The alchohol in the gas will leach water right out of the air. It really attracts water and is at least one of the reasons new cars don't have vented gas caps. If you run vented caps you will acquire water while driving or even just sitting it is the scourge of small engines and gums up their carbs with water corrosion. Use premium fuel or as low an ethanol percentage fuel as you can get and frequent busy gas stations with high inventory turnover. Keep your tank as full as posible.
Modern caps are not vented due to emissions. Using you logic if I drove in a rainstorm my 1/2 full tank should end up with the other half full of water?
Ethanol does hold water. http://www.boatus.com/magazine/2011/december/ethanol.asp Yes, caps today are ventless for emissions. Gas vapor is not allowed to escape the tank.
It does like water but not any where close to the post I replied to. Some of us have had ethanol around for 30 years. The sky did not fall back then and it is not falling now.
As a former mechanic, the manufacturer could not come out and say, but suggested NOT using Mobil gas due to the excess amount of additives
I have had some good experience with using "heet" or "Drygas" products to help with water in the fuel system...I just today saw a product at Wal-Mart that is an additive to help with the alcohol problems associated with "gasohol" or alcohol laced gas. I forgot what it is called but it is with auto chemicals.
HEET is also alcohol. Below is from Wiki Automotive Isopropyl alcohol is a major ingredient in "gas dryer" fuel additives. In significant quantities, water is a problem in fuel tanks, as it separates from the gasoline, and can freeze in the supply lines at cold temperatures. It does not remove water from gasoline; rather, the alcohol solubilizes water in gasoline. Once soluble, water does not pose the same risk as insoluble water as it will no longer accumulate in the supply lines and freeze. Isopropyl alcohol is often sold in aerosol cans as a windshield de-icer. Isopropyl alcohol is also used to remove brake fluid traces from hydraulic braking systems, so that the brake fluid (usually DOT 3, DOT 4 or mineral oil) does not contaminate the brake pads, which would result in poor braking.
Regular grade gasoline is fungible, shipped with only a minimal additive package. The propriatary additives are blended at the terminals as they're sent to the stations. BP/Amoco "white gas" premium IS a unique product, refined and blended differently. It's patented. (I blended it for 20 years) Other premiums may be fungible also. I know we occasionally blended a few batches for Shell. They also added their own additive package at the other end.
I know, I run fuel tankers. We are transport only and independant. We operate in several states but I get to see products from about 5-10 suppliers and as many pipeline terminals/ refineries. If all the folks knew how close any one part of the country is to collapsing and running out of gas (like Georgia area a few years back) they would quit worrying about ethanol and REALLY start worrying about our overall supply.
I agree, in MI we were paying almost a buck a gallon more a month ago than we are this week due to a busted pump in a refinery out of state. WTF? My big concern is what the oxygenators & other additives in the ethanol are doing to ANY rubber part in our fuel systems. EPDM rubber oxidizes & these additives speed up the process. Every rubber part from hoses to fuel pumps is getting tore up at an alarming rate. I'm replumbing my rod with Teflon hose because the rubber hose was pissing gas like a Detroit wino. It's the only safe solution. BTW- if your rod smells like gas, it's the 1st warning sign that something rubber is going to start leaking really bad, so pay attention. SinglefingerSpeedShop.com
Here is a map of pipelines. Does the term "Domino Effect" ring a bell? http://www.mapsearch.com/content/dam/mapsearch/site-images/Petroleum-Bundle-big.gif
Gas is so funny, some seems to go bad so quick and yet other times it will still run ok in a car even though it is very old. I just bought a car that has been sitting for at least 2 years, and maybe 4 years, (90 year old owner couldn't remember when it was wrecked) with 14 gallons of gas in it (according to the digital dash gauge). I put a battery in it, shot some ether down the air intake, and it fired up on the first revolution and sat their running like a clock! The seller and both of us stood there in shock, he was more surprised than us. It ran good enough to drive onto the trailer, and when we got it home we took it for a ride around the block, and there was no knocking or any loss of power. I am going to pull the motor out of it (it is wrecked, I just bought it for the motor) so I am not going to run it any more to run the risk of plugging anything up, but I was super surprised the car would even run on that old of gasoline. Don
You're right, but there is a lot of refining in the Detroit area, which in theory should act as an economic relief valve. It doesnt. Most folks don't know that gasoline isn't sent thru the pipelines with the ethanol mixed in. The gas would be too corrosive & reduce the life expectancy of the pipes. The ethanol & additives that cause the trouble are added to "real" gasoline in the tanker trucks. The motion of the rigs is all that mixes the alcohol & gas together. Might be well mixed, might not be when it gets loaded into the station's tanks. Can you truckers verify the effectiveness of "brake mixing" on short hauls? SinglefingerSpeedShop.com
Yeah there are quite a few around there but there are many variable that can tie up a line. The tanks may be full, a wrong product might be in the line such a s diesel. Or there may be nothing behind the product to push it through the line. We splash blend very little ethanol anymore but it mixes very well since it is shot into the truck under high pressure. This is done separately from the pipeline terminal at another rack before or after loading the gas. At the pipeline rack it is now injected into the compartment first then the gas is loaded all in one step.
After being chastised on here for suggesting ethanol could leach gas out of the air I put fresh gas in an open jar on the shelf in my garage, that was on the 3rd of July in the afternoon. Check it this afternoon (just now actually) and if you tip the jar there is a small acumulation of water (?) in the corner. Where did it come from, was it suspended in the gas and came out from sitting? does it seperate from the ethanol (which is made from water) or what? Several Google sites suggest it is possible that ethanol in gas can attract water out of the atmosphere.
Where in West "By God" are you located that has a 'real'/non-ethanol gas station nearby?! Acording the that real gas web site, the only real gas stations in WV, are down there next to Charleston. One of the places listed is a marina on Kanawha. Old (er) MoPar guy here has Suncrest Marinia, (next to Cheat Lake outside of Morgantown) and he tells me the ONLY gas he can get is ethanol lased, and doesn't know how these bigger marinas (one in Deep Creek MD) can get real gas!
My old car doesn't like to start when it sits for more than a couple of days, the starter cranks it's butt off until the carb gets the fuel supply but is good for the rest of the day or until the cars sits for more than a couple of days. What happens to the fuel in the bowl; can it evaporate in a couple of days?
Fuel quality and water contamination problems are no fun. It is a shame we can't drive our old cars everyday. Sitting around is hard on cars and really makes fuel issues more troublesome. I think it is extremely important that we fuel our hobby (let alone our daily lives) with renewable fuel that is domestically produced. So, I hope these minor technical difficulties don't discourage anyone from getting off of foreign oil. If you want to put ethanol-free gasoline in your old rig, my advice is to burn as much ethnaol as you can in your daily driver. If your daily driver is a flex fuel vehicle, seek out E85. Not only is that patriotic, but it might just preserve your ability to buy ethanol-free gas for your old toy or your lawnmower. I say this becuase we are producing so much ethanol in this country, that the petroleum distributors are under a lot of econoimic pressure to sell cheaper 10% ethanol than pure gasoline. Suck up some E85 in your modern junk and maybe you can continue to get E0 instead of E10 everywhere.
true. using water and farm land for fuel will not work. to make enough to matter, we lose food and water...burn oil, eat crops.
Does your garage smell like gas the morning after you drive the car? This cheap-o gas quickly evaporates from the carb & percolates through the rubber hoses. The ethanol attacks the rubber & the hose allows vapor to escape, hence the smell. If the hose alows vapors out, the air gets in & the fuel siphons back into the tank. At least that's what I see on my old cars, so I'm changing over to Teflon hoses. SinglefingerSpeedShop.com
I wonder WTF you guys are smoking somedays. Gas used to be almost yellow, when it dried it left....ummm duhhh varnish. Yet the the better refined gas today is soooo bad. I seem to clean out a lot less carbs after winters nowdays. Used to be a yearly thing I had to do for a lot of family and friends. Also...I sometimes leave my mower uncovered....water gets through the cap, and I end up with water bubbles in the bottom that I draw out with a straw, instead of dumping out the gas. Annnnd guess what...when I keep it coverd...there is never any water in the gas. Grab your tinfoil hats!
^^ then why don't they burn Ethanol in aircraft? Ethanol eats rubber Ethanol absorbs moisture, & E10 has a shorter shelf life than Ethanol free gas. A small amount of Ethanol can clean a fuel system, and remove moisture in the system, in larger amounts it eats the fuel lines. Ethanol is only cheaper than gasoline because of the massive subsidies applied to it. I wonder how much Ethanol would be a gallon without subsidies? $4?,$5?, $6? $10?
^^aaannnd it KILLS the gas mileage of the OT vehicles I daily drive. (4 different 4.0L Jeeps used to hit 20-21mpg on long trips, I haven't broke through 18mpg in any of them, at any time, since E10 was mandated in Mass)
Here are some FACTS to help some of you learn about alky. http://www.carclinicnetwork.com/20factsaboutethanol/
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