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Projects Finding the spot for the SBF

Discussion in 'Traditional Hot Rods' started by PetesPonies, Jun 6, 2020.

  1. PetesPonies
    Joined: Nov 6, 2007
    Posts: 371

    PetesPonies
    Member
    from Maryland

    The engine is sitting a little too high in these pics . . it's just on wood and stuff on the floor. The firewall has been flipped and the center flipped again. I have plenty of room. I will be running a mechanical fan and normal water pump, etc. But for those that have done this before . . anything come to mind as you see my pics? I could go back a little more, but there's plenty of room in the front. I could go forward, easily. Thoughts? engine check.jpg engine check2.jpg engine check 3.jpg engine check 4.jpg engine check 5.jpg
     
    dana barlow and Gammz like this.
  2. Why guess. Put or get radiator, water pump, fan in place.
     
  3. PetesPonies
    Joined: Nov 6, 2007
    Posts: 371

    PetesPonies
    Member
    from Maryland

    Because I have plenty of SBFs in the shop. In cars, on stands etc. I know how much they stick out in the front. I have more than enough space in the front. I could run a 3 1/2' spacer as it is sitting now.
     
  4. Budget36
    Joined: Nov 29, 2014
    Posts: 4,244

    Budget36
    Member

    Might want to mention the vehicle it's going into.
     

  5. PetesPonies
    Joined: Nov 6, 2007
    Posts: 371

    PetesPonies
    Member
    from Maryland

    You're looking at a 1930 Model A cowl.
     
  6. So long as what has to fit either left and right and aft of engine fit's and all moving parts clear, stick it.
     
    Budget36 and PetesPonies like this.
  7. sloppy jalopies
    Joined: Jun 29, 2015
    Posts: 4,182

    sloppy jalopies
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    I like to be able to remove the bell to block bolts...
    if too close to the firewall you can loosen them but not remove them...
    .
    Also, I like to make up a pair of 1/4" plate motor mounts that bolt to the ends of small block ford heads... gusset to a flat flange that is wide enough to rest on both frame rails... then they will hold the front of the engine there while you fine tune...
    my $0.01...
     
    Last edited: Jun 10, 2020
    hotrodjack33 likes this.
  8. 66gmc
    Joined: Dec 4, 2005
    Posts: 553

    66gmc
    Member

    Assemble the whole car... engine, trans, suspension, steering, rad, pedals,exhaust ect. TACK weld everything in...once your happy with how everything fits/ and the car is comfortable to sit in, then blow it apart and finish weld everything.
    An old hot rodder told me this when I was building my first car, and its some of the best advice I've ever gotten. It doesnt matter how well you plan things, there is always some little piece that doesnt fit, and its much easier to cut apart a tack weld, then a finish weld....or worse...find out something won't fit after final paint!
     
  9. PetesPonies
    Joined: Nov 6, 2007
    Posts: 371

    PetesPonies
    Member
    from Maryland

    Right, and with the engine sitting higher as is, hard to tell how much interference there will be. I think I need to put a bell on it and lower the engine.
     
    Desoto291Hemi likes this.
  10. BamaMav
    Joined: Jun 19, 2011
    Posts: 4,425

    BamaMav
    Member
    from Berry, AL

    I'm thinking you want it about 1" off the firewall at least. Nothing really going on back there, no distributor to clear, etc. I'm with Johnny Gee, I think I'd put the accessories on the front of the engine and put the radiator in it's final position to be sure. You still have to clear the cross member.with the pan and pulleys, that space gets eaten up real quick.
     
    hotrodjack33 likes this.
  11. PetesPonies
    Joined: Nov 6, 2007
    Posts: 371

    PetesPonies
    Member
    from Maryland

    After welding the engine mounts, I will mount the front suspension. I have it ready to go. it's just easier to place the engine with it lower to the ground.
     
  12. PetesPonies
    Joined: Nov 6, 2007
    Posts: 371

    PetesPonies
    Member
    from Maryland

    As it sits in the picture, there's 13" from the front intake bolt to the crossmember. There's at least an extra inch, as is, even with a 3 1/2" fan spacer. Certainly no need for a spacer that long . .but the clearance is there.
     
  13. flatford39
    Joined: Dec 3, 2006
    Posts: 2,674

    flatford39
    Member

    I really like how you flipped the firewall and then flipped the center of the firewall back. How much additional space did this achieve you think.
     
  14. PetesPonies
    Joined: Nov 6, 2007
    Posts: 371

    PetesPonies
    Member
    from Maryland

    I think the flip added 4" or so. I actually didn't measure, but there's at least that much. I flipped the center part to get the beads looking right. It's all just tacked, still have to do all the welding and metal finishing to make it look factory. No biggie.
     
  15. I think you would want to mock up your steering before you commit to a final mounting position. And as a general rule, the lower/further back you get the motor the better your handling will be.
     
  16. Ericnova72
    Joined: May 1, 2007
    Posts: 429

    Ericnova72
    Member

    Just my opinion, but when you get them too far away from the firewall it starts to look goofy....right now you're too far away IMO. Maybe it's just the pictire angle and the fact the valvecovers aren't there. 3" from firewall to head looks about right.
     
  17. PetesPonies
    Joined: Nov 6, 2007
    Posts: 371

    PetesPonies
    Member
    from Maryland

    Yep, that is why I have it positioned so far back at this point.
     
    sloppy jalopies likes this.
  18. PetesPonies
    Joined: Nov 6, 2007
    Posts: 371

    PetesPonies
    Member
    from Maryland

    The engine is sitting behind the cowl now. The firewall is flipped, so I have a lot of room. But from the side, part of the head is actually behind the cowl.
     
  19. 27 Tall T
    Joined: Dec 16, 2005
    Posts: 304

    27 Tall T
    Member
    from Butler Pa.

    What transmission are you going to use? I would at least put the bellhousing on.
     
  20. PetesPonies
    Joined: Nov 6, 2007
    Posts: 371

    PetesPonies
    Member
    from Maryland

    Toploader. I mentioned above I am mounting the bell.
     
  21. X-cpe
    Joined: Mar 9, 2018
    Posts: 998

    X-cpe

    Reversing firewalls reduces leg room. GMC66 gave you some great advice.
     
  22. PetesPonies
    Joined: Nov 6, 2007
    Posts: 371

    PetesPonies
    Member
    from Maryland

    LOL seriously? I didn't know that? I said it gained 4 inches of clearance, where would it have come from?
     
    uncle buck likes this.
  23. X-cpe
    Joined: Mar 9, 2018
    Posts: 998

    X-cpe

    Building cars is just like life, you have to give some to get some. It sounds like you have made your acceptable compromise.
     
    loudbang likes this.
  24. PetesPonies
    Joined: Nov 6, 2007
    Posts: 371

    PetesPonies
    Member
    from Maryland

    That was never a consideration. I didn't ask that in the beginning. I was asking about best placement for items, like steering, bell housing etc. Things people have mentioned above. Loosing a couple inches of leg room is not a concern or I would have not flipped the firewall. You have a Model A with a Ford engine in it?
     
    loudbang likes this.
  25. canning
    Joined: Jan 22, 2012
    Posts: 70

    canning
    Member

    I would add an intake and check carb flange with a level. Tilt can effect clearances.
     
    loudbang likes this.
  26. PetesPonies
    Joined: Nov 6, 2007
    Posts: 371

    PetesPonies
    Member
    from Maryland

    Sure, but I don't have the frame sitting at any specific angle yet. lever means nothing if the frame isn't sitting how it will be sitting. I should be able to alter that with my trans mount These brackets I bought are meant to be welded to a Model A frame.
     
    loudbang likes this.
  27. May or may not help with location ideas. Crank center-line slightly above original and fan close to radiator. Usually have the body and frame on wheels at ride height to judge how the engine &transmission will match up with the steering, exhaust, etc.
    sbf a.jpg
     
    loudbang likes this.
  28. PetesPonies
    Joined: Nov 6, 2007
    Posts: 371

    PetesPonies
    Member
    from Maryland

    That's a good picture, thanks. Your mounts sit on top of the frame. Mine do not. But of course you have to factor in the entire mount assembly as to how high it is holding the engine. But are your lower head bolt holes a lot higher than the frame rails? They appear to be. Mine is sitting a lot lower and it's not as low as it will actually be.
     
    loudbang likes this.
  29. PetesPonies
    Joined: Nov 6, 2007
    Posts: 371

    PetesPonies
    Member
    from Maryland

    I take back my question about height as mine is sitting close to the way yours is . .height wise. In these pics, I raised the frame, front and rear. Engine sitting on the floor the same as it was. I added the bell housing and intake. I slide the engine about 1" forward. I still have about 12" to where the radiator will sit, from the front intake bolt. I could still run a 2" spacer as it is sitting now . .so still lots of room. engine check 6.jpg engine check 7.jpg engine check 8.jpg
     
    loudbang likes this.
  30. 6sally6
    Joined: Feb 16, 2014
    Posts: 1,261

    6sally6
    Member

    To me...........it's still too far forward!
    Prolly need a FE engine to get the space 'looking right'.
    J/K
    Really hard to tell until the carb(s) air cleaner...all that external stuff is in place.
    6sally6
     

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