Here are the tabs I discussed, no problems with bolt holes not lineing up, no trying to figure out spacer thickness, and only (1)one gasket to install, and as I stated, this is what Wiend did, I'm sorry, but I just don't understand why you would go to all the trouble of a spacer....and my apologies to F & J for misidentifing him as F & G...
Thanks for the pics! I'll have to find out if there's somebody around that does aluminum welding. Any concerns about welding to the 60 year old intake? Like I said, I'll have to wait to get the heads and block back, to see how everything fits.
No trouble for me at all. Back to why or why not? I'd say most people would not want the welded manifold. Not because there is something that won't last, it is just a fact, that almost nobody wants to see welds on a vintage intake. It kills the value, but if you are never planning to sell it, then who is to say. Here is a better question; Why are we using horribly mismatched manifolds? I am the worst offender on here, I'll bet. A 303 Edmunds intake on a 324, and a machined J2 371 intake on a 303. Duh. I should swap but, I want a tripower on the 40 that has the 303, and a 303 is a better fit in the 40 because of the right side exh manifold style....so I don't want to swap motors. And...I don't think the Edmunds backdrafts will look right on the 40. I want to take up golf...or space travel
You dont have to see welds when these manifolds are done properly...I do a little trickerty all the time to match parts up Tony
I would rethink the choke on the secondary carb. If you open the throttle while cold, the primary with choke will run richer as it should, and the rear cylinders will be unchoked. If I were you I'd make the two carbs as similar as possible - the power valve would be useful for a similar reason, to give all the cylinders a similar gas/air mix at all throttle settings.
Here is one Edmunds to Olds that must use spacers...and very thick ones. Old cool eyes says it's a 371 371 has the higher deck, so the heads are further apart. The Edmunds is just too narrow for welds. These plates were about .250" as I recall. Thick enough that they also can eliminate the rear water port cover plates. Max power is not really wanted on this 371, because the car has the old Ford closed drive & 39 style trans. What a mismatch in port sizes, eh? Must have excellent runner velocity though
I was forunate enough to have a friend-of-a-friend who is a machinist, he has a friend who is a welder. Thats how my manifold came about. No problems with welding the "old" aluminum. As far as welding on an old speed part, well manys a manifold thats been saved by welding. Nobody is gonna say "ewwe" you welded on a old manifold, there going to say (and do) "thats really neat" if they say any thing at all. They're mostly going to be dazzled by the polish job. But F & J can do it his way and I'll do it my way, I just think my way is simpler and less complicated. I have built my hot rod around this intake, carbs and air cleaner. I had a good running 324 and a frozen 303, so I installed the 324. It wasn't untill later after I had the 324 painted detailed and installed, did I realize the Edmunds was ment for a 303 only....so I improvised.
Speaking of Edmunds stuff, these aircleaners are now availble from O'briens Truckers in Mass. I think his hamb name is 59Buickwagon? They only fit the 49/50 Olds Rochester model AA backdraft carbs. Best used with the high rise version Edmunds manifold that has closed webs on the runners, or if you have the shorter Olds 49/50 distributor which uses the "shorty cap". If you don't know the difference, the taller high rise Edmunds intakes do not have open runners, and the valley pan can't really be seen. That high rise also has a large casted "B" on the underside. The shorter early Edmunds manifold has open webs If you do use these with the "later" and taller 303/324 distributors, you would need to use 90 degree elbow terminals on the dist cap wires, and/or use spacers under the carbs. These aircleaners come very close to hitting the taller dist cap if you use the shorter Edmunds intake manifold. Edit: you can't put the shorty dist cap on the later 303/324 distributors...it won't fit.
The air cleaners are nice Frank! I like the looks of the open web intake better myself. But I always wondered why Eddie made those two different versions.
Speaking of Edmunds stuff, these aircleaners are now availble from O'briens Truckers in Mass. I think his hamb name is 59Buickwagon? CRAP...!
I was trying to figure out what all the parts in the carb rebuild kit are for, and I remember people talking about the "leather pumps". Not here is a picture of what I got: On the left is the pump that I took out of the carb. Middle is the new pump. And on the right is some leather piece that also came with the rebuild kit. Anybody know how to use it, where it goes?
Stopped by the machine shop today. They said that my block it pitted too bad, it won't clean up at .030 over. So we'll have to see how bad it is... At least the block is clean now: Also got a box of goodies from Tony @ Ross Racing Engines including my rebuilt rocker asemblies: Man, I love working with clean parts Thanks a ton, Tony! Got the carbs back together, need a few parts and need to sort out an issue where the throttle arm hits my choke housing. Still waiting on the linkage for the secondary carb. That's it with updates so far, thanks for tuning in
They are all pitted, but it's worse on 3 or 4. They wanted me to check first which over sizes I can get, so when they actually machine it, the will know what to do. Seems to me like they are not really in a rush though. That's why I wanted to do it at the local shop, so I can stop in from time to time.
Thanks for the plug F&J. Actually, they also fit the Bendix/Stromberg "back draft" carbs off the 55-57 Stude or the Carter "back draft" that replaces the Rochester AA if you have the oval to round adapter that they came with. Actually, they will fit any carb with a 2 5/8" neck if you turn them 90 degrees. Might help you out in a tight clearance situation. The guy who tooled them up (the late Bill Sanders aka Lakes Modified here on the HAMB) ran a pair on his 2 x 2 flat head in his modified roadster. He has been selling these air cleaners for the last 15-20 years and it made no sense for them to be thrown out. Over the years he might have made as many as Eddie did originally, so I'll continue in Bill's absence. Dennis
Dennis, I've been looking for them on your website, but couldn't find them. Are they not on there yet?
I just received all of the stuff (inventory and tooling) from Bill's widow last week. I want to get some in stock before I put them on the site - just the way I am - hate to put it up on the site and then have to tell people it will "just be a few weeks", And then when I run into any issues I really feel like a heal Dennis
How about putting in a sleeve? And don't go to large on the bore, you could get overheating problems.
The machine shop is dragging their feet. Nothing new from them. I'll have to wait and see what they come up with size wise, and then decide on how to proceed. I hope it'll clean up at .040 but we'll see.
Word to the wise, please take your time and be very critical of oiling system. Little plug behind distributor can make or break you. Have not scoured ALL 8 pages, but Tony IS the man to help you with this build. Like he said Not a cheap engine to do. My customer has well over 5g's in this job, including my labor. Recently did a complete rebuild of a 1960 394. Went .060 over on the bore. Make sure you follow explicit instructions on cam break in. Need to run at 1500rpm after initial start-up. Had to tear this engine back down, because of premature bearing failure. Scratching my head and crying at what went wrong. Was extremely "anal" about cleaning everything and pre-lubing all parts. Don't skimp on good quality oil or filter. You may already know all this, but just trying to make sure you have better luck than me. Crank WAS turned .010",now may have to go another .020"??Thank God these are forged cranks. Want to do a complete build thread once it is back together and running properly. Thanks for sharing JT
Thanks, JT. I've been in touch with Tony, he's showed or told me all the tricks. Looking forward to your build thread! Finally got an update. Feels like it's been forever. Shop called me last week saying that the block doesn't clean up at .060 over. After talking to Tony I realized that I could get custom piston sizes up to about .125 over. It ended up not being as bad, as the first custom size cleaned up at .083 over. My little 324 will be a 338 cui now Stopped by there today and snapped some pictures. All guides and the exhaust seats are installed and cut: they decked the block .010 Once they finish the valve seats we'll determine cc's and come up with the right amount to shave off the heads to raise the compression ratio.
Thanks guys! Dave, the pistons are forged. I'm thinking 9.5:1 for compression ratio, but I'll let the Olds engine guru guide me on this one. First we'll have to find out where it's at now.
this is an awesome thread i own a 54 olds 88 2 dr hardtop that is my daily driver i think my head gaskets are thrash i have tried almost everything i can think of and she wont stay cool, you guys sound like you know what your doing any help would be appreciated
thanks, awais! Do you have other symptoms besides the engine running hot? I got another box from Tony at Ross. Set of pistons, special ground cam and one of his signature easy adjustable timing gears are the highlights. I dropped them all off at my machine shop, and hopefully I'll be able to pick everything up for final assembly soon.
Yeah, I can't wait to work on a clean engine. No more filthy floor and dripping stuff any where. Dave, I'll let the machine shop do all the work I pay for anyways, but I'm planning on doing the finishing stuff myself. I was encouraged to go ahead and clean behind the shop some more, so honestly I hope it won't be too bad to do that. You should have said something about those parts when you were up here. I totally forgot...
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