thanks for the info maybe copper plated steel lines for safety i dont like fire unless its coming out the open headers
One of the very nice things about copper as a material for small metal parts is that it has such rich colors whether the surface of the metal is polished or left to tarnish or even to weather into a patina. I'm not sure where on a car it would be desirable to allow copper surfaces to develop all the way to a natural patina, but it's common to see copper and bronze statues allowed to weather in that manner. The Statue of Liberty in New York harbor is sheathed in hand-formed copper sheets that have been allowed to weather to a beautiful green patina. Copper on well-cared-for machinery, however, seems more commonly to be polished.
I originally put copper line on mine but took it off,who wants a engine fire that was caused by fatigued copperIve seen the manufacturers use copper coated steel lines prob. to keep from rustin.How bout stainless polished or dull that would look sweet.
A little bit OT, but good place for it. A lot of you guys/gals are in the trade. But for many folks, including hobbiests, they don't realize this: Am seeing some dramatic fires associated with 80's fuel injected cars. Rubber hoses are failing. (hardened, heat soaked, still running 30 to 70 psi, Ethanol content --- all factors) Keep your families and friends safe on this subject. If you replace with hose, use proper special clamps and hose ratings, too.] Weatherhead 30R9 is a good starting point. Watch bending radius. Research it first, though. I've seen a lot of expensive hardware and a couple folks burned, plus garages and houses, please be careful. This is on-par with cars falling off jacks, but far, far more prevalent.
Nickel/chrome plating will crack because it is much more brittle than the mild steel it is plated on. Even with cracking, a proper plating job should not allow peeling. If there is peeling, then there is improper adhesion. Copper is fairly malleable and you can get away with some bending after copper plating, but it is best to do your bending before copper plating; no reason to press your luck.
i have been using copper fuel lines, oil lines and brakes line for years with no problems, but not as long as harley davidson that used them since the beginning. and i know there is a hell of a lot of vibration on a harley, more than any car. so the answer is yes, use rubber on any clamps, and coil the copper where there could be heavy vibration like in the harley photo.
COPPER BRAKE LINES!!! i hope this is your idea of a joke, if not i want to make sure that you are ahead of me on the road.
For those that don'r know, most sprint cars and modifieds use plastic brake lines with compression fittings, I have never had a problem with the plastic brake lines on any of my race cars.
Here's how I plumbed my roadster fuel lines. I soldered the Tee in rather than use compression fittings. Since there is no relative movement between the carbs or the fuel pump, fatigue is not an issue. I like the "old timey" look.
this is a joke right???? no way that is safe in the long run! steel is cheaper and stronger and safer!
You're right, they are, and they are responsible for tons of engine fires. I wouldn't use that crap on any car I build. I have seen new ones leak right out of the box.Same goes for regular copper tubing. My family rides in my cars, and I'm not taking chances with their lives just to be "traditional". Plate some steel line if you have to have the look.
The long nuts are used on older trucks with air brakes. I have spliced and replaced all the copper that I ever want to. I make all my lines from steel tubing, taks a little time and effort, but well worth the effort. Have not tried this product yet, but looking seriously at it for an old pickup I am fixing to do. http://www.brakequip.com/tubes.html
As I ask my guys at times . . . "Just Because You Can . . . Should Yah?" Not in my book . . . why take the risk!
Because they're young and dumb and gonna live forever i guess... Like I said above, I gave it a shot. Did it the right way, the way everyone says is safe... and it failed for me within months. Maybe if you plan on driving 100 miles a year or something it would be fine. I like to drive my cars fast and pile the miles on, no copper lines for me.
first of all it is not copper! it is cunifer which is a copper/nickel seamless tubing. It can be used for fuel lines or yes even DOT approved brake lines. They have been using this type of tubing in europe for years. This is not new technology. would i use straight copper? NO. Would I use cunifer tubing YES and have for years with no problems.
Use cunifer it's DOT approved for brake lines and it's really easy to work with. There is a few threads about it already. I got mine from fedhill. It looks like copper and resist kinking.
Quote: <TABLE border=0 cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100%"><TBODY><TR><TD style="BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset; BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset" class=alt2>Originally Posted by jrt49box first of all it is not copper! it is cunifer which is a copper/nickel seamless tubing. It can be used for fuel lines or yes even DOT approved brake lines. They have been using this type of tubing in europe for years. This is not new technology. would i use straight copper? NO. Would I use cunifer tubing YES and have for years with no problems. </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE> thats all fine and dandy but the guy clearly said he is using COPPER for his brake lines which is a big NO yes he did say copper skidmarks, and most people call and sell cunifer as copper and I am willing to bet his lines are actually cunifer. <!-- / message -->
I would not use copper for fuel lines because gas will slowly eat away the copper. I had a copper line on my coupe for several years and found that when I inspected the dark residue in the plugged filter I found out that it was from the copper line. It will be a dark grey-black silt type substance.
I am telling you that the lines i am using are very safe, i am currently living in denmark which has some of the strictest rules in the WORLD when it come to rules on the way cars are built. Back in America there is not even a MOT test of any sort. all cars over here, even vintage cars have to pass a VERY strict test. and there is not a chance in the world that a speedshop over here would be selling a product which is unsafe (it said on the package brake line). i do not know the exact chemical compound of the lines i used, but it looks like F#€king copper to me. but it is not only copper, it also has nickel, please forgive me for not being exact with what material i was using. here is an article about copper/nickel as brake lines. http://www.copper.org/applications/automotive/hydraulic_brake_tube.html and here is a video with JAY LENO and some old guy talking about the lines that they use over here in europe, which are the same as i am using. http://www.jaylenosgarage.com/video/all-about-brake-lines/190260/
This is directly from the Rochester carb book: Copper and aluminum tubing will fatigue quicker than steel. Use steel line for installations you want to last. If copper or aluminum is used mount it so flexing is limited Steel fuel line with no flexible section is what you will find on GM cars and trucks in nearly all instances. This is the recommendation from RPD engineers because they believe flexible line is more subject to failure. But metal lines can fail due to kinking, perforation by rust, or vibration fatigue. If you install a section of fuel hose or other flexible line, remember to check it regularly. Brittle and cracked fuel hoses are a fire hazard anywhere in the fuel supply system. I see a lot of cars with copper line these days, I have even run copper line in the past with good results. If you are going to run copper a double flare is a good idea, I would probably avoid compression fittings. I have seen ferrules (sp?) crack in high vibration situations. Another thing you may keep in mind is that a double coil (curley cue) makes a fair vibration damper and is a good idea in each line. I use aluminum alot for hard lines because it is easy to work with not unlike copper, but I am quickly getting away from it, it looks good but is susceptable to alcohol and it is next to impossible to find fuel sans alcohol these days. no one make steel or stainless carbs and intakes yet but I can avoid aluminum line. Never the less I don't make my aluminum lines hard, I use small lengther of flex line on either end of each line for a vibration damper and make sure that the line is well supported on any run longer than a foot. Ok that's way too wordy but maybe it will give you something to think about, its like soup eat the meat and spit out the bones, perhaps you'll find something in there that will give you your best solution.
As an alternative to Cunifer, I like to use NiCopp which is as strong as steel but so very easy to use. Here are the details: http://www.agscompany.com/automotive/brake-fuel-transmission-lines/nicopp/11 I buy it from Advance Auto On line in 25ft rolls http://shop.advanceautoparts.com/we...-Grease-Stick-Co-_16190029-P_N3106A_A|GRP2037____ Normal price is $1.83 a foot vs steel at $.99 per foot. As such, I use on line discount coupons from Advance and get 40% off with free shipping when I spend more than $75. This gets the price down to $1.10 per foot which is much more reasonable. It was difficult for me to learn to straighten this coil out when I first started. Now I have the knack and and it no longer presents a barrier for me. I use a grooved block of wood clamped over the line on my work bench. I pull it through and get very nice results. The added benefit of using NiCopp is having both a SAFE line, that also buffs out very nicely. It makes for an attractive finish to your work. If you live close by...feel frree to come over and try a piece. While I am not associated with these folks in any way, I sure like their product. Jamesville, this is very similar to the 90/10 product you have referenced. smile Regards, George King Parker,CO 303 847 9980
Creep, James' is not using water line. His line is a composit and it is brake line made to take the pressure. The europeans use it because it is not as prone to oxidation as the steel lines that we use. it can be pruchased here and is very expensive but if you run it you will have to carry proof of what it is. One of the problems that we run into here is that folks look at something and then just try something that looks like it. Looking at the lines on jame's '36 we automatically assume that it is soft copper like you buy at the hardware store when in fact it is not. So one of us may go to the hardware store and use water line because it is what they think that saw on James' car.
Thanks PorkBeaner, that was very nicely said. you have a good way of reading people and setting things straight with out rubbing them the wrong way. i guess you really have to think about what you say on here, as some people who don't know better will just use regular 'copper' from a hardware store, which of course you can not. i just thought that goes without saying.
Hell buddy I almost always rub someone the wrong way. Sometimes they get over it and sometimes they don't. Hey when you comming this way? Ya wanna stay a month or so we got room for ya.
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