Hey guys, I just have a quick question... I'm in process of polishing the anvils for the English wheel here in the shop. I've chucked them up in the lathe and have gone through the grits, but the anvils seem to have come with sort of a grooved texture right from the get-go. Starting out with a good course grit didn't seem to take it down. I'm guessing they are hardened. Should I resort to using a bastard file and carefully cut the surface down, then go through the grits again? In my mind these should be a mirror finish, as not to transfer anything to my panels while wheeling. Thoughts? Tips? Tricks?
If you are working aluminum that will be polished, a mirror finish is required. Working steel, that will be painted, not as critical.
Both, but have plans for some serious aluminum work very soon. Should I just start over with some 60 or 80 grit and just continue through the grits? Maybe try using a soft block as a backer?
I would use a 8'' orbital and put the lathe on a slow setting, and work through the grits, a 6'' DA would work also... my $.02
Scooter, if they are hardened, you will have to get through the hardened surface before you will accomplish any polishing. Then you will have to get them re-hardened so that they will last and not score on you. You could also call a heat treating shop and see what they say about it. Been too many years since I was in one. Len
These are from the Eastwood Company. I'll give them a call and ask them if they're hardened. Anyone else polished Eastwood Anvils? EDIT: Just called Eastwood and of COURSE there wasn't a human "available to speak with me at this time".... Figures.
Crap... After doing a little digging on-line. I stumbled across the PDF instructions for the weld-up kit they offer. This has the same anvils. http://www.eastwood.com/images/pdf/28171Q.pdf In the parts list it shows them as "Hardened 4130 Chro-Mo anvils" Crap... How deep below the surface would these be hardened? (sorry if that's a dumb question. Never sent anything out for case hardening) Am I doomed to having these cut using a radius cutter and then re-hardened?? Why the hell would they send them out with a non-polished surface???
You may try this stuff to re-case harden the wheels. Just a thought. <!-- Sneak Peek! Were improving the website. --><!--Local--> <!-- header_lpi.htm --> <!-- end headerbg -->You are here: Homepage > Gunsmithing > Metal Preparation & Finishing > Case Hardening & Plating > <!-- end cookietrail --> <!--End section00--> Click to Zoom <!-- end enlarge --><!-- TODO: implement additional views --> <!-- end moreviews --> <!-- end topLeft --><FORM id=productSelectorForm method=post action=/Cart/Add>Kasenit Surface Hardening Compound 1 lb Product #: 119479Manufacturer #: Kasenit-1lb Status: Out of Stock, Backorder OK Date expected in stock: 6/13/2011 $14.99 </FORM> <!-- end tabRow --> Print this Page <!-- end descTop --> An easy way to harden soft, low carbon metals. Kasenit in combination with high heat creates a tough, durable, hardened finish on the surface of metals. Technical Information Notes: Produces a wear surface (surface hardening) on low carbon steel, low alloy steel, iron. Non-poisonous, non-explosive. Application instructions (from Kasenit) for Low Alloy or Low Carbon Steel: There are two methods of application. Method A: Heat the work uniformly to a bright red (1650 - 1700 degrees F), remove any scale with a wire brush, dip, roll or sprinkle the Kasenit powder on the component. The powder will melt and adhere to the surface, forming a shell around the work. Reheat to 1650 - 1700 degrees F, hold at this temperature for a few minutes and quench in to clean cold water. This will give the component a completely hard case of uniform character and depth. Method B: If a deeper case is required, then a container for the compound can be used. A discarded can, lid or tray is suitable for this purpose, but care must be taken to burn off the tin coating before use. Completely cover the component with compound and heat to a bright red (1650 degrees F) for five to thirty minutes, depending upon the depth of case required. Quench only the component in clean, cold water unsing dry tongs for handling. Rates of Penetration: After heating the component to 1650 F using method B, Case depth .005, Time 15 minutes Case depth .010, Time 30 minutes Case depth .015, Time 40 minutes Case depth .020, Time 50-55 minutes Method for Cast or Tool Steel: Heat the article to a light yellow. Deposit it in powder and leave it there until its right tempering heat is reached (see list below). Then plunge the metal into clean, cold water. This will bring out the hardness and also prevent cracking. Heat Tempering List: Small cutting or turning tools, cutting edges of knives, planing tools and reamers, small case hardened parts: Light straw color, 440 F Carbon steel milling cutters, large cutting or turning tools, slotting tools and small punches or dies: Straw color, 460 F Drills, small taps, profile cutters, screwing dies and hammers: Dark straw, 480 F Press dies, shears, wood cutting tools: Orange, 500 F Chisels, large punches, pressing dies and cutlery: Light purple, 525 F Saws, drifts, large dies and heavy chisels: Purple, 540 F Springs or portions of tools to be locally tempered to give maximum resilience: Blue, 560 F <!-- system 11/30/2009 -->
Have you tried them to see if it is impossible to live with? My upper wheel is a semi-steel shipping cart wheel, doesn't leave a mirror finish but a smooth one. Are you building a bare polished aluminum body? Then I think it would be wise to call Joe Andrews at Hoosier pattern(or is it profiles?) for a polished set. tt
I have the Kasenit already. But if I have to go to that level, I'll just live with a non-polished surface. This IS indeed going to be used to roll an aluminum body panel. I can always polish out scratches and marks, but if I would like to eliminate that step, if possible. I can't justify buying a whole new set of Hoosier Pattern Anvils, even though they are completely bitchin'... I don't have the money to drop. Have to make do...
I have the same set of wheels from Eastwood and I just polish them like you have and the markings are almost invisible. IMHO you could live with the finish, try a piece of scrap. Just my 2 cents.....
Hey Scoot, Are you planning on wheeling thru welds with your anvils? Whata 'bout wheeling stainless for art metal projects? If the answer to either of the above is no, I'd polish off the lines so they don't print your work, and wheel your brains out! Sending these out to be rehardned after polishing out the grooves with the hope the bearings will run true afterwords is gonna be like takin a piss into the wind and wonderin why you got wet! The semi hardened and soft wheels will run well in 3003 & AK steel as well as 1010 " Humpty Dumpty was pushed "
Ya, what he said. Plenty of carbon in 4130, thru hardened. As long as you have a lathe, why not do a hard turn? Use carbide if not too hard and CBN if real hard. On a CNC lathe would be best.
The answer to "Are you planning on wheeling thru welds with your anvils?" is... ...No. The answer to "Whata 'bout wheeling stainless for art metal projects?" is also... ...No. Only clean steel. But in the more immediate future, ALUMINUM. I plan to proceed in polishing and "wheeling my brains out"...
Good to know! I don't have a radius cutter to do a clean up pass on anything other than the flat anvil.
You could always grind them with a tool post grinder too. If you don't have one of those, mount a die grinder on your tool compound. That will at least get your scratch down (scratch is what we used to call your conditions when I built molds and dies). Don't always think getting to the deep grits is best, a lot of time the deep grits will put in more scrtach than they take out, then you'd be fighting a losing battle over and over. Same story using a file. You might try polishing stones, but keep them wet with some water or kerosene. When I did polish work a lot of the time I'd start light. Then If i had to I would get slightly deeper, but concentrating on just the one scratch in one spot. If that makes any sense. What you have there is basically a crudely machined part, so it almost needs a good skim cut to get it back flat, and just guessing I'd say your sizing is not really an issue. Its worth a shot with some good carbide, light cut (.005-.010), respectable tool radius (.031), and slower feeds(.003-.005 ipr) on a medium speed (400-500rpm). Then come back in 280 grit or so, using kerosene as lube. Use progressive grits til you get the shine you'd like. Just what I'd ty anyways.
Scooter, I got my anvils from Ron Covell. Very smooth! I have been told to dress them with 400 grit, If my anvils are the same dia, would you like to try one? Gordon
If you want to smooth the surface of hardened material you can use a carborundum stone like you use for hand sharpening chisels. Gives smooth surface which is easy to polish. Easy way to tell when smooth is to give a quick polish now (just to make it shiny), then use the stone. When you can't see any shiny stripes (which will be grooves) it's flat. Then polish properly. Use at a slowish speed in the lathe with a little oil.
Scooter, I just happened to think (must be a good day). You might try something called Razursharp or Razorsharp. I can't find my bucket right now. I use it to sharpen reel type lawn mower knives and reels. After a time they can get really work hardened. I think you can get a small tub of it. Try Foley-Belsaw and see what they have. Len
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