History Auto racing 1894-1942

It's amazing what you can do with a piece of wax........and there are the chassis, gearbox and axles too.

 

Charles Jarrott in a Panhard ??

 

Max Halstock......Can you share more photos with us??

 

As far as i know, this Cottin-Desgouttes, described as a 1925 16HP Sports Torpedo type Grand Prix, was never involved in any racing but it's a very nice car that deserves to be on this thread i think.
According to the grandson of the gentleman in the drivers seat, the photo was taken before 1929. Sitting next to him is Mr. Caisson of Gerland Automobiles garage in Lyons where he worked as a mechanic.

 

check out those cam lobes, visible through the window on the Spider's cambox. Even with roller lifters--- it's a wonder the valves ever get to close!

Herb Kephart

 

T-Head, it would be churlish not to. Here are some of the chassis, gearbox and rear axle before strip-down and one of the crankcase with the crank in place and the sump and tumbler gearbox behind. The box is so called because the secondary shaft is flipped, or tumbled, out of engagement by a rack and pinion at either end each time you change gear. The gear-change itself is sequential.

 

Max!! I´m very confused with the renault type that he was piloted by louis Renault and the other piloted by Marcel Renault, and the others Renault cars that participated in the Paris-madrid (1903).

was looking in the internet and certainly found some informacion about the car, but no informacion about the type (You said is a type Os)
Four cilinders, 3600 cc not exactly and 30cv. Was a special prepare for the race by Marcel , also in the grand prix the car was inscripted into the light cars (650 kg)

 

Paris-Madrid Trail
24 May 1903 - Paris-Madrid: 1014 km
Subsequently named the VIII Grand Prix de l'A.C.F.


Results
1 168 Fernand Gabriel Mors 5h14m31.2, 65.30 kph
2 3 Louis Renault Renault 5h29m39.2 light car
3 96 Jacques Salleron Mors 5h47m01.8
4 1 Charles Jarrott de Dietrich 5h52m55.0
5 78 Baron Pierre de Crawhez Panhard 5h54m11.4
6 99 John Warden Mercedes 5h55m30.8
7 153 Carl Voigt CGV 5h57m49.2
8 293 Gasteaux Mercedes 6h01m16.0
9 205 Achille Fournier Mors 6h12m39.0
10 47 Paul Baras Darracq 6h13m20.8 light car
11 69 Henri Rougier Turcat Mery 6h17m07.8
12 112 Mouter de Dietrich 6h18m54.2
13 209 Page Decauville 6h08m08.2 light car
14 86 Camille Jenatzy Mercedes 6h25m08.4
15 153 Max Mercedes 6h38m35.2
16 185 Augières Mors 6h43m49.6
17 119 Hubert le Blon Serpollet 6h44m15.8
18 116 G. Berteaux Panhard 6h47m66.0
19 128 Victor Hemery Darracq 6h56m53.2 light car
20 292 Edgar Braun Mercedes 7h05m04.6
21 90 Chanliaud Serpollet 7h07m38.4
22 10 Georges Teste Panhard 7h13m08.4
23 111 Pellison de Dion 7h13m42.6 light car
24 37 Masson Clement 7h14m45.2 voiturette
25 195 A. Lavergne Mors 7h22m49.6
26 4 Léon Théry Decauville 7h24m16.0 light car
27 27 Baron Pierre de Caters Mercedes 7h35m48.4
28 143 Jules Barillier Richard-Brasier 7h40m00.6 voiturette
29 219 Louis Rigolly Gobron-Brillié 7h44m08.8
30 65 Louis Wagner Darracq 7h48m12.4 voiturette
31 103 J. Edmond Darracq 7h52m24.2 light car
32 150 Lamberjack Panhard 8h00m14.8
33 94 Jacques Guders Pipe 8h03m26.4
34 85 Rene de Brou de Dietrich 8h03m50.4
35 173 Sincholle Darracq 8h05m07.4 light car
36 39 Kohler Mercedes 8h05m50.8
37 106 Langlois Panhard 8h06m47.8
38 148 Combier Richard-Brasier 8h08m26.2 voiturette
39 57 Holley de Dion 8h23m19.0 voiturette
40 126 Van der Poele Pipe 8h25m06.8
41 81 Pierre Bardin de Dion 8h26m13.6 light car
42 88 Maurice Fournier Clement 8h26m32.0 voiturette
43 130 Birnbaum Ader 8h26m50.4 voiturette
44 32 Legras Passy-Thellier 8h26m56.2 voiturette
45 151 Osmont Darracq 8h30m40.4 light car
46 315 Marius Barbarou Benz 8h36m44.0
47 271 Vilain Prunel 8h38m38.2 voiturette
48 218 Etienne/François Giraud CGV 8h38m45.2
49 77 A./M.Ph. Villemain Darracq 8h43m07.8 voiturette
50 187 Weisser de Dion 8h43m32.4 voiturette
51 233 Rasson Clement 8h47m52.4 light car
52 16 Valentin Ader 8h51m53.8 light car
53 253 Chenu Chenu 8h52m49.8
54 19 Jules Simon Ader 8h57m17.4 light car
55 140 Sommier Ader 9h00m30.4 voiturette
56 148 Gavaris Panhard 9h06m32.8
57 182 Loste CGV 9h14m25.0 light car
58 53 Fernand Charron Touring CGV 9h16m52.6
59 204 d'Udekem Serpollet 9h21m46.6
60 31 Jean Corre Corre 9h21m50.4 voiturette
61 131 d'Houdeauville Passy-Thellier 9h25m31.4 voiturette
62 36 Otto Hieronymus Mercedes 9h31m45.0
63 272 Versein Motobloc 9h39m47.0 light car
64 225 Arthur Duray Gobron-Brillié 9h41m01.0
65 262 Robert d'Hespel Corre 9h46m25.0 light car
66 278 Durand Mors 9h50m42.4
67 158 Carel Van der Heyden Panhard 9h51m12.2
68 52 Turr Panhard 9h57m18.6
69 34 Degrais Mercedes 10h03m40.4
70 196 Lafont de Dietrich 10h12m26.8
71 201 Olliver Serpollet 10h16m10.6
72 200 Gautier Ader 10h25m26.2 voiturette
73 175 Gustave Caillois Serpollet 10h26m27.4
74 227 Holder Panhard 10h32m02.2
75 82 A. Koechlin Gobron-Brillié 10h33m04.0
76 44 Luigi Storero FIAT 10h46m08.0 light car
77 29 Madame Camille du Gast de Dietrich 10h51m07.4
78 192 Maillard Richard-Brasier 10h57m43.4 voiturette
79 274 E. Dombret Motobloc 10h58m19.2 light car
80 231 Beutler-Julius de Dietrich 11h21m45.0
81 223 Aaron Corre 11h23m22.2 voiturette
82 50 Comiot CGV 11h27m22.0
83 232 Philippe Dernier Clement 11h33m23.6 light car
84 46 Gasté Automotrice 11h46m10.0
85 15 Lebertre de Dion 11h51m59.0 voiturette
86 276 Flouret Bolide 11h56m50.0 voiturette
87 226 De Boisse de Boisse 12h00m55.0 voiturette
88 102 Deniot Henriod 12h23m33.4 light car
89 300 Davaud Prospert-Lambert 12h25m40.0 light car
90 263 Person Corre 12h32m32.0 light car
91 28 Quinzeaut Ader 12h35m19.2 light car
92 55 S. Ribes Panhard 12h53m16.4
93 73 D'Aubignosc Ader 13h05m24.0 voiturette
94 94 Pagliano Prospert-Lambert 13h27m40.0 light car
95 217 Auguste Amblard Mors 13h40m20.0
96 273 C. Dombret Motobloc 14h09m42.0 light car
97 282 Lillie Serpollet 14h43m02.0
98 307 Dupeux de Boisse 16h18m10.0 voiturette
99 121 Rulot Serpollet 20h57m04.0

Did not finish:
Heavy cars (over 1000 kg)
2 René De Knyff Panhard
51 Henri Farman Panhard
59 Charles Rolls Panhard
97 George Heath Panhard
38 Maurice Farman Panhard
183 Gondoin Panhard
186 Efgée Panhard
7 Henri Fournier Mors
48 Victor Rigal Mors
60 William K. Vanderbilt Mors
68 Baron de Forest Mors
80 Léger Mors
172 Jeandré Mors
279 d'Arnaud Mors
5 Claude Loraine Barrow de Dietrich fatal accident
18 Phil Stead de Dietrich
49 Gras de Dietrich
125 Delaney de Dietrich
92 Leonce Girardot CGV
14 Christian Werner Mercedes
114 Foxhall-Keene Mercedes
290 F. Terry Mercedes
22 Sidney Girling Wolseley
214 Herbert Austin Wolseley
243 Leslie Porter Wolseley
255 Foster Wolseley
40 Paul Rivière Pipe
43 Lucien Hautvast Pipe
35 Chaboche Chaboche (steam)
117 Robert Chaboche (steam)
303 Gabran Boyer
304 H. Loste Boyer
93 Gosset Henriod
314 Darzens Henriod
23 Tourand Brouhot
138 Mark Mayhew Napier
254 Kolb-Bernard Chenu
313 Gibert Gillet-Forest

Light cars (650 kg)
63 Marcel Renault Renault fatal accident
129 Grus Renault
152 Henri Tart Renault
157 Hugé Renault
197 Louvet Renault
41 Paul Vonlatum Clement
62 Xavier Civelli de Bosch Clement
136 Rene Hanriot Clement
45 J. Journu de Dion
144 Louis Loste de Dion
70 Philippe Taveneaux Gobron-Brillié
194 Fraignac Gobron-Brillié
171 Henri Béconnais Darracq
288 Rophé Darracq
298 Blazy Prosper Lambert
301 P. Lambert Prosper Lambert
118 Brun Prunel
229 Robert Prunel
166 de Bay Européenne
202 Mestayer Decauville
207 Franz Ullmann Decauville
211 Vincenzo Lancia FIAT
246 Jousse Fouillaron
247 Charin Fouillaron

Voiturettes (400 kg)
54 Coeuille Renault
113 Seret Renault
137 Richez Renault
184 Cormier Renault
71 Achille Henriod
161 Provost Henriod
11 Jean Jacques Thellier Passey-Thellier
228 Sanz Passey-Thellier
164 Durand Corre
180 Buchillet Corre
266 Coquard Corre
135 Collignon de Dion
249 Alard Boulet
26 Georges-Richard Georges-Richard


N.B.
1) Race stopped at Bordeaux, after 550 km due to fatal accidents.
2) Barrow died in hospital June 13th. His mechanic Pierre Rodez was killed
instantly.
3) Open road racing in France subsequently banned.

 

Old prints (paris-madrid)

Marcel Renault car


( And this... I dont now who is)

 

Max,
Do you have the book "The Race Bugatti Missed' ?
It has quite a few Renault photos; 1904 10 hp chassis, 1902 14hp chassis, etc. The author doesn't use the Type O designation.

 

Paris Madrid photos-
Lower photo is Tourand Brouhot's car, hurled into the spectators, 3 dead, one severely injured.
Next up from bottom is Georges Richard - driver and mechanician survived with only minor injuries.
The first two photos are of Marcel Renault's fatal accident.

 

P W Armstrong dealership, Perth, western Australia - 1931:

 

Can i order one ...........


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Y want 2 please!!

 

On the right, an A-7 "Meteor?" On the left, Triumph Imp. Location, Lake Perkolilli, Western Australia, early 1930s.



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The car was a Renault Type O. It had a side valve 4 cylinder engine of 6,300 cc with a 3-cored radiator each side. According to Charles Jarrot, writing at the time, Renault had simply taken the Type K (of the sort which won the 1902 Paris-Vienna race driven by Marcel), fitted a larger engine further back and added an extra radiator core each side. The Type O driven by Louis and his mechanic Ferenc Szisz was timed on a stretch of road south west of Paris at almost 100mph and was reckoned to be faster than the 1906 Grand Prix-winning Type AK, which had an engine of 12,800 cc.

 

Max in the site below the marcel renault car 16 hp.

http://www.motorsportmemorial.org/searchall.php?s=marcel+renault&db=ct&s_into=all&s_db=selecteddb&Search=Submit

(this the extract of that link)

In the small village of Payré near Couhé-Vérac, about 17 kms after Vivonne, between Poitiers and Ruffec, occurred Marcel Renault's tragedy. He had left Versailles one hour after his brother Louis, driving his 650-kg 16HP Renault, proceeding in the dust raised by Leon Théry’s Decauville #4 which came ahead of him. Marcel didn’t see the yellow flag announcing a dangerous curve and a rail crossing, arrived too quickly, he lost control of the car getting his wheel into the gutter and crashed against a tree. Théry stopped his Decauville in order to help Renault and his riding-mechanic Vauthier trapped in their car, which albeit crumpled was not destroyed. No doctors was at hand, but Théry tried to find one at the next village and sent him pedaling back to the place of accident by bicycle. Unfortunately Marcel Renault succumbed to his injuries two days later. According to first press reports also Vauthier (given name unknown) lost his life in the accident, but this was not confirmed. He eventually recovered, according to French magazine "L'Auto", issue of June 1905, two years later a riding-mechanic called Vauthier was in the entry-list of the French Gordon Bennett elimination race - Circuit de l'Auvergne in June 1905, with driver Fernand Gabriel in a De Dietrich. It could have been the same person or they happen to have the same name, this has not yet been clarified.

 

Many thanks. Yes we do have this book and it has been most useful. We also spent a day with Renault Historique in Billancourt and Flins. They were exceptionally helpful and gave us access to their archives, but there was almost no technical information on the Type O. I believe it was probably lost in the flood before WW1.

 

It was aptly named "the Race of Death" by the press. The 16hp car would have been a voiturette. Marcel's Type O was rated at (I think, as I do not have the reference books with me) 35hp.

 

1903 Paris-Madrid Renault Type O 30hp.

 

The man in the white hat on the left of the photos is Fernand Renault, greeting Louis on his arrival in Bordeaux with the news that their brother Marcel had crashed.

 

Marcel Renault number 63





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1908 Benz and some original photos I have of a Benz that early collector George Waterman restored that were posted before.

 

What a beuty? thanks T-Head the first photo is amazing that very clear photo

 

I know there are a few of these around this is mine



Found it in a junk shop in Munich in the 80's