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Projects DRAG SNAKE "Vintage Terror!"

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Deuced Up!, Oct 13, 2017.

  1. Deuced Up!
    Joined: Feb 8, 2008
    Posts: 3,529

    Deuced Up!
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Well we have been about the Cobra this weekend (so far anyway). Just to get to these stupid upper "A" arm bolts we had to remove the radiator supports, the cooling fan, the radiator hoses, the expansion tank and its mounting bracket, the starter selenoid and wiring and then finally the aluminum engine compartment panels on either side. Then of course we had to crank down the coil over springs (total pain in the backside) and then remove the coil overs shocks.

    So after playing around with them a bit and making a decision on what we needed to do I had another issue to address. I had not planned to be back this far in the build at least not for sometime, but after getting the motor in place etc. there was a small issue. Well actually a big issue a few hours ago because to address it we would have to had to done all the above before we could deal with it. The issue....? The stance.

    With all the weight finally in place, even with the coil overs cranked up quite a bit, we still had a very low down, nose down attitude. The whole car had a very nice rake, if it was any car but a Dragonsnake it would be perfect. But those cars all had their noses lifted and although the my car looked very cool, in my oppinion it was missing that stance. After studying the situation for a bit and considering several options we decided moving the upper shock mount down would do the trick and be the least envasive.

    Resized_20191109_190738 (2).jpeg
    As you can see above we decided to drop it 1.5" We created a steel template out of 3/8" steel plate to use not only as pattern but a drill guide. We put bolt through it and the original hole. Then aligned it and clamped it in place before drilling the new holes. Then we simply put it all back together. Cranked up the coil overs, installed the wheels and tires and had look see!

    Resized_20191109_164124.jpeg

    Resized_20191109_163257.jpeg

    Resized_20191109_162138.jpeg

    Resized_20191109_162444.jpeg
    I am very happy. It was a lot of work but well worth it in the end. AND the cool part is below.

    Resized_20191109_190808.jpeg
    After it was all back in place Dad asked what I was going to do with the shock mounts we just made obsolete? Wack them off and round them over? In that moment it hit me and with out even missing a beat I said, nope. I am going to mount a transverse spring right there! It is the exact spot the originals would have been mounted. Of course this one will just be for looks but it will fill the area between the radiator and pulleys that was originally occupied by the cooling fan. Since it got flipped to the front, there is sort a hole there. The spring will fill the place perfectly and give the engine compartment an even more authentic look!
     
  2. Deuced Up!
    Joined: Feb 8, 2008
    Posts: 3,529

    Deuced Up!
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Oh and one other unexpected bonus from our little foray into suspension height modification is the camber issue that started this whole mess is POOF...gone!

    Camber.jpg
    I wished I had taken a photo of this area before we started but at the time, this was not an issue I expected to be fixing. Before we started Dad stuck a carpenter's square up against the wheel and flat on the level floor. The stupid thing had so much negative camber that at the top, according to the square and stuck in carpenter lingo for the moment, it was nearly 1.75" out of plumb! LOL

    After we made the adjustment and bounced on the front end a bit to get it to settle in place, I noticed the difference right away. I took the same square and it was nearly dead nuts perfect on the passenger side and within an 1/8" on the driver side.
     
    Last edited: Nov 10, 2019
  3. Deuced Up!
    Joined: Feb 8, 2008
    Posts: 3,529

    Deuced Up!
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    And I have an update on the radiator. I was talking to Summit yesterday just to see if there was anything they would do as far as warranty. I had purchased the unit in October 2018 which was not as long ago as I had thought. However she said she was sorry it only had a one year warranty so there was nothing she could do.

    So I started to explain to her the fact that it has sat in its box the entire year. Only very recently was it installed and just about a month ago we fired the car for the first time and discovered the issue. She said she understood and was very sorry but there was nothing she could do for me.

    I said the only reason I was asking for some help is the fact that this was definitely an issue from the manufacturer. I added the area it was leaking was very high up almost in the corner. There was no way we could have damaged it there installing the fan. The area is nearly 6" from the closet fan mount tab. I said we started the car and was well into its first heat cycle when it just starting shooting water. I said we were able to complete the engine break-in that day because a buddy simply pinched the area off and relegated the leak from a solid stream to a slow drip.

    She immediately said, "Oh, so you modified the radiator?" I said I would not call it a modification, we simply attempted the pinch off the leak. She said well if you had not done that, we would have extended your warranty and taken care of it. But since you modified it, we will not be able to offer any assistance.

    I said wait a minute, you just told me TWICE, before I mentioned doing anything to it, that there was nothing you could do for me because it was out of warranty! She said no I didn't say that. I said you most certainly did! She said no I said we could extend your warranty if you had not modified it. I said you didn't even know about the "modification" before you denied me a warranty TWICE! She said was not true. I said how about you send me on up to a supervisor. I had quick conversation with him and he said he had very limited power on the weekends to make a decision like this and asked if I could call back on Monday. So I am betting I get another radiator out this deal.
     
  4. Offset
    Joined: Nov 9, 2010
    Posts: 1,594

    Offset
    Member
    from Canada

    I heard you tell her that you modified right off the bat.:D How could you say you did not? LoL

    Wonderful customer service, I wish you luck. Let them know at Summit how many hits this thread has.
     
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  5. Finn Jensen
    Joined: Dec 20, 2008
    Posts: 586

    Finn Jensen
    Member

    I am surprised that you are getting this push-back BS. My experience over many years has been that Summit has always been reasonable where the customer is clearly not at fault, regardless of the boilerplate. You might want to mention to the supervisor that there are many of Summit's customers that are watching how the company is handling this customer issue with keen interest.
     
  6. doyoulikesleds
    Joined: Jul 12, 2014
    Posts: 227

    doyoulikesleds

    Ya make sure to tell them how important you are that always makes people more helpful than they have to be
     
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  7. Deuced Up!
    Joined: Feb 8, 2008
    Posts: 3,529

    Deuced Up!
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    This morning I hit the shop excited about the prospect of fabricating a transverse leaf spring (albeit for looks only) for the little Cobra. I measured the distance side to side between the original shock mounts, now just above the current shock mount points. It was right at 32 inches, center to center of the mount holes. I have seen really good looking examples of aluminum strips laid on each other resembling a spring. However they basically just run side to side and end at the side panels. I am hoping to actually run through the side panels and mount them as noted to the original upper shock mounts. Just for grins I stepped out to the only original set of springs on the property right now, from a 1948 Thames van.

    Resized_20191110_165433.jpeg Above is all the original stuff from the van, frame and front and rear suspensions.

    Resized_20191110_165506.jpeg The rear was way to wide and heavy duty however the front looked to be an interestingly close size. After putting the tape measure to it, I about fell over. It was about 32.75" from eye to eye. It took a bit of persuading but as you can see above, I finally wrestled it free.

    Original English Spring.jpg
    I scraped on it while and then ground it a bit with a grinder wheel. Then I took it to the local car wash and shot the crap out if for a while. When I got back to the shop it was relatively clean for a 70 plus year old original part. I immediately dropped it in place in the Cobra engine compartment. It was pretty close. In fact after looking at it, it was obvious all I needed to do was make a short shackle that fit the shock mount on one side and could take the spring eye in the other.

    Custom Shackle.jpg
    Easy breezy right? Well I quickly fabricated the first mount and test fit it. It was going to work perfectly however at that point it was obvious mounting the spring this way put it way to high in the original engine compartment. I went online and Googled 1964 AC Cobra engine compartment hoping to find a shot that showed the spring. I found several. They appeared to be right round or just under the center point of the water pump. My spring, mounted this way was WAY above that. So back to the drawing board.

    I took the spring to the cut off saw and lopped off both eyes trying to keep the spring as long as possible. I laid it back in place and now it went all the way down and simply sat on the tops of the shocks. Looking at it sitting there it appeared, according to photos of original cars, to be just about perfect. Actually looking at it there it almost looked like if the eye was reversed it would fit in the mount with no shackle etc. I snagged a couple of long bolts, put the cut off eyes in place upside down and slid the bolts in to hold them. With the spring laying right under them it was obvious if I just welded them back in place it would fit like a glove.

    Reversed Eyelet.jpg
    Before testing the eyes (upside down) I had to cut about .5" off both of them. This would allow them to slip in the original shock mount in question. Then I welded both of them back on and ground it all down to look original AND IT DOES!

    Resized_20191110_135055.jpeg
    This is what the finished product looked like after putting the ends back on.

    Resized_20191110_135103.jpeg
    And check this out. The crazy thing slid right in place like it was supposed to be there!

    Resized_20191110_140056.jpeg

    Resized_20191110_140111.jpeg
    It looks so freaking cool. Now of course I have to build a chassis tower under it to give it the final official look but no problem with that as I already have a plan in the works.

    Resized_20191110_153143.jpeg
    And the final news about this little edit involves the radiator expansion tank. We have known for more than a year that our expansion tank was not correct for a 289 car. However we had so much invested in it that I decided to do our best to use it. As you know we eventually moved it closer to where the small block cars units were. We might have gotten away with it but in the process and to make it work we had to basically spin it around changing the direction of flow. It looked good but there was an issue with flow. We tuned the car in the dark and did not actually see the thing run in the light of day for a week. When we we finally got to play with it a few days later, we noticed under hard revs, the top radiator hose would collapse a bit. It has to be the tank. SO.
    tank.jpg

    I snagged this, which if I had been better educated on these cars when I started buying parts, I would have snagged this in the first place. It is pretty close to what an original Competition AC Cobra 289 car would have been running. AND guess where it mounts? You guessed it. Right on top of the original transverse spring! LMAO.
     
    Last edited: Nov 10, 2019
  8. Deuced Up!
    Joined: Feb 8, 2008
    Posts: 3,529

    Deuced Up!
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    You know, the cool part... In case you were not paying attention to where the spring came from is the fact that it is an English transverse leaf spring. I mean come on, what are the odds of that?!! LOL
     
  9. Coming together really nice! Stance is right on.
     
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  10. Deuced Up!
    Joined: Feb 8, 2008
    Posts: 3,529

    Deuced Up!
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    So I am going to tell on myself a bit here. Of course we have never held back on this thread. It is what it is. But you remember back when my "supposedly" reversible radiator fan was not reversible, right? I mean I spent quite a bit of cash on the stupid thing and the night before we fired the car I wired it up and sure enough it was installed in the engine compartment just pushing away...LOL!

    I did not have the box nor could we find the instructions etc. but how hard could it be right. I mean this is not the first reversible fan I have installed. So we just switched the lead wires expecting it to change directions. It didn't. So I managed to get in there and pull the front cover off prepared to flip the fan blade around. It could not be flipped!

    So at this point what is there left to do. I just decided it was a goof and I ordered the wrong fan. We removed it and managed to get it installed on the front where it belonged. All is well right? Well last night I was looking through my Summit Racing emails making sure I had all the correct part numbers and dates etc. for the call this morning regarding the radiator. On the same invoice as the stupid radiator was the fan. AND right there in boldface type it says REVERSIBLE!

    So now I am really fairly hot, not only have I got a faulty Fluidyne radiator from them but I had not messed up at all when I ordered the fan. It said right there on the receipt, it was reversible. Thinking that would give me a bit more leverage on the radiator, I called the fan maker this morning to confirm and let them know Summit was calling this thing reversible and selling as such. They said correct, it is reversible.

    I am like well I would sure as hell like to know what one has to do reverse it. I tried switching the leads and that didn't work. The blade can not be flipped over. So exactly how does one reverse it?
    He kind of laughed and said turn the unit around. If you want it to push install it so it pushes. If you want it to pull, flip the entire unit around and install it so it pulls. I was like...you have got to be kidding me?!!!

    He was a really cool guy. He just laughed and said I was not the first. He said they got so tired of trying to explain to idiots how to either flip the fan blades or reverse the leads that their engineers just designed it flush on both sides so it could be installed either way. I said so now you just have to talk to the other idiots like me right? He just laughed. Kuddos to them though. That is a very good idea! LMAO
     
  11. Brand Apart
    Joined: Jan 22, 2011
    Posts: 556

    Brand Apart
    Member
    from Roswell GA

    Now that is funny about the fan.
     
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  12. 64 DODGE 440
    Joined: Sep 2, 2006
    Posts: 4,009

    64 DODGE 440
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from so cal

    Sometimes logic really works.
     
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  13. Deuced Up!
    Joined: Feb 8, 2008
    Posts: 3,529

    Deuced Up!
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Well let me put in a good word about Summit Racing. They are taking care of me on the radiator. It took a while to get through the gatekeepers and I totally recognize the value of having a few hoops to jump through to protect the profit/loss margins. But after my conversation got to he correct level they responded immediately and took care of my issue.

    I really appreciate that kind of service. I mean officially the thing was out of warranty and they could have most certainly stood behind that and been correct in doing so. However having them take the time to listen to the special circumstance surrounding the product in question and having the ware-with-all to make a good decision based on customer service versus company policy is more than commendable.

    Again, thank you to Summit Racing, you have not only earned my respect but my continued patronage. I feel very good about spending money with a company like this and I will continue to do so probably more now than before.
     
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2019
  14. ROADSTER1927
    Joined: Feb 14, 2009
    Posts: 2,573

    ROADSTER1927
    Member

    GOOD BOTH WAYS!!! YAY:D
     
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  15. oldolds
    Joined: Oct 18, 2010
    Posts: 2,771

    oldolds
    Member

    What probably helped the most with the radiator is the fact that it is not the only thing you ever bought from them. They can look at what you were buying and see you are a repeat customer with few returns, ect.
     
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  16. DDDenny
    Joined: Feb 6, 2015
    Posts: 12,338

    DDDenny
    Member
    from oregon

    Yeh, the squeaky wheel gets the grease as they say.
    Standing your ground works best but giving them the opportunity to rectify it with the facts in a civil manner also helps.
    I can imagine that customer service reps deal with less than honest people many times during their day, that and "company policy" puts customers in a defensive position, especially when they know their complaint is justified.
    I've only been in this position once and can't remember if it was Summit or Jegs.
    As with most projects, components sit on the shelf long after the stated warranty or "company policy", generally one year.
    In my case it was a new Hurst Quarter Stick shifter that was broken when taken out of the box the first time, of course well over a year after purchase.
    As oldolds stated, a good purchase history helped but it was being assertive in a civil manner that more than likely got it rectified.
     
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2019
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  17. Peanut 1959
    Joined: Oct 11, 2008
    Posts: 1,607

    Peanut 1959
    Member

    I have thoroughly enjoyed reading your posts over the last few days! I love it when a few things actually fall into place. The extra aesthetic improvements are just terrific!

    I will point out that the correct term is
    "wherewithal," but that doesn't matter as much as them standing by their products! Carry on!
     
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  18. Deuced Up!
    Joined: Feb 8, 2008
    Posts: 3,529

    Deuced Up!
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Thanks for the grammar assist. I didn't catch it. NOR did my fancy ass computer. LOL!
     
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2019
  19. Peanut 1959
    Joined: Oct 11, 2008
    Posts: 1,607

    Peanut 1959
    Member

    I try not to be pedantic when it comes to grammar on a car forum, but I know we have a lot of forum members who speak english as a second (or third, or fourth!) language. I'm sure a lot of them rely on online translation programs to help make sense of our comments!
     
  20. Deuced Up!
    Joined: Feb 8, 2008
    Posts: 3,529

    Deuced Up!
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Trust me there are plenty of pettifogging opportunities here on the HAMB outside of grammar. See I can use obscure words too...LMAO! Thanks for the laugh Peanut!

    Sent from my SM-G970U using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
     
  21. DDDenny
    Joined: Feb 6, 2015
    Posts: 12,338

    DDDenny
    Member
    from oregon

    Reminds me of the saying "Don't sweat the petty stuff, pet the sweaty stuff".
     
  22. Deuced Up!
    Joined: Feb 8, 2008
    Posts: 3,529

    Deuced Up!
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    ColorRender.jpg
    A little photoshop preview.
     
  23. Deuced Up!
    Joined: Feb 8, 2008
    Posts: 3,529

    Deuced Up!
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

  24. saltflats
    Joined: Aug 14, 2007
    Posts: 9,556

    saltflats
    Member
    from Missouri

    Is that the box like your other radiator came in? The hand hole in the box looks close to where the cut was in your radiator.
     
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  25. Deuced Up!
    Joined: Feb 8, 2008
    Posts: 3,529

    Deuced Up!
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

  26. Deuced Up!
    Joined: Feb 8, 2008
    Posts: 3,529

    Deuced Up!
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Well boys and girls for the past week I have been sketching the different ways to get an original looking front chassis tower attached to what was already there. The original was sort of a triangular looking apparatus that ran from chassis rail to chassis rail just aft of the radiator. The transverse leaf spring attached to the top of it and the lower "A" arms hung off the bottom etc.

    Front.jpg

    Resized_20191116_114944.jpeg
    For my little triangle, I started by making a poster board template of the front side. After several edits I was finally happy enough to outline it on a steel and get after it with the plasma cutter.

    Resized_20191116_123745.jpeg
    Of course I have a few obstacles on the driver's side. Both the lower radiator hose and the steering rod run on the very outside area of the base of the triangle. You can see above how I had to make an edit there for them. After I had both side pieces cut and cleaned up we determined how wide the area should be. Three inches seemed like it would be about perfect.

    Resized_20191116_185840.jpeg
    So I cut 3" wide strips of the same sheet metal and welded the front and rear sections together with them in the middle. After a little grinding and round the outer edges, my little apparatus, while just made of sheet metal looks fairly substancial.

    Resized_20191116_135100.jpeg
    We dropped the apparatus in place and test fit the spring back on top of it. I was very happy as it absolutely fit like a glove.

    Resized_20191116_135054.jpeg
    After seeing it was all going to go back together perfectly we took a look at the new expansion tank to see if it was going to git as well.

    Resized_20191116_182202.jpeg
    We also fabricated a mounting plate on top of the spring and bolted it all in place. The u-bolts are pushed through from the bottom and tacked in place. Then the plate is put on top and the nuts applied, this is what actually holds the new apparatus securely in place.

    Resized_20191116_182152.jpeg
    I have to fabricate a couple of straps and a mounting tab but this is the general area. I did have the entire front inner hood area covered with a very cool custom aluminum panel. However the new tank is going to need all the room possible so I will have to come up with a new design. But sitting there in place, with the panel removed, the hood closes perfectly. So that is pretty exciting.
     
  27. oldolds
    Joined: Oct 18, 2010
    Posts: 2,771

    oldolds
    Member

    Why would you add all that extra weight to a race car? If it isn't there to make it go fast, leave it on the scrap pile.
     
  28. loudbang
    Joined: Jul 23, 2013
    Posts: 23,447

    loudbang
    Member

  29. Peanut 1959
    Joined: Oct 11, 2008
    Posts: 1,607

    Peanut 1959
    Member

    Have you seen Ford v Ferrari, yet? It's a really good film...even though Christian Bale's character (Ken Miles) trash talks Studebakers (and Plymouths)!
     
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  30. Deuced Up!
    Joined: Feb 8, 2008
    Posts: 3,529

    Deuced Up!
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    No I have not seen it yet, I am excited to go though! Hoping Hollywood doesn't destroy the real story, it had plenty of drama with out their usually treatments etc.!
     

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