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Hot Rods Just Curious... Will A Top Notch Show Car Make Money?

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Fordor Ron, Feb 19, 2019.

  1. anthony myrick
    Joined: Sep 4, 2009
    Posts: 6,199

    anthony myrick
    Member

    At a show a couple weeks ago. Watched the owner setting up all the dolls and other crap for s photo shoot
    Ya got a point but at least they drove the car somewhere
    You are correct on the crowd a hot rod makes when being used for what it’s designed for........high revs and tire smoke
     
  2. banjorear
    Joined: Jul 30, 2004
    Posts: 3,795

    banjorear
    Member


    Word. Budgets and estimates get blown out of the water for sure. My basic hot rod build will be just under $30K easily, so $100K is not unrealistic.

    I remember reading about a Merc. build that So Cal did had something like 1,000 billable hours just on paint and prep. Think about that for a second.

    Honing the cost of finished build to a real number helps both the shop and the owner of the project. It really comes down to money talks, bullshit walks.

    When Brizio throws out $100-200K for a build (I'm assuming they are that much judging from his recent cars), I'm sure he can sniff out who can actually pay and who can't.
     
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  3. If you're in it for the money, find a different hobby. It's all about the cars and the friends. NOT money.
     
  4. Gregg Pellicer
    Joined: Aug 20, 2004
    Posts: 1,347

    Gregg Pellicer
    Member

    He didnt spend enough money LOL. My brother in law builds high end muscle cars. They routiney go out the door for 200,000 +. And the day they leave the shop you couldnt sell them for what you spent.
     
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  5. The37Kid
    Joined: Apr 30, 2004
    Posts: 27,346

    The37Kid
    Member

    Great apology Desmodromic, however the new GTO Ferrari record is now $80,000,000.00 yes eighty million, paid by the CEO of Weather Tech, that is a huge pile of floor mats.:) I can't relate to that number but see it as a reward for providing a needed product and the jobs it provides for many people, a reward for a job well done. Bob
     
  6. ramblin dan
    Joined: Apr 16, 2018
    Posts: 2,149

    ramblin dan

    I totally agree. I'm finding the landscape of this hobby has changed a lot from when I started in it. Years ago we used to go to shows and camp out for the weekend. The host clubs would hold dinners and dances and we would eat DRINK and be merry. We all have great memories of these times and have made life long friends and money doesn't cover that.
     
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  7. Desmodromic
    Joined: Sep 25, 2010
    Posts: 571

    Desmodromic
    Member

    Damn it! I should have bought that one for $48,000,000 when I had the chance.
     
  8. denis4x4
    Joined: Apr 23, 2005
    Posts: 3,554

    denis4x4
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from Colorado

    Can't wait to see the commercials with a couple of golden retrievers in an $80 million car.
     
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  9. The37Kid
    Joined: Apr 30, 2004
    Posts: 27,346

    The37Kid
    Member

    May 1, 1971 at the first Kirk F White auction they couldn't get a bid over $6,500 for one.:confused: Bob DSCF0040.JPG
     
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  10. DRD57
    Joined: Mar 5, 2001
    Posts: 3,838

    DRD57
    Member

    A customer of ours, for whom we built a VERY nice Dearborn Deuce, asked me once what it would take to build him a serious AMBR contender.

    I told him he would have to be able to stand in front of an open fire with a big stack of 100 dollar bills and be able to throw those bills into the fire, one after another, without flinching or bitching until I told him he could stop. He could have probably done it except for the flinching or bitching part.
     
  11. 1946caddy
    Joined: Dec 18, 2013
    Posts: 1,705

    1946caddy
    Member
    from washington

    I doubt very much that they worked on the car 8 hours a day for 636 days in a row. Probably start to finish dates.
     
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  12. 1946caddy
    Joined: Dec 18, 2013
    Posts: 1,705

    1946caddy
    Member
    from washington

    I can remember back in the mid 60's going to the Portland Roadster Show when I was about 14 years old. A friend's dad took us. The only thing I recall is one of the featured cars, while it looked impressive, didn't have any spark plug wires, carb linkage or throttle linkage. Just an engine with a lot of chrome.
     
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  13. stubbsrodandcustom
    Joined: Dec 28, 2010
    Posts: 1,284

    stubbsrodandcustom
    Member
    from Spring tx

    This about the only worthy doll I have ever seen with a car.
    1959 Chevrolet El Camino cry baby.jpg
     
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  14. anthony myrick
    Joined: Sep 4, 2009
    Posts: 6,199

    anthony myrick
    Member

    Yep
    When you do this professionally, the car can only be built at the speed of the owners budget. I have worked on cars that the owner could handle about a weeks worth of work per month.
    Sometimes we would let that build up then do a big amount of work to get it to a good stopping point.
    The big ticket items like SEMA, Detroit, Goodguys blank of the year stuff.......could have most of the shop busy for months at crunch time (plus all the normal shop time) Imagine the labor bill of months for 6-10 guys thrashing for 60-80+ hours a week + parts
    If a shop can manage all these different levels of builds/customers and expectations, keep billing and parts handled, pay labor, travel to shows and make a profit......... those guys rule
     
    Last edited: Feb 21, 2019
  15. redo32
    Joined: Jul 16, 2008
    Posts: 1,732

    redo32
    Member

    We asked Dave Kindig how long it took to build the Copper Caddie, he said "We have 10,000 hours in it." His shop rate is $115/hour. Want me to do the math for you... that's $1.15 Million.
     
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  16. Yep those types of events started going away in the 90's. That is when every supermarket, church, and business go into holding shows for fundraising. While I enjoy going to some of those shows and helping that charity out and visit with friends, they pushed out the weekend events with the meals and dances. I have to say as well some of those events just couldn't fly today. Portland used to have the "Super Cruise In" that was a big party weekend with a car show, drag racing, various car games. Though most people were not sober during the driving events.
     
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  17. The Renaissance Roadster Steve's Auto built has over $11 million spent on its construction for going after the Riddler.
     
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  18. Chappy444
    Joined: Jan 27, 2012
    Posts: 1,128

    Chappy444
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    1. Maryland HAMBers

    I have a buddy that is primarily a paint and body guy. He has built some nice cars. magazine cars, restos, etc. He has even done work on some cars that you would instantly recognize.
    He keeps the doors open at his shop doing small insurance jobs, touch ups, etc. But he always has a big project going.
    On those projects (the restorations and hot rod builds) he refuses to give estimates. We joke him all the time about him telling the customer up front "it will be whatever it is". He has a good reputation and does beautiful work. But he learned long ago that there is no telling what you are going to get into once the lump is dropped off at the shop and you dig into it or the customers that want to change direction in the middle of the build. For him it is easier to bill the customer as he goes rather than try to justify added expenses to the estimate. Every few weeks the customer comes by, checks the progress, opens the check book and strokes another check. The customer is free to pick up the car at any time with no hard feelings. To my knowledge no customer has quit in the middle of the project due to feeling they are over paying. Some have certainly picked up due to lack of funds to finish the job. It worked for him for years right up until he retired. I can say that most of those cars cost more to build than they were worth when finished. And many of the cars that were brought through the door shouldn't have been started at all, the customer could have bought a nice, finished car and had the changes done to make it their own for way less than they ended up paying to restore/modify the pile they started with.
    Chappy
     
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  19. redo32
    Joined: Jul 16, 2008
    Posts: 1,732

    redo32
    Member

    Steve knows how to bill. That would equate to about 100,000 hours. 40 hrs/week times 50 weeks is 2,000 hours per year divided into 100,000 hours equals 50 years worth of man hours. Maybe 24 guys working 2 years straight.
     
  20. oldpl8s
    Joined: Apr 11, 2007
    Posts: 1,392

    oldpl8s
    Member

    This reminds me of an old saying about betting on horse racing. If you want to make a small fortune, start with a large fortune...
     
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  21. Desmodromic
    Joined: Sep 25, 2010
    Posts: 571

    Desmodromic
    Member

    I'm so old that when I went to my first auction, one year after college, a Stutz Bearcat sold at auction for $75,000, a word's record for an automobile.
     
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  22. anthony myrick
    Joined: Sep 4, 2009
    Posts: 6,199

    anthony myrick
    Member

    11 million

    our Riddler was a bargain then
     
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  23. Fordors
    Joined: Sep 22, 2016
    Posts: 2,991

    Fordors
    Member

    A Hemmings article says Steve Frisbe noted the Renaissance Roadster took 20,000 man hours and 42 months to build. At $120/hr that equals $2.4 million. With virtually the complete car being scratch built the other $8.5 mil still sounds like an awful lot for parts and materials.
     
  24. I wonder if my hand would cramp up writing that many zeros on the cheque... o_O
     
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  25. oj
    Joined: Jul 27, 2008
    Posts: 6,247

    oj
    Member

    Do you guys remember how many hours Bishop had in just the lakepipe headers on the Bishop-Tardel Roadster? My memory is wonky, but I recall hundreds of hours to get them to the point of chroming.
    I don't feel so bad now after spending 4 hrs to get the pinion preload just right on this 9" that is kicking my ass.
     
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  26. Holy Shit a ghost has arisen. Welcome back Bob!!!
     
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  27. I guess it depends if that man hours includes things like AutoCAD/3d Modeling of the project as I think they did that a lot with that car to get very precise measurement's. Or is that total just fabrication time actually building the car. Hard to say, though if you see the car in person i can see where all that money went, the thing is a work of art and it does run and drive.
     
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  28. RidingMechanic
    Joined: Jul 31, 2017
    Posts: 87

    RidingMechanic
    Member
    from Cincinnati

    Neat bit of history there. I think Kirk White was also the first dealer to ask $1mm for a vintage Ferrari and get it?
     
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  29. Gman0046
    Joined: Jul 24, 2005
    Posts: 6,256

    Gman0046
    Member

    Sorry guys anyone spending a million dollars to have someone build them a car belongs in an institiution. Whats the point? I'd be surprised if the owner knew how to put gas in it.
     
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  30. anthony myrick
    Joined: Sep 4, 2009
    Posts: 6,199

    anthony myrick
    Member

    I bet George Poteet thinks this is funny
     
    belair, ronzmtrwrx, 47ragtop and 4 others like this.

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