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History Auto racing 1894-1942

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by kurtis, Jul 18, 2009.

  1. Don Capps
    Joined: Feb 13, 2010
    Posts: 111

    Don Capps
    Member

    Actually, the photograph is from 1902 when the Baker Torpedo participated in the 31 May speed trials on Staten Island (flying kilometer and mile). The Torpedo crashed into the crowd resulting in several deaths and serious injuries -- as well as leading the Automobile Club of America to pass a series of resolutions citing the dangers of speed contests on public roads and supporting the use of tracks for racing events.

    Here is the aftermath of the crash (New York Tribune, 1 June 1902, 1):

    1902 05 31 Staten Island Baker Torpedo 4b j3.jpg

    Here is a schematic view of the Torpedo:

    1902 06 05 Motor World 290 Baker Torpedo 2 a.jpg
     
  2. Don Capps
    Joined: Feb 13, 2010
    Posts: 111

    Don Capps
    Member

    Why am I not surprised?

    Give yourself the point for posting a response.
     
  3. carl s
    Joined: Mar 22, 2008
    Posts: 741

    carl s
    Member
    from Indio, CA

    Your welcome.
    Was good to see you at the Brickyard Vintage - I ran just the oval in the pre-war group and had a great time - the only blip was getting lost in the infield coming off the track - wound up in the picnic area and was surrounded by picnickers offering food and directions back to the garages.
    https://www.flickr.com/photos/91981316@N06/14421361941/in/set-72157645135991615
     
  4. Grahamsc
    Joined: May 13, 2014
    Posts: 466

    Grahamsc
    Member
    from Colorado

    Thanks for posting the crash picture and the schematic view.
    A few other points about the Baker Torpedo , it had an isinglass windshield which makes me think visibility was poor.
    And it was outfited with nickle-iron batteries that were invented by Thomas Edison only a few months before the Staten Island Crash.
    Baker and his brakeman C. E. Denzer were held for several days on Murder charges but the charges were dropped.
    There were timing officials every 1/4 mile along the street and the crash happened when they crossed the trolley tracks just after the 1/2 mile mark.
    The timing from the 1/4 to 1/2 mile mark suggest that they were running about 105 MPH.
     
  5. AHotRod
    Joined: Jul 27, 2001
    Posts: 10,242

    AHotRod
    Member

    Such amazing History,.... really enjoying it.
     
  6. THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Joined: Jun 6, 2007
    Posts: 2,665

    THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Member
    from FRENCHTOWN

    I'm noticing that the front spring hangers on the rear axle of that "Duesenberg Special" have the shackles suspending the springs - opposite of current day thinking on how to suspend a leaf sprung car. I like to study those old pics for clues on where the technology of the day was. I can imagine that must have been a handful when lots of power was applied.

    And the pilot of the aeroplane must have gotten an oily film all over himself in short order with those exposed rocker arm assemblies spewing oil back in his face. Yuk

    Love the Firestone whitewalls.
     
  7. Grahamsc
    Joined: May 13, 2014
    Posts: 466

    Grahamsc
    Member
    from Colorado

    The Duesenbergs also have the step down in the frame right behind the front tire I have noticed it in a few other pics of specials but almost all of the duesenbergs seem to have it.
    Must have made them handle better or they wouldn't have done it.
     
  8. THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Joined: Jun 6, 2007
    Posts: 2,665

    THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Member
    from FRENCHTOWN

    Thanks for enlightening me T-Head on the Duesy chassis. I didn't consider the possibility of a closed torque tube - I only noticed the lack of radius rods.

    I figured the aeroplane did not have pressure oiling but based on my bicycle chain tending to get me oily just by looking at it I would not want to be the recipient of an enthusiastic machanic's lube prep.
     
  9. THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Joined: Jun 6, 2007
    Posts: 2,665

    THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Member
    from FRENCHTOWN

    Did anyone see the excellent PBS production this evening about vintage WW I combat aircraft? A group of New Zealand enthusiasts built a fleet of exacting replica aircraft. Regarding trying to replicate air-to-air combat here was one quote, "Right from the start oil covering goggles and camera lenses was a problem..."

    Later on the commentator said, "oil, grease and heat coming off the engine made it extremely difficult to see..."

    At one point a rearward facing camera on the pilots windscreen showed it covered in a nasty film of oil streaks. I have even more appreciation for those brave lads now.
     
  10. ago
    Joined: Oct 12, 2005
    Posts: 2,193

    ago
    Member
    from pgh. pa.

  11. ZigZagZ
    Joined: Oct 24, 2011
    Posts: 238

    ZigZagZ
    Member
    from LA

    Very interesting piece mixed with lots of archival footage.
    If you think restoring vintage cars is expensive, try vintage aircraft.
     
  12. ZigZagZ
    Joined: Oct 24, 2011
    Posts: 238

    ZigZagZ
    Member
    from LA

    Here is a little footage from Sheepshead Bay from July of 1919. It was the site of the "Police Games", and the film shows policemen on the track in combat exercises. The last few seconds shows a high diver jumping into a pool of water.

     
  13. saacha
    Joined: Mar 20, 2011
    Posts: 161

    saacha
    Member
    from cloud 9

    monza 1923119.jpg
    From BRITISH MOTORING by A.B. Demaus
     
  14. Most of the WWI aircraft had rotary engines (as to be distinguished from "radial"). I think the rotary engines were "total loss" lubrication systems. The crankshaft was fixed to the airframe and the cylinder block and propeller rotated around the crank. The engines, like alot of race car engines, used caster oil as a lubricant. The pilots of the day (as well as race drivers) had little problems with constipation.
    I think that most, if not all engines (aircraft or automobile) produced up into the fifties tend to loose oil. The radial aircraft engines that I've been around lose gallons of oil. And, the current engines in my 30's race car throw so much oil that I have to put PIG oil absorbent blankets in the belly pan under the engine, to keep from oiling the track. I also keep and extra set of goggles around my neck whether I'm in the air or running on the track.
     
  15. Vitesse
    Joined: Feb 9, 2010
    Posts: 260

    Vitesse
    Member
    from Bath, UK

    Not Chitty Chitty Bang Bang. Chitty Bang Bang. It's a common error.

    Chitty Chitty Bang Bang was the title of a children's story by Ian Fleming. Later filmed, of course. Fleming was undoubtedly inspired by the name of Zborowski's cars. But as far as Lou was concerned - definitely only one 'Chitty'!

    The name is said to have been derived from a bawdy song dating from the Great War - possibly sung by men of the Royal Flying Corps. However, nobody ever seems to have written down the lyrics.
     
  16. THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Joined: Jun 6, 2007
    Posts: 2,665

    THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Member
    from FRENCHTOWN

    I hope somebody here writes some lyrics to it - both automotive and bawdy in content.
     
  17. Bluto
    Joined: Feb 15, 2005
    Posts: 5,114

    Bluto
    Member Emeritus

    Oh it's going to take a long time to get to the race track with the truck

    Thank you for posting the photo
     
  18. T-Head
    Joined: Jan 28, 2010
    Posts: 3,935

    T-Head
    Member
    from Paradise.

  19. THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Joined: Jun 6, 2007
    Posts: 2,665

    THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Member
    from FRENCHTOWN

  20. saacha
    Joined: Mar 20, 2011
    Posts: 161

    saacha
    Member
    from cloud 9

    Alzaga Miramas Sunbeam175.jpg
    Macoco Alzaga Unzue (center cap no mustache) with the Sunbeam at Miramas 1st place 13th July 1924. The car latter came to Argentina and was sold to Eric Forrest Greene , belive today it is at Indianapolis Museum.
     
  21. Kume
    Joined: Jan 23, 2010
    Posts: 827

    Kume
    Member

  22. 64 DODGE 440
    Joined: Sep 2, 2006
    Posts: 3,977

    64 DODGE 440
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from so cal

  23. That is like the king of all lakester headders.

    Have to say that this whole thread is pretty sweet. I have no idea where people get photos like this, but as long as they keep em coming, I don't need to know.


    Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!

    -Ben LeBlanc
     
  24. Kume
    Joined: Jan 23, 2010
    Posts: 827

    Kume
    Member

    yes gorgeous isn't it. 1919 Ballot Indianapolis car. Has been discussed previously in this thread I think. One of Henry's designs but apparently went from drawing board to track in just 101 days. Fastest lap time in 1919 but let down by collapsing wheels during the race. Stunning looking vehicles.
     
  25. banjeaux bob
    Joined: Aug 31, 2008
    Posts: 5,734

    banjeaux bob
    Member
    from alaska

  26. Bluto
    Joined: Feb 15, 2005
    Posts: 5,114

    Bluto
    Member Emeritus

    Austy Clark had the trophy. Anyone know where it is now?
     
  27. T-Head
    Joined: Jan 28, 2010
    Posts: 3,935

    T-Head
    Member
    from Paradise.

    I bet Miles Collier has it at the museum.
     
  28. The37Kid
    Joined: Apr 30, 2004
    Posts: 25,580

    The37Kid
    Member

    Thanksgiving_zps9c9d70db.jpg If you look at the BLITZEN BENZ in post #9854 that is the one that was scrapped in Pennsylvania in the early 1920's. The radiator wound up on this car #6 at Pottsville, Pa, June 7, 1924. Bob
     
  29. Michael Ferner
    Joined: Nov 12, 2009
    Posts: 768

    Michael Ferner
    Member

    Is that the Wills Special, Bob? Driver doesn't look like Tommy Dawson to me, though. And neither does that radiator look like a Benz one, much to small and wrong shape.
     
  30. The37Kid
    Joined: Apr 30, 2004
    Posts: 25,580

    The37Kid
    Member

    Michael I had the original photo, and all the cars were ID'd by Larry Beals and the radiator was noted by him as being from the Blitzen Benz. Great mix of cars and power plants, 1/4 Bugatti aero engine, Hisso V8's and half Hissos, Fiat, and a Duesenberg. Bob
     

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