Register now to get rid of these ads!

Hot Rods Allowing for 9" Ford chuck offset?

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by bigalturk1, Sep 1, 2016.

  1. bigalturk1
    Joined: Sep 23, 2010
    Posts: 366

    bigalturk1
    Member

    1941 Willys (Small-block Chevy with 700R4 Transmission) :
    I have a Ford 9" (75' Granada) housing with no offset, after installing the third member into the housing (On the floor), it looks like the rear yoke is off center about 1".
    Should I center the complete rear-end equal in the wheel-wells or should I center the rear yoke to the transmission tail shaft?
    >>>I read way back that centering the yoke is more important than centering the complete rear-end assembly in the wheel-wells... Because the drive shaft is short (34" U-Joint to U-joint) & it may vibrate, even with the correct Pinion angle.
     
  2. center the rear end on the frame , the driveshaft running at a slight angle won't hurt

    FWIW....i don't consider 34" center to center on the u-joints short
     
    dana barlow likes this.
  3. Hnstray
    Joined: Aug 23, 2009
    Posts: 11,745

    Hnstray
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from Quincy, IL

    I would not recommend offsetting the axle assembly to one side in order to center the pinion.
    Many vehicles, including the one your axle came from, ran an offset pinion. Others opinions differ, but the joints only 'see' one angle, just "clocked" at a different point when the pinion is offset in addition to driveline angle.

    That said, I can understand your concern the angle may be a bit much with the short driveshaft. If you can measure the angle, and it is in the lower single digits (i.e. up to maybe 5 degrees), I would think that would be acceptable.

    If not, your best alternative maybe to start with a wider rear axle assembly and have it narrowed on one side to center the pinion. You may have a 9", a few Granadas did, but most were 8", which at a glance looks much the same. A quick way to tell is if the lower passenger side nut that holds the center section into the housing can take a socket.....or requires a wrench because it is shrouded by the pinion case. If it is the latter, it is a 9".

    Ray
     
  4. bigalturk1
    Joined: Sep 23, 2010
    Posts: 366

    bigalturk1
    Member

    Yes, I am sure it's a 9" rear (I have a few of them)...

    I'm still concerned about the Non-centered Yoke because...
    I'm running the S-10 Blazer frame with it's stock S-10 rear-end which is not centered in the wheel-wells and it "Doesn't" vibrate now... I'd be an unhappy guy if it vibrated because I decided to center the 9" in the wheel wells!
    I'm thinking that the rear can take only 1 offset, (Either at the Yoke, or the Pinion angle)
    but not both!
    (Presently running the stock S-10 rear end and a 2 degree (Downward) pinion offset... No vibration)
     

  5. Mike51Merc
    Joined: Dec 5, 2008
    Posts: 3,854

    Mike51Merc
    Member

    Offset is not the same thing as pinion angle. A great many factory differentials are offset with no ill effects. As long as they're running in the same plane, you can offset quite a bit with no problems, just look at any 4x4 front or rear differential. The only way to upset the plane would be to put one wheel more forward than the other, or to rotate the engine (looking from the top) so that the output shaft was not pointing inline with the rest of the car. I wish I could draw you a picture here.

    If you center the yoke like you described, you're running the chance that the car is going to "crab" or "skateboard" down the road, meaning that the body will "yaw" as the car travels in a straight line because your front and rear wheels will be tracking in different lines.
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Sep 1, 2016
  6. 53 ford
    Joined: Apr 8, 2012
    Posts: 143

    53 ford
    Member

    An old millwright taught me that a driveshaft should be offset by one eight inch per foot minimum. Keep the yokes parallel and offset the shaft. It doesn't matter up and down, side to side or both. All those little needle bearings are there for a purpose. They should be spinning around the cup. If the shaft is straight they will not spin and you'll get brinelling in the cups and on the pins.
     
    BradinNC and Atwater Mike like this.
  7. Mr48chev
    Joined: Dec 28, 2007
    Posts: 28,137

    Mr48chev
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Never figured out why guys start peeing in their shoes when they see a bit of offset to the pinion when many factory rigs runs such an offset. At the same time offsetting the rear axle so one wheel almost sticks out of the wheel well and the other is tucked way in and neither is centered on the front wheels is silly as all hell.
    As 36 Window said center the axle (wheel mounting flange to wheel mounting flange) on the frame and be done with it.
     
    Tman and Atwater Mike like this.
  8. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 47,426

    squirrel
    Member

    If you are really worried about it, center the rear wheels, then offset the engine a bit. Many engines are offset in production cars. Wife's Dart is about two inches over to pass side, my Chevy II is about 11/16". this is measured at the trans mount.
     
    Atwater Mike likes this.
  9. If you are a circle track racer than the 1"offset may help you. If you are driving it then center the rear end. a 1"offest on the hurt you much. unless the rear has been narrowed it was offset from the factory wasn't it.

    I got a 9" in the shop now that the yolk is 2" off center. It came from the factory that way. Lots of them don't have the yolk centered,
     
    dana barlow likes this.
  10. Mike51Merc
    Joined: Dec 5, 2008
    Posts: 3,854

    Mike51Merc
    Member

    Hey Beaner,
    I hate it when my yolks are off center. Almost ruins my breakfast.
     
    Flathead Dave likes this.
  11. krylon32
    Joined: Jan 29, 2006
    Posts: 6,950

    krylon32
    Alliance Vendor
    from Nebraska

    Built many 100's of chassis with a 9" housing centered rear which put the pinion 2 inches to the right. No problems.
     
    Tman likes this.
  12. Well then the yolks on you.:D

    Uh its yoke for the uninformed. ;)
     
  13. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 47,426

    squirrel
    Member

    I scramble them, it don't matter if they're off center.
     
    stillrunners likes this.
  14. Mike51Merc
    Joined: Dec 5, 2008
    Posts: 3,854

    Mike51Merc
    Member

    You mean the yokes on me? What am I, an ox?
     
  15. JOECOOL
    Joined: Jan 13, 2004
    Posts: 2,757

    JOECOOL
    Member

    Hey ,my chickens are not laughing ,cut it out.
     
    stillrunners likes this.
  16. V8 Bob
    Joined: Feb 6, 2007
    Posts: 2,714

    V8 Bob
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Fact #1-the 9" pinion is offset 15/16". Fact #2-many factory engines, as stated above, are offset to the passenger side, the same or close to that model's pinion offset, negating any offset angle. Fact #3-any horizontal pinion/u-joint angle in a chassis with a centered engine/trans has to be added to any vertical u-joint angle, as the two angles result in a compound angle. The shorter the driveshaft, the greater and more critical the angles become. To ensure long u-joint life, design the chassis for u-joint working angles of 3 degrees max.
    Spend some time with the link below, and all your u-joint/driveline questions should be answered. :)

    http://www.waterousco.com/media/wysiwyg/pdfs/content/J3311-1-DSSP.pdf
     
  17. BJR
    Joined: Mar 11, 2005
    Posts: 6,706

    BJR
    Member

    That was a fowl statement.
     
  18. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 47,426

    squirrel
    Member

    they aren't really added, are they? because the diagonal measurement of a rectangle, is less than the length of one side, plus the length of the other side.

    Example, if there is two inches vertical offset, and one inch horizontal offset, then the resulting offset, at an angle, is only 2.24", not 3".
     
    Hnstray and alchemy like this.
  19. DDDenny
    Joined: Feb 6, 2015
    Posts: 14,281

    DDDenny
    Member
    from oregon

    I was told there would be no math today.:rolleyes:
     
    stillrunners, Johnboy34 and squirrel like this.
  20. Russco
    Joined: Nov 27, 2005
    Posts: 4,133

    Russco
    Member
    from Central IL

    I had this 9" housing made with the pinion centered. You can visibly see the difference now that the pumpkin is not centered as it normally would be in the car.
    image.jpg
     
  21. V8 Bob
    Joined: Feb 6, 2007
    Posts: 2,714

    V8 Bob
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Your right Jim, I didn't state that correctly. It's not a whole number addition. The squares of the two angles are added, but the resulting number's square root is the compound, or true operating angle, like your example above.
     
    Last edited: Sep 1, 2016
  22. Mike51Merc
    Joined: Dec 5, 2008
    Posts: 3,854

    Mike51Merc
    Member

  23. Atwater Mike
    Joined: May 31, 2002
    Posts: 10,347

    Atwater Mike
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Question:
    "How did the pumpkin get to the middle of the road?"
    Answer:
    "Two short axles."
     
  24. bigalturk1
    Joined: Sep 23, 2010
    Posts: 366

    bigalturk1
    Member

    OK, I'll consider it (Leaving the the Axles centered in the wheel wells)...
    If you consider pulling over when you see my driveshaft on the ground
    & my car on the side of the road, LOL!!
    THANKS FOR YOUR REPLIES!
     

    Attached Files:

  25. seb fontana
    Joined: Sep 1, 2005
    Posts: 6,762

    seb fontana
    Member
    from ct

  26. Mr48chev
    Joined: Dec 28, 2007
    Posts: 28,137

    Mr48chev
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Just check them out closely a bit more often then you might do on a stock rig and life is good. That little bit of offset isn't going to cause problems near as much as the jacked up 4x4 setups do and you don't see those guys getting too worried about it.

    I've dropped the driveshaft out of my 48 with a Camaro rear end with the pinon centered just because I didn't pay attention to the U joints close enough so it's as much maintenance as it is the way it's set up. In my case it was like the shoemaker's kids running barefoot because I spent all my time working on other peoples rigs.
     
  27. bostonhemi
    Joined: Dec 1, 2011
    Posts: 657

    bostonhemi
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    I used to see a lot of Chevy Novas do that.
     
  28. bigalturk1
    Joined: Sep 23, 2010
    Posts: 366

    bigalturk1
    Member

    I saw a 1968 Nova race around the corner and lose the axle C-clip (Stock rear-end),
    it made a mess of his wheel opening!
     
  29. Either ox or religious I suppose. I personally would prefer Ox but I am a little off center.:D
     
  30. DDDenny
    Joined: Feb 6, 2015
    Posts: 14,281

    DDDenny
    Member
    from oregon

    So, if you were a piston in an engine you wouldn't quite reach TDC!:rolleyes:
     

Share This Page

Register now to get rid of these ads!

Archive

Copyright © 1995-2020 The Jalopy Journal: Steal our stuff, we'll kick your teeth in. Terms of Service. Privacy Policy.

Atomic Industry
Forum software by XenForo™ ©2010-2014 XenForo Ltd.