethane grade reducer. It really depends on the type of resin and solvent blend the manufacturer starts with. If you are unsure, in a lot of cases you can send me the msds sheet and I can let you know if it's compatible.


    Sent from my SM-G955U using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
     
    mcsfabrication and loudbang like this.

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