Register now to get rid of these ads!

JAG IFS, I've done a search but still have questions

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by johnboy13, May 1, 2012.

  1. johnboy13
    Joined: May 1, 2007
    Posts: 1,073

    johnboy13
    Member

    I've done a search, here and beyond but I'd kinda like to put together a post that will answer most of the FAQ's that come up with a Jag IFS swap.

    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=451036&highlight=jaguar

    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=24785

    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=571296&highlight=tech+ifs

    I've found a local junk yard that has two Jags in the yard. A 95 XJS with a I6 and an 85 XJ6 with a V12. From what I've read in the above posts, either will work. Is one better than the other? The 95 is in A LOT better shape.

    I see that I need the crossmember, all suspension parts, and the steering linkage from the column to the rack. I've also seen to grab the gas cap on the 85. Should I grab the Jag power steering pump and fab a bracket for my 351W, or would it be better to use the Ford pump and bracket and fab some lines? I'm going to go the route of Mattilac in the Jag IFS into a 64 F100 post and use adaptors to connect the metric brake lines to a standard master cylinder, so I won't pull the master cylinder. But I've seen where others have. If you're someone following this post, it's your call.

    Can I safely assume that I'll need all METRIC tools to pull it out of the Jag? I have a very typical, maybe even sub-standard, set of metric wrenches and sockets, 7MM to probably 18 or 19MM. Is there any special sized wrenches or sockets that I'll need to have before I get there?

    Stupid question of the day...

    Does the engine bolt to the Jag crossmember or the Jag frame? Does it need to be pulled out of the vehicle to get the IFS out? What about the trans?

    How does the steering U-joint come apart from the column? Where is the connection, engine side or passenger compartment side?

    Well, that's about it for now, I'll add more questions as I think of them. I'd really like to get it out as quickly as possible, free time is a commodity for both my wife and I and I know I'll owe her big time for letting me have the time away.
     
    Last edited: May 3, 2012
  2. rld14
    Joined: Mar 30, 2011
    Posts: 1,609

    rld14
    Member

    The IFS on the jag is also called the crossbeam, aka what we'd call a subframe or a cradle.

    It should be metric. And the '85, you said V12? Should be a coupe unless it's a Euro car. 95 suspension ought to work but the later crossbeams are foam filled and are basically impossible to weld as the foam is rather flammable I'm told.
     
  3. zman
    Joined: Apr 2, 2001
    Posts: 16,559

    zman
    Member
    from Garner, NC

    My understanding is the front ends changed in 86 and you didn't want anything post that. But that's going on memory.

    Get the power steering pump and lines. I ran new lines and used the original Jag fittings on the brake side and new fittings on the M/C side.

    A lot of the ones I've messed with were SAE and Metric mixed. (early-mid 80's)

    Engine bolts to crossmember. Easier with the engine out. But it can be done with it in. Just a real PITA.

    I can't remember as I didn't use the Jag parts on my Buick. Got a U-joint with 3/4"-48 Spline (if I remember correctly) on one end and used a GM slip shaft and rag joint.
     
  4. Ddooce
    Joined: Oct 27, 2010
    Posts: 132

    Ddooce
    Member
    from Memphis Tn

    An XJ6 with a V12 ? - that would be an XJ12. Not sold in the US in 85 but could be a grey import or from Canada.
    The steering rack changed 93 up to a ZF - much better than the earlier Alford and Adler leaker. The later rack from an XJS will fit the earlier XJ6/12 and XJS.
    An XJ12 and XJS would have much heavier springs than an XJ6 the 12 cylinder engine weighs in excess of 700 lbs stripped and dry.
     
    Register now to get rid of these ads!

  5. johnboy13
    Joined: May 1, 2007
    Posts: 1,073

    johnboy13
    Member

    It says XJ6 on the decklid but I thought it had a V12 in the engine compartment. I just glanced in and saw that the top end looked way different than the I6 in the newer car. It is grey though. Maybe it was put together by a previous owner. Maybe I'm just wrong about the engine, it's really possible.

    Thanks BIG time for the tip on the rack. From what I've read, if it is a V12 car, I should grab the springs from the I6 car, right?
     
  6. johnboy13
    Joined: May 1, 2007
    Posts: 1,073

    johnboy13
    Member

    I don't think I would have ever thought of that. Thanks.
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2012
  7. Deuce Daddy Don
    Joined: Apr 27, 2008
    Posts: 4,892

    Deuce Daddy Don
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Why not give Jerry Kugel a phone cal?----(562)691-7006
    OR----kugelkomponents.com
     
  8. zman
    Joined: Apr 2, 2001
    Posts: 16,559

    zman
    Member
    from Garner, NC

    Most people doing this are trying to save money, his stuff is a little pricey. And his IFS looks more MII derived.
     
  9. johnboy13
    Joined: May 1, 2007
    Posts: 1,073

    johnboy13
    Member

    You beat me to it zman
     
  10. Mattilac
    Joined: Oct 27, 2007
    Posts: 1,148

    Mattilac
    Member

    Beware if you're pulling the suspension out of a factory 12 cyl. car it will have higher rated springs than a 6 cyl. car. But even the 6 cyl. springs are a bit heavy duty for most applications as it is.

    The engine does bolt to the crossmember yes, but if you can get some 2x4s or pipes and some straps to suspend it from above the car (laying the beams across the fenders), just get the straps snugged up then go about unbolting the subframe. It'll drop out the bottom and the engine won't come with it.
     
  11. toddc
    Joined: Nov 25, 2007
    Posts: 982

    toddc
    Member

    The bolts in either car ought to be imperial / SAE. I seem to remember the steering column bolts being in the cabin rather than the engine compartment. Yes the engine is supported by the suspension cross member, and its heavy too. The V12 is mega heavy. Be sure that whatever you use to support the engine while you remove the crossmember is up to the job. The suspension unit ain't light either for that matter.

    Quote:
    <table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="100%"> <tbody><tr> <td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset"> Originally Posted by toddc [​IMG]
    These are the Jags to look for as donors.
    They are called "XJ". XJ6, XJ12, XJS, XJ4.2, XJ5.3 (where 4.2 and 5.3 indicate engine size in litres) Just stay clear of XJ40 series from ~1987 up.

    This is a Series 1. These ran from 1968 to 1973. The front end is good, but the 6 cylinder version has solid disks and 3 piston callipers. The V12 version is "the same" as series 2. If the front panels are gone look at the dash, series 1 cars had the small gauges in the middle of the car.
    [​IMG]

    This is a series 2. These ran from 1973 to 1979. Note that the front bumper is higher, US models have rubber bits on the bumpers too. If the front panels are gone look at the dash, series 2 cars had the small gauges in front of the driver. All front ends are good. Vented disks and 4 piston callipers.
    ( If you happen to find a 2 door version of this series don't cut it up, restorers will pay $$$ for them :D )
    [​IMG]

    This is a series 3. These ran from 1979 to 1987 as a 6 cylinder car and up to 1992 as a V12. Actually a very different car to a series 2, but looks very similar. Easiest way to tell them apart is by the lack of a front quarter window. All front ends are good, "same as" series 2.
    [​IMG]

    This is an XJS. They ran from 1976 to 1997. All front ends are good. "Same as" series 2 or 3.
    [​IMG]

    This is an XJ40. They ran from 1987 to 1994. Totally different front end. To me they look like they would work, but I've never seen it done.There is very little information available on swapping them compared with the earlier stuff. Best left alone.
    [​IMG]
    This is an X300. They ran from 1994 till 1997. Much the same as an XJ40.
    [​IMG]
    Note: where I write "same" I mean functionally close enough, there are numerous detail differences that really don't matter to a hotrodder.

    </td> </tr> </tbody></table>
     
  12. The xj12 will be LSD
    The xj6 won't.
    I think the XJS were LSD as well.
     
  13. johnboy13
    Joined: May 1, 2007
    Posts: 1,073

    johnboy13
    Member

    Brakes, does one car have better brakes than the other? Are they interchangable?
     
  14. toddc
    Joined: Nov 25, 2007
    Posts: 982

    toddc
    Member

    The series 1 cars ( 1969 to 1972) have different brakes. The others are close enough to the same. And very good for a street driven car too.
     
  15. rld14
    Joined: Mar 30, 2011
    Posts: 1,609

    rld14
    Member

    If it says "XJ6" on the back it's a 6, the engine should be an XK-series DOHC inline 6. They are rather old school looking (dare I say traditional?) as the design goes back to the late 40s. Google "jaguar XK engine" to see pics of one.

    The 95 is using a totally different engine, an AJ16, which is a similar capacity DOHC inline 6 but shares basically nothing with the XK. It's basically half a V12 with a DOHC head. From my experience with these cars the crossbeams should be different, I'd stick with the earlier setup. Just don't get a crossbeam/ifs out of an XJ40, those are the boxy sedans with the square tail lamps.
     
  16. Use the earlier 85 set-up. It is better for swapping into the old cars. I used an 86 for my 53 GMC, both the front and rear. Very nice easy swap. Not running yet so no seat of the pants results, but it should ride and drive nice. The later 95 set-up has less clearance between the upper A-arms and can interfere for swaps; so avoid it and use the earlier design.

    The engine is mounted to the cross member as stated. The only thing you need to fabricate in your swap will be the upper shock mounts. The rest is all contained in the Jag front susp assy. Get the steering intermediate shaft that goes between the rack and the column, never hurts to have all the extra parts you can.
     
  17. Mattilac
    Joined: Oct 27, 2007
    Posts: 1,148

    Mattilac
    Member

    Yea the Jag brakes are boss. Four cylinders per side.
     
  18. johnboy13
    Joined: May 1, 2007
    Posts: 1,073

    johnboy13
    Member

    So, back to that steering joint, I could clearly see how to seperate it from the rack, but I'm still not clear on how to get it seperated from the column.
     
  19. RHOPPER
    Joined: Mar 12, 2006
    Posts: 263

    RHOPPER
    Member

    The power steering pump is just a gm saginaw pump. I'm running a chevy engine so I just swapped the pressure relief valve from the jag pump into my pump. I don't know if the jag is higher or lower pressure than a ford pump, if it's higher you can get an adjustable valve to lower it. Get the brake fittings that connect the hard line to the flex line. You can use the jag fitting on standard hard line to connect to jag flex lines. This way you can buy standard oe parts, jag stuff is readily available. I'm using a 1 1/8 "corvette" MC with a 7" dual booster. Discs on the rear also. I have a good firm pedal, but I think the 1" MC would be OK. I didn't use the jag "Z" joint for the steering column. I bought a slip shaft from borgeson and it works fine. Flaming river makes them too I think. The borgeson catalog has a listing for what u joints fit. Also, the jag is sae, but my ford rear axle was all metric.
     
  20. zman
    Joined: Apr 2, 2001
    Posts: 16,559

    zman
    Member
    from Garner, NC

    Yep, but even if you don't get the pump get the hoses, they'll come in handy.
     
  21. johnboy13
    Joined: May 1, 2007
    Posts: 1,073

    johnboy13
    Member

    The whole car is up on those welded steel wheel style jack stands that junkyards use. If I use an A-frame hoist to support the engine and suspension from above, can I sawzall the whole thing off the subframe and lower the whole thing to the ground at once?
     
  22. zman
    Joined: Apr 2, 2001
    Posts: 16,559

    zman
    Member
    from Garner, NC

    Just unbolt the motor mounts, then you can unbolt the suspension. Pretty easy really. Not sure where you would sawzall it to get it off, much easier to just unbolt it.
     
  23. johnboy13
    Joined: May 1, 2007
    Posts: 1,073

    johnboy13
    Member

    I didn't wind up getting it. Their idea of a complete subframe only included control arms and the sway bar. Once it was all said and done, it was more than twice what they originally quoted me for just the IFS, I didn't even bother asking about the IRS. I'll keep looking, I already have a lead on a complete car that might go cheap.
     
  24. Couple XJ's on CL up there for about a grand......whole car.
     

Share This Page

Register now to get rid of these ads!

Archive

Copyright © 1995-2020 The Jalopy Journal: Steal our stuff, we'll kick your teeth in. Terms of Service. Privacy Policy.

Atomic Industry
Forum software by XenForo™ ©2010-2014 XenForo Ltd.