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Projects I'm 18 and building my first flathead 59AB+merc crank for my chopped 34 4 door sedan

Discussion in 'Traditional Hot Rods' started by Jesse Borba, Nov 20, 2020.

  1. To help you out with the search. Scroll to the top of the page and right click on the magnifying class. Type in "citric acid" and click on the Search button. You will find alot of answers there on just about anything you want to know. Search.JPG
     
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  2. Rickybop
    Joined: May 23, 2008
    Posts: 6,953

    Rickybop
    Member
    from Michigan

    Just read your last post. Your question about citric acid.

    Citric acid is a natural acid derived from fruit. It's added to a lot of jellies and jams beverages and other things. You may have heard that Coca-Cola will remove rust. That's because it has citric acid in it. We found that citric acid will remove rust without harming most metals. Cattle feed type molasses is relatively inexpensive and has citric acid in it. Guys were mixing it with water and soaking their parts in it to remove every molecule of rust. But then we realized that we could cut to the chase and buy food grade citric acid in powdered form. You can buy smaller amounts at the grocery store in the baking aisle. You can buy larger amounts at baking supply stores or online. It's not very expensive. You mix it with a large amount of water. Soak your parts in it for as long as it takes... 2 days... 2 weeks. Then neutralize the acid in a bath of water and baking soda. The beauty of citric acid is that it doesn't hurt anything when you dispose of it. Your grass will like it.
     
  3. Jesse Borba
    Joined: Nov 20, 2020
    Posts: 99

    Jesse Borba
    Member

    I love all the great knowledge that I've picked up in just TWO days!

    I've always loved and grew up around cars because my dad has a shop at home where he has been building cars for 20 something years but he had always ended up building muscle cars and trucks for the most part but the summer after my freshman year that all changed when we hopped in a bmw that we bought for $700 and drove the 16 hour drive to Bonneville for speedweek and my entire taste in cars changed instantly as soon as I saw the cars there and then the next 2 summers we drove there in our 58 ford pickup that we inherited from by grandpa and that enhanced the experience even more just driving a classic car out on the salt at speedweek in the pits is such an amazing experience and now I'm trying to balance working with my dad on customer's cars, building a 29 roadster pickup with my dad, working on this motor by myself for the most part, and this stupid zoom learning for my senior year.
     
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  4. Jesse Borba
    Joined: Nov 20, 2020
    Posts: 99

    Jesse Borba
    Member

    Thank you so much
     
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  5. Jesse Borba
    Joined: Nov 20, 2020
    Posts: 99

    Jesse Borba
    Member

    Awesome! I'll look into picking up some in a few days when I get back to my dad's
     
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  6. Rickybop
    Joined: May 23, 2008
    Posts: 6,953

    Rickybop
    Member
    from Michigan

    Thank you for sharing that.
    Speed week at Bonneville.
    That'll do it. LOL!
     
  7. Rickybop
    Joined: May 23, 2008
    Posts: 6,953

    Rickybop
    Member
    from Michigan

    Of course, do as warhorseracing suggested and always do your research before proceeding.
    One thing about citric acid, there are certain metals that it will attack. Aluminum is one. Other alloys. The hamb is one of the very few places you'll find that information. Search the hamb.
     
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  8. Jesse Borba
    Joined: Nov 20, 2020
    Posts: 99

    Jesse Borba
    Member

    Ya I definitely caught the bug lol
     
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  9. Jesse Borba
    Joined: Nov 20, 2020
    Posts: 99

    Jesse Borba
    Member

    Ok that means I should definitely get the timing cover and distributor out lol
     
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  10. Fortunateson
    Joined: Apr 30, 2012
    Posts: 3,834

    Fortunateson
    Member

    Wow, brand new member with his first post and already it's Featured! Well done; it must be some kind of record!!!!!
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2020
  11. Yes. Just removing the front cover will also remove the distributer. The pistons you probably will not be able to get out, depends. You will most likely need new ones with a cylinder bore anyway.
     
  12. Welcome! Good to see young people getting into the hot rod sport.:cool:
     
  13. Here is another good source of flathead information:
    [​IMG]
     
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  14. Jesse Borba
    Joined: Nov 20, 2020
    Posts: 99

    Jesse Borba
    Member

    Ok mine must be stuck because I took all the bolts out and it does not want to come off and I'm in the same boat with the water pumps I even got the bolt in the water the water pump housing
     
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  15. Jason Mitchell
    Joined: Sep 4, 2020
    Posts: 40

    Jason Mitchell

    Cool thread. I used to spend Sunday afternoons at my uncles house helping and watching when I was little. Currently building a 59AB for a 29 Tudor. 8BA waiting to be built as well. Interested in following your build.
     
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  16. Nailhead A-V8
    Joined: Jun 11, 2012
    Posts: 1,020

    Nailhead A-V8
    Member

    trans. fluid and diesel mix

    Wow! cool...

    amazon
     
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2020
  17. nobby
    Joined: Jan 8, 2006
    Posts: 639

    nobby
    Member

    if I were doing this again, I would chain drill around the pistons,
    pull the rods out

    and not beat on any of it, its really noisy.

    keep the rods

    don't beat the rods upward.

    if any valves snap, wait until you have removed the cam before you tap them down, if they are stuck in the guides.
    or you will sknooker yourself
     
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  18. 48fordnut
    Joined: Nov 4, 2005
    Posts: 3,936

    48fordnut
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Welcome to the traditional hot rod information center.
    Looks like you have read and following the rules.
    Listen to the guys giving the tips and info out.
    Keep the spirits up by going to events, Bonneville was a great start.

    I am into my second flat head, and have learned lots here.
    I like trans fluid and acetone, or lacquer thinner for breaking things loose.

    jim
     
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  19. Jesse Borba
    Joined: Nov 20, 2020
    Posts: 99

    Jesse Borba
    Member

    Thank you for the tips.
     
  20. sloppy jalopies
    Joined: Jun 29, 2015
    Posts: 4,577

    sloppy jalopies
    Member

    i remember spending a whole day removing the water pump on my first flattie...
    didn't know henry put a mounting bolt through the water hose... luckily mine came out easy...
    some are rust welded...
     
  21. Jesse Borba
    Joined: Nov 20, 2020
    Posts: 99

    Jesse Borba
    Member

    The bolt all came out pretty easy for me but I can't get the water pumps off they're just stuck to the block along with the timing cover.
     
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  22. nobby
    Joined: Jan 8, 2006
    Posts: 639

    nobby
    Member

    there is a bolt inside the pump[
     
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  23. Jesse Borba
    Joined: Nov 20, 2020
    Posts: 99

    Jesse Borba
    Member

    Ya I got that one I never would've found it if the guy who sold me it didn't tell me about it lol
     
  24. A bit pricey but this will free up the pumps, timing cover, basically anything glued on by the old gaskets. It is made to be struck with a hammer. Very useful. You would want to come at the gasket as straight as possible so you don't gouge the block or parts, it will lift and separate things as you tap the end with your hammer. No need to go full Thor on it either, light to medium taps it usually all that it takes.

    https://shop.snapon.com/product/Heavy-Duty-Striking-Scrapers/Single-Bevel-Striking-Scraper/PKNC075
     
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  25. Budget36
    Joined: Nov 29, 2014
    Posts: 5,797

    Budget36
    Member

    @Jesse Borba

    I’ve a set of water pumps off a 221 that have been sitting for years, they spin real tight now, I’m sure they could be fixed. Cool thing is one of them has the heater hose outlet on it

    if you think you will need them PM me your address and I’ll send them out to you
     
  26. Jesse Borba
    Joined: Nov 20, 2020
    Posts: 99

    Jesse Borba
    Member

    Thank you for the offer but would running 21 stud water pumps on a 24 stud motor be a good idea?
     
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  27. ronnieroadster
    Joined: Sep 9, 2004
    Posts: 824

    ronnieroadster
    Member

    Hi Jesse welcome to the HAMB and becoming another flathead nut.
    Here's what I do when I need to save a block like what your working on. This will be long so here goes.
    I spend every day working on flatheads and have had the pleasure of saving a number of them a few looking exactly as yours. The front cover and water pumps should come off with a little persuasion. To remove the front cover I use a lager screw driver to leverage between the block and the area where the distributer goes in. Your front cover is aluminum so I doubt there's anything holding it other than old age. To remove the water pumps using a hammer tap along the rear of the casting. Don't worry about hurting those pumps there worthless new ones are not expensive and easy to get. Submerging the block in the citric acid water mix is what I do to help remove the rust in blocks similar to what you have. However first as much of the grease, sludge and old oil needs to be removed so the acid mixture can work . After I remove the block from the acid mixture i quickly wash it down with water you will find it will surface rust quickly. Also another word of caution do not leave the block in for an extended period the acid will damage the iron the max i would gamble on is 5 days much more than that and the iron surfaces will be damaged causing lots more expense on machine work. When you remove the block from the acid bath and then try to turn the crankshaft do not use the crank pulley bolt the threads are not strong enough to handle much strain. What I do is use the flywheel ring gear teeth as a leverage point against a bolt placed in one of the bell housing bolt holes. I find doing it this way with a good sized pry bar I can now gain a huge amount of leverage to try and move the crankshaft assembly. From what I see in the pictures it certainly looks like a Mercury block. To determine if the crankshaft is a Merc without having to measure the stroke since the pistons are stuck you can simply measure across that large counter balance located on the crankshaft the one behind the first two connecting rods at the front of the block. The measurement from side to side is 6 inches for the Merc 4 inch stroke crankshaft. If the dimension measured side to side is less than 6 inches then the crankshaft is a Ford which is the 3- 3/4 stroke.
    Now a final note if your at Speedweek next year stop by our pit and say hi we will have a few record setting flatheads there you can check out.
    Ronnieroadster
     
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  28. Jesse Borba
    Joined: Nov 20, 2020
    Posts: 99

    Jesse Borba
    Member

    That was full of so much good information thank you so much I'll post an update once I get the water pumps and timing cover off. Thank you for the warning for the amount of time to leave it in the acid I was having a hard time finding that info. If all goes to plan I'll be at speedweek next year!
     
  29. Budget36
    Joined: Nov 29, 2014
    Posts: 5,797

    Budget36
    Member

    I’d bet they’re the same. I used a set that spun free from a 239 I had on the 221

    In fact you should just head my way and pick up what I have. Heads, crank, rods and whatever else from a block I took apart. I should still have another flywheel.
    Tried giving it away in the pay it forward forum, but no one seems to show up and get it. Lol

    Even if you don’t use the stuff, look at all the extra junk you can stuff under the work bench;)

    It’s going to scrap after I empty my trailer anyways
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2020
  30. Budget36
    Joined: Nov 29, 2014
    Posts: 5,797

    Budget36
    Member

    I could save you some drive time as I work nights in Stockton, not far off 99,

    At 18 you need to start a pile;)
     

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