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History Classic Indy roadsters: Most beautiful oval racers ever?

Discussion in 'Traditional Hot Rods' started by Bill McGuire, Mar 19, 2013.

  1. Speedwrench
    Joined: Nov 21, 2009
    Posts: 1,030

    Speedwrench
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    Last edited: May 1, 2014
  2. Rootie Kazoootie
    Joined: Nov 27, 2006
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    Rootie Kazoootie
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    from Colorado

    For 1967 there was 2 Mallards entered, Herk was a DNQ and Ebb Rose wrecked the other one in practice but don't know how bad.
     

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  3. Great photos, thanks!

    Yes, as I understand it, two Mallards were originally built, one for Herk and the other for Ebb Rose, though the Rose car was wrecked. There were two versions of the Mallard at Eddie Evans' museum in Bedford, IN, as pictured above, but the one with the later bodywork was a roller or mockup.
     
  4. Rootie Kazoootie
    Joined: Nov 27, 2006
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    Rootie Kazoootie
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    from Colorado

    Kurtis didn't build many right side drive cars. Two of them were the Bardahl team cars of 1957 driven by Keller and Turner. Keller had some problems but Turner finished 11th. Note the "map" pocket :) in the last pic.
     

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  5. steel rebel
    Joined: Jun 14, 2006
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    steel rebel
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    I remember in the late '60s a roadster did qualify fast enough and could have run if it hadn't been pulled. I think it was a Hurtubise car.
     
  6. Rootie Kazoootie
    Joined: Nov 27, 2006
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    Rootie Kazoootie
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    from Colorado

    Herk qualified the Mallard in 68 and lasted 9 laps before blowing up. That was it for Indy but he did qualify it for a Michigan race as late as 72. (This was the 2nd gen 'wedge' car.)
     
  7. steel rebel
    Joined: Jun 14, 2006
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    steel rebel
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    Aside from that wasn't their a year he did qualify fast enough and threw out the time and didn't get in?
     
  8. Rootie Kazoootie
    Joined: Nov 27, 2006
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    Rootie Kazoootie
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    from Colorado

    Not that I'm aware of. Maybe you're thinking of Jigger Sirois's 1969 attempt. (Though he wasn't driving a roadster)
     

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  9. steel rebel
    Joined: Jun 14, 2006
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    steel rebel
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    No Rootie I think my memory is good on this one. I did have a conversation with a friend a while back and he remembered the same thing. Let's see if somebody here can confirm my memory.

    What I remember is he waved off a qualifying speed that would have been fast enough to make the field and their was no roadsters in that race or any Indy 500s in the future.
     
    Last edited: May 5, 2014
  10. Rootie Kazoootie
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    Rootie Kazoootie
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    from Colorado

    Yeah that's very possible. He did only take qual. 3 laps in 69 but I don't what speeds he ran.
     

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  11. steel rebel
    Joined: Jun 14, 2006
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    steel rebel
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    Went to the Paso Robles Ca. Car/Air/Military/Much more show last weekend. This is not the Custom Car show. This one is held at the airport/museums. If you get a chance to go to this in the future don't miss it. This year Bobby Unser was there talking to people and signing autographs. Anyway in the Car Museum was this beautifully restored Indy roadster. SANY0088.jpg SANY0089.jpg
     
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  12. deucemac
    Joined: Aug 31, 2008
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    deucemac
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    I may be wrong but as I understand it, Watson narrowed the Kurtis chassis 2" in his original design. Whatever he did it sure worked. Watsons were fast and beautiful. Rootie, Mac Miller, do you know anything about the chassis narrowing?
     
  13. Rootie Kazoootie
    Joined: Nov 27, 2006
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    Rootie Kazoootie
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    from Colorado

    Not sure about the chassis dimensions though Mac probably is. This may be of interest:
    img315.jpg
     
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  14. Rootie Kazoootie
    Joined: Nov 27, 2006
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    Rootie Kazoootie
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    from Colorado

    freeland 56.JPG img317.jpg img316.jpg This is kinda interesting also
     
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  15. Speedwrench
    Joined: Nov 21, 2009
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    Speedwrench
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    I'm not sure if it has been mentioned on this thread or not, but A J Watson died at age 90 on May 12, 2014 in Indy.

    Sorry if this is a repeat.
     
  16. mac miller
    Joined: Jan 13, 2007
    Posts: 522

    mac miller
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    from INDY

    The Watson roadster frame measures 32" wide at the seatback, tapering to 30" at the front axle.
    The Kurtis 500A and 500B measure 32" wide at the seatback and 30" at the front axle
    The Kurtis 500C, 500D and 500F NOVI measure 35" at the seatback and 32" at the front axle.
    The Kurtis 500G, 500J and 500K NOVI frames are 32" at the seatback and 30" at the front axle.
    The Belond laydown and most of the Epperly laydowns were 32" at the seatback and 30" at the front axle.
    These two blogs at my roadster website kind of show why the Watsons were so good.

    http://indyroadsters.webs.com/apps/...-kurtis-500g-roadster-vs-the-watson-roadster-

    http://indyroadsters.webs.com/apps/...gine-vs-upright-engine-a-technical-comparison

    mac miller in INDY
     
  17. ago
    Joined: Oct 12, 2005
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    ago
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    from pgh. pa.

    Anything new guys?


    Ago
     
  18. more chassis photos and drawings and dimensions and plans are greatly appreciated. excellent thread.
     
  19. ago
    Joined: Oct 12, 2005
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    ago
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    from pgh. pa.

    This is an article from May 1952 Popular Science. very interesting.
    Sorry give me a minute

    Ago
     
  20. ago
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    ago
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    from pgh. pa.

     
  21. ago
    Joined: Oct 12, 2005
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    I try again, very interesting from an older time in Indy Racing
    Article from May 1952 Popular Science balanger.jpg balanger 1.jpg balanger 2.jpg balanger 3 1.jpg balanger 3.jpg balanger 4.jpg balanger 5.jpg balanger 6.jpg
     
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  22. Great stuff, Ago. Thanks for sharing!
     
  23. mac miller
    Joined: Jan 13, 2007
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    mac miller
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    from INDY

    IMG_4508.JPG IMG_4506.JPG IMG_4507.JPG IMG_4542.JPG IMG_4545.JPG IMG_4547.JPG RonnieDuman-vi.jpg Here is a new one nearing completion in my shop. "1964 #64 Clean Wear Spl." driven by Ronnie Duman.
     
    Last edited: Jan 4, 2015
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  24. ago
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    from pgh. pa.

  25. wisdonm
    Joined: Jun 20, 2011
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    wisdonm
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    What power train is being used in the 64 car? Ball park figure to recreate a similar machine?
     
  26. mac miller
    Joined: Jan 13, 2007
    Posts: 522

    mac miller
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    from INDY

    This car has a Nissan 240sx engine, JATCO 4 spd automatic trans and a Currie 8" Ford rear axle.
    Costs range from 55 thou to 75thou depending on wheels&tires, engine&trans, shocks&springs, brakes, steering gear and instruments. Upholstery, paint and graphics cost whatever the customer wants to spend.
    mac miller in INDY
     
  27. wisdonm
    Joined: Jun 20, 2011
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    wisdonm
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    Thanks Mac. See you at the reunion.
     
  28. silent rick
    Joined: Nov 7, 2002
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    silent rick
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    it's a shame they allow those cars to parade around at certain events. it's keeping away guys with original cars.
     
  29. mac miller
    Joined: Jan 13, 2007
    Posts: 522

    mac miller
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    from INDY

    Well, SilentRick, Thanks for your comment…
    I’ve, certainly, heard similar comments before, almost always from amateur historians, amateur journalists and other “spectator” class people wandering around the paddock looking for something to whine and complain about.
    Oddly enough, I haven’t heard these comments from the “genuine” car owners or actual “on track” participants at these events.

    Just to establish your credibility to, even, make such a comment, hopefully, you will post a photo of any “genuine” cars that you own, that are sitting, idle, in your garage, in protest of replica cars……

    My cars and other replicas appear at these vintage meets under no pretence, but most of the “genuine” cars are not nearly as genuine as you would like to believe. Most were salvaged as hacked up, butchered super modifieds, requiring new frames and bodywork.
    I know because I have been involved with a number of these restorations.
    There are “genuine” cars out there with no more than a few feet of the original frame tubing.

    Fortunately, the replicas are included in these events because after a few “on track” hours some of the “genuine” cars are on the sidelines with technical problems and many more of the “genuine” cars run a very limited number of laps.
    Most of the replicas are constantly on the track, running every lap of every session, every day.

    Actually, I really like my cars… my customers really like my cars…. A.J. Watson really liked my cars….. Parnelli Jones likes my cars….the other owners and “on track“ participants like my cars… and the organizers of the vintage events like my cars ….. so your opinion really means absolutely “zero” to me.

    I can assure you that if my cars didn’t show up for an event, they would be missed.
    If you didn’t show up for an event, I doubt that anyone would notice or care.

    Looking forward to seeing pix of your “genuine” cars.
    mac miller in INDY
     
    Last edited: Jan 5, 2015

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