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Hi-Vol SBC oil pump= oil leaks?

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by MarkX, Apr 27, 2004.

  1. MarkX
    Joined: Apr 8, 2003
    Posts: 1,232

    MarkX
    Member
    from ...TX

    am i just goofy or could my hi volume oil pump be some how the reason for my oil leaks.........or is that i have too much blow-by? .......
    Used motor......runs well .... doesnt burn..... no knocks .... good power.....
    but does seem to have some preasure inside the valley its pushing excessive oil out the back of the intake under acceleration?????
     
  2. junk runner jr
    Joined: Dec 21, 2001
    Posts: 456

    junk runner jr
    Member

    You would be correct sir.
     
  3. Deyomatic
    Joined: Apr 17, 2002
    Posts: 3,111

    Deyomatic
    Member
    from CT

    Are you sure it is the back of the intake and not under the distributor? I was told at one time to use 2 gaskets under the dizzy on a SBC. I never got around to it, so I don't know if it would have worked.
    It would seem to me that if the intake was on there correctly and sealed correctly, it shouldn't leak under the additional pressure.
    Someone also condemned the use of high volume oil pumps on here recently, saying that if you need a high volume pump you are just covering up a different problem.
     
  4. Anderson
    Joined: Jan 27, 2003
    Posts: 6,653

    Anderson
    Member

    Yeah, I've heard a lot about running high volume pumps on engines that don't really need them that can lead to leaks. but i don't really know what i'm talking about. anybody else?
     

  5. Berdoo John
    Joined: Mar 5, 2001
    Posts: 269

    Berdoo John
    Member

  6. OldCarPilot
    Joined: Apr 1, 2003
    Posts: 1,288

    OldCarPilot
    Member
    from Bel Air MD

    I have a high pressure pump and no leaks on the intake. Also only one gasket on the dizzy, no leaks there. Mark what pressure do you have with high rpms? Driving around I have about 50psi and at idle its about 20psi.
     
  7. thirtytwo
    Joined: Dec 19, 2003
    Posts: 2,641

    thirtytwo
    Member

    NO...... any kind of of air pessure in your crank case is created by blow by ...pressure from the cylinder goes past the rings and in to the motor.......

    the only possible leaks a hv oil pump might be responsible for would be the valve covers....which is the reason people say not to run them....at high rpm it pumps all the oil to the top , if you dont have the passages open or polished or the are sludged shut the oil wont be able to run down fast enough and you starve the bearings in the bottom end
     
  8. Morrisman
    Joined: Dec 9, 2003
    Posts: 1,600

    Morrisman
    Member
    from England

    Friend of mine had the same problemo, leaking under the back of the intake. Pulled that manifold off 3 or 4 times. Eventually pulled the breathers and found they were all clogged up with shit. Problemo solved.
    Higher oil pressure won't make your motor leak, unless it fills the top end and blowby pressure forces it out your breathers in a big lump, and hi po pumps are prone to do...... [​IMG]
     
  9. OldCarPilot
    Joined: Apr 1, 2003
    Posts: 1,288

    OldCarPilot
    Member
    from Bel Air MD

    What are the breathers?
     
  10. Deyomatic
    Joined: Apr 17, 2002
    Posts: 3,111

    Deyomatic
    Member
    from CT

    Mike, a breather is that thing you had in your tool box that was supposed to pop into the valve cover to filter contaminants out of air going in and keep oil from blowing out. The mushroom shaped thing on the opposite valve cover as your PCV.
     
  11. OldCarPilot
    Joined: Apr 1, 2003
    Posts: 1,288

    OldCarPilot
    Member
    from Bel Air MD

    I know WHAT breathers are... I was just trying to figure out how that fit to Mark's situation. Now if you remember Mark doesn't have such a thing. He just has that one to his air cleaner.
     
  12. McGrath
    Joined: Apr 15, 2002
    Posts: 1,414

    McGrath
    Member

    When you change the intake gaskets throw those black rubber seals in the trash and use silicone on the front and rear of the intake manifold. Those seals are just about worthless, and if you do have a blow-by problem, it will just push them out anyway.
     
  13. Flat Ernie
    Joined: Jun 5, 2002
    Posts: 8,406

    Flat Ernie
    Tech Editor

    [ QUOTE ]
    throw those black rubber seals in the trash and use silicone on the front and rear of the intake manifold

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I just cringe when I see this - I know LOTS of folks who use silly-cone for everything including 1/2" beads it was never designed for & constant exposure to oil which it was never designed for & get away with it. I even realize the factories are using it in this fashion sometimes...it's not what it was meant for.

    I prefer cork end gaskets, but the same applies to the rubber ones. Put your end gaskets on with aviation permatex #2 or 3M weatherstrip adhesive. Be sure & let it dry completely. Then skim the tops with grease or vaseline. You will never have a leak & you will not push them out. If you feel you must, you can put a SMALL dab of RTV in the corners.

    Likewise, use grease to hold gaskets in place.

    The ONLY place I use silly-cone is a very, very thin skim around water passages/jackets. If it's enough to squeeze out - it's WAY too much.

    Just my $.02

    [​IMG]
     
  14. McGrath
    Joined: Apr 15, 2002
    Posts: 1,414

    McGrath
    Member

    [ QUOTE ]

    I just cringe when I see this - I know LOTS of folks who use silly-cone for everything including 1/2" beads it was never designed for & constant exposure to oil which it was never designed for & get away with it.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    If silicone is applied correctly and the surfaces are cleaned with denatured alcohol, the silicone works just fine. If you do it right, and trim off what squeezes out after it cures, Black RTV silicone is more reliable than the gaskets. I have a couple of friends that are Goodwrench mechanics and both of them will tell you the same thing.

    The only way I have seen to make the rubber gaskets stay in place is to centerpunch along the rails and the bottom of the intake. That gives the rubber a mechanical bond instead of just squeezing it between two slick pieces of metal.
     
  15. OldCarPilot
    Joined: Apr 1, 2003
    Posts: 1,288

    OldCarPilot
    Member
    from Bel Air MD

    Edelbrock states in their manifold instructions to NOT use any rubber gaskets and to ONLY put RTV on the vally area. (not the intake gaskets)
     
  16. Flat Ernie
    Joined: Jun 5, 2002
    Posts: 8,406

    Flat Ernie
    Tech Editor

    [ QUOTE ]
    trim off what squeezes out after it cures

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Sounds good - but you can't trim off the stuff on the inside. It can fall off & block oil return/drain-back holes and make it's way down & plug up your oil pump pickup. You wouldn't believe the places I've found balls & beads of silicone!

    [ QUOTE ]
    Black RTV silicone is more reliable than the gaskets.

    [/ QUOTE ]
    Guess we'll agree to disagree on this one. Gaskets are designed to do what they do. Silicone is a band-aid. True, clean helps it last longer, but it's still a band-aid.

    [ QUOTE ]
    I have a couple of friends that are Goodwrench mechanics and both of them will tell you the same thing.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Being a Ford guy, that doesn't hold much water with me [​IMG]


    Seriously, I made a living as a heavy equipment mechanic for several years. Did some automotive work during that time too, but didn't care for the "customer service" aspect of it. Bottom line is, silicone was never designed for continual exposure to petroleum products. Put it in gasoline & it jellies up pretty quickly - same thing happens in oil, it just takes a lot longer. It will not last like a gasket will.

    [ QUOTE ]
    The only way I have seen to make the rubber gaskets stay in place is to centerpunch along the rails and the bottom of the intake

    [/ QUOTE ]
    Again, we'll have to agree to disagree. That method works, but so does mine - please re-read it. No need to mutilate your block & intake. Truth is, you don't want them to NOT move in relation to each other - you want some give. So, Gorilla snot the gasket to the block, coat the top with grease, install intake. Done. The grease allows the gasket/manifold to move in relation to each other while still maintaining a good seal.

    [ QUOTE ]
    Edelbrock states in their manifold instructions to NOT use any rubber gaskets and to ONLY put RTV on the vally area.

    [/ QUOTE ]
    Well, I haven't bought an intake recently, and I do not doubt this. The big 3 all use RTV extensively. They also don't build cars to last like they use to. Draw your own conclusions.

    Bottom line: I don't want to get into any urinary olympics over this. I just feel silicone is overused & misused. Badly. Gaskets work - worked fine on our old cars back in the day. Know what they did? They put grease on their gaskets! Worked then, still works well. This is not an "anti-technology" rant, just that newer isn't always better.

    OK - off soapbox.


    [​IMG]
     
  17. I agree. I used the 3M weatherstrip adhesive to hold the rubber pieces on then put a little dab of RTV in the compound corners and mounted my Ittlebreak(TM) intake on my 327, and now the front/back of the manifold are the CLEANEST parts of my engine. And it looks correct, also.
     

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