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Technical 3 speed Borg Warner overdrive no reverse.

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Danger, Apr 19, 2020.

  1. Danger
    Joined: Jun 18, 2010
    Posts: 145

    Danger
    Member

    Had my 3 speed and overdrive rebuilt put it in the car and no reverse! I have 1-2-3 but nothing for reverse.
    Things I’ve checked-
    Solenoid is in correct
    Solenoid is not engaged
    Nothing changes with control lever in or out
    Hard to tell on stands but in gear at speed and when the relay and solenoid fire off it doesn’t seem to switch into OD. Like it’s already in overdrive?
    Car will roll backwards if not in gear
    Car will roll backward if running and in reverse, clutch out. But not when the motor is shut off. Like is coming out of gear when the motor is spinning.
    I know it’s in R gear, disconnected lineage and pull the lever manually.

    Things to note

    I have bypassed the reverse lockout switch.
    Transmission was working fine before rebuild just needed a new pinion gear.

    On removal the reverse lock out switch broke off but I’m not using it so I don’t think that could be the issue.

    Thanks I’m advance guys!





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  2. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 46,711

    squirrel
    Member

    so you don't have reverse lockout working, and you're wondering why reverse lockout doesn't work? Hmmm....
     
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  3. Danger
    Joined: Jun 18, 2010
    Posts: 145

    Danger
    Member

    It’s a relay so that OD can’t be engaged while in reverse.


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  4. Danger
    Joined: Jun 18, 2010
    Posts: 145

    Danger
    Member

    IMG_8057.JPG


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  5. :D:D
     
  6. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 46,711

    squirrel
    Member

    Oh, I thought you were talking about the mechanical lockout rod.
     
  7. 62rebel
    Joined: Sep 1, 2008
    Posts: 2,768

    62rebel
    Member

    Well, be glad you can't get reverse to work with O/D engaged. Turn a nice piece into junk in seconds.
     
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  8. dan c
    Joined: Jan 30, 2012
    Posts: 2,141

    dan c
    Member

    the reverse lockout switch is redundant and was discontinued after 1950. there is a mechanical lockout for reverse--a shift rail that goes into the 3-speed gearbox and is actuated by the reverse shift lever, locking out the overdrive. could that be the problem? i rebuilt mine years ago and was unable to find a replacement switch, so i just fabbed a cover and gasket for the o.d. and don't use it. if you remove the shift cover, you'll see the shift rail
     
  9. donsz
    Joined: Nov 23, 2010
    Posts: 211

    donsz
    Member

    I've had this problem, and I don't remember exactly what I did to fix it, but I "think" (I know you said the solenoid is installed correctly, so I may have mis-remembered this):
    - What I think I did, the solenoid shaft has a sort of "knob" on the end and it needs to engage a mechanism
    (see illustration) upon install (I think a twist and turn will get it done before bolting it in).
    don
    pawl.jpg
     
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  10. plym_46
    Joined: Sep 8, 2005
    Posts: 3,989

    plym_46
    Member
    from central NY

    You shouldn't be trying to reverse with the OD cable pushed in. Try putting the cable with the arm secured in the forward position hold it with mechs wire or zip tie. Also assure your reverse selector is moving it's full travel.
     
  11. Danger
    Joined: Jun 18, 2010
    Posts: 145

    Danger
    Member

    I did the check to make sure it was in properly but I may remove and reinstall just to be sure.
    IMG_8057.JPG


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  12. Danger
    Joined: Jun 18, 2010
    Posts: 145

    Danger
    Member

    It should work whether the OD cable is pushed in or out as long as the OD solenoid is not engaged. I did remove the linkage and shifted it into reverse by hand, it’s going into reverse I can hear the gears catch.


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    Last edited: Apr 19, 2020
  13. miker98038
    Joined: Jan 24, 2011
    Posts: 480

    miker98038
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    I worked on a lot of R-10 and R-11 o/d's but it's been many years. IIRC we used to jump the solenoid to extend it, get it into and rotated to the pawl, and when you disconnected the power it pulled in and you knew you had it right. Hopefully someone with more recent experience or a better memory will chime in.
     
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  14. Danger
    Joined: Jun 18, 2010
    Posts: 145

    Danger
    Member

    I’ll try that later today and see if anything changes. Thanks.


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  15. Baumi
    Joined: Jan 28, 2003
    Posts: 2,502

    Baumi
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Hi! I just happen to have my transmission apart for a rebuild. I just bench tested what could make your trans stay out of reverse, and my best bet would be the 1st and reverse sliding gear does not engage into the reverse idler gear (fixed inside the trans housing , passenger side).Maybe your shift linkage is binding or misadjusted... If you have your car on jack stands, you could try and remove the shifter cover and see if you can push the sliding gear further back to engage with the reverse idler gear.

    IMG_0061.JPG IMG_0071.JPG
    This is the 1st and reverse sliding gear IMG_0070.JPG
    the reverse idler is on the far end of the housing
    IMG_0067.JPG
     
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  16. dan c
    Joined: Jan 30, 2012
    Posts: 2,141

    dan c
    Member

    that's what the guy at 5th avenue says.
     
  17. dan c
    Joined: Jan 30, 2012
    Posts: 2,141

    dan c
    Member

    i'm going by the ford service manual, which says shifts into reverse with od knob "in" is o.k.
     
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  18. Danger
    Joined: Jun 18, 2010
    Posts: 145

    Danger
    Member

    Thanks for the pictures, I pulled the transmission out today and dropped it off at the transmission guys shop. Haven’t tore it apart but it seems like the manual control shift rail is not working right, like not connected or turned so that it’s not in the grove. Should have it figured out tomorrow and I’ll return and report what we found. Thanks for the info guys!


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  19. Danger
    Joined: Jun 18, 2010
    Posts: 145

    Danger
    Member

    OK so after tearing the transmission apart we found that the manual control fork was not in the correct slot. So the overdrive rod could not move forward or backward. This made sense because when I would push or pull the overdrive rod in or out it felt like nothing was moving inside the transmission. Got the fork put in the correct position all buttoned up works like a champ. Hope this helps somebody later on down the road. If you move the overdrive on the transmission by hand the lever should have spring to it FYI. Thanks for all the input guys.


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  20. Danger
    Joined: Jun 18, 2010
    Posts: 145

    Danger
    Member

    [​IMG]


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  21. Danger
    Joined: Jun 18, 2010
    Posts: 145

    Danger
    Member

    [​IMG]


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  22. jaracer
    Joined: Oct 4, 2008
    Posts: 433

    jaracer
    Member

    That makes sense. When you pull the OD cable out, it locks the sun gear into the planet carries which in effect makes the OD unit act like a solid output shaft. The reason you can't backup without this happening is that the overrunning clutch simply overruns when you turn the trans output counter clockwise. The reverse rod is suppose to move the sun gear into the planet carrier when you put it in reverse with the OD cable pushed in. That's what was happening in your trans.
     
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  23. donsz
    Joined: Nov 23, 2010
    Posts: 211

    donsz
    Member

    Thanks for providing your remediation, always enjoy seeing what the solution turned out to be.
    don
     
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