I bought a 64 Falcon Futura, V8, 4spd, 5 bolt wheel. It had power steering at some point, but was cobbled up to eliminate the hyd. cylinder. To "fix" the problem I decided to convert to manual steering. I was told that the best way to do this is to convert to the 1965 system. I bought a pitman arm, drag link, and idler arm from Falcon Ent, and had "acquired" some original Moog inner and outer tie rod ends for 65 manual steering. OK, now the problems: 1) outer tie rod end ball studs are too small for the 64 spindles. 2) one pair of the Moog parts have larger diameter threads (3/4" vs 11/16") 3) When I assemble the inner / outer / sleeve I get about 13" stud to stud. I need about 12" max from drag link to steering arm. The result would be severe toe in. Falcon Enterprise suggested finding a set of 65 V8 spindles, but those aren't just laying around. I also doubt it would help with the length issue. Any comments or insight would be appreciated.
Converting to a ‘65 style steering is a good idea, the ‘64 steering was a bad design even if it was a manual set up. Swapping spindles will solve your problem, V8 spindles should not be difficult to find because most owners are converting to front discs, early Mustang V8 spindles may also fit. Did you check to make sure the pitman arm you bought fits the spline on the steering box? They came with two sizes, 1” and 1 1/8” Jim
The spindles are the same, 1963-1966. If the studs on the tie rod ends are too small, you have 6-cylinder tie rod ends, not V8 ones. V8 cars have bigger steering components. You have some non-V8 stuff mixed in.
It's also worth noting that when Ford 'redesigned' the V8 Falcon steering, what they did was switch over to V8 Mustang components. The center link is the only part different from the Mustang, that needs to be Falcon/Comet. Mustang parts are generally far cheaper than Falcon parts....
63-64 Falcon V8 spindles are different than 65 Falcon/Mustang V8 spindles. I converted my 63 six cylinder car to 65 steering. It's been awhile so I don't remember all the specifics. I do believe I had to shorted the tie rod ends and/or the adjusting sleeve to make it shorter, as you state that is an issue. There are also tapered sleeves made for adapting tie rods popular with the Mustang crowd. I believe 65 Falcon/mustang V8 spindles would solve your problems, but they are not cheap.
Yes, I used some of those tapered tie rod sleeves years ago. Seemed to work OK. I also did the Karel Shelby top front arm drop and kept the same coils. I wished after that mod, I had power steering for parking at least...
The only difference in '62-'66 spindles if they are 6-cylinder, or V8. Very early Falcons had tiny ball joints, but the spindle is otherwise identical to later 6-cylinder spindles. My '60 Falcon has 1965 6-cylinder spindles, and 1965 V8 manual steering.
I have a 63 original 6 cylinder falcon that I converted to 65 steering, and I have also had a 64 factory V8 car as well. The issue is the 63-early 64 V8 spindles had a different steering arm from 65s as the cars had completely different steering geometry. 65 is better, that's the reason it's popular to swap to, and you have to change it all, because it's all different. Also, the stud on the tie rod is bigger on the early 63-64 V8 spindles than the 65 V8 spindles, which are in turn bigger than 6 cylinder spindles. You have a 64 factory V8 car, and when you change to 65 steering components, with exception of spindle, there is not enough adjustment to correct the toe. This is because the steering arms on the 63-64 vs. the 65 spindle are shaped different. These issues have been discussed a lot. TFFN.net is a site specific for Falcons. I don't know if these links will work if you are not a member of the site, so I am going to try and add a screen shot. http://tffn.net/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=33592&hilit=+spindles https://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/threads/1965-ford-5-lug-swap-questions.864469/ A lot of info in thus thread http://www.tffn.net/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=35391
Yours works because you have 65 spindles and 65 steering. Mixing 63-early 64 spindles and 65 steering, not so much
The two spindles are different.... If you want to upgrade the V8 steering from the '64 to '65, it's all or nothing; the only carry-over part is the steering box (well, that you can use...). And it wasn't a 'clean' break. The Mustang came out in April '64, and shortly after it's introduction Ford started using the Mustang steering parts on the Falcon/Comet. Supposedly the Comet got it first (being the more 'upscale' car), then the Falcon. By the end of '64 production, both cars had the upgrade which of course carried over into '65. I remember seeing the date 'breaks' on these years ago, it was pretty late in the year. And if you think the prices are stupid now, you should have priced them 20 years ago when NOTHING for the '63-65 Falcon/Comet steering was being reproduced unless it fit a Mustang. That's the one of the reasons I sold mine...
Thanks for the discussion. Being new to Falcons, (or Mustangs) I don't know the evolutionary details. It is quite possible that a couple of the parts I have are not what they say on the box since they came in the trunk of the car. I does appear that I could shorten the rod ends and adjuster sleeves to make it work, there is plenty of thread engagement. I will have a look at the links and see what else I can find out. Thanks Pete
Thanks. I will probably do some eBay shopping today. Yes, I bought a new pitman arm, and have it installed. Fits fine. Thanks for the pics.
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