That's right, I am running dry at the valves on my 292. I have read through quite a few threads, but one question is eluding me. Bare with me if I missed it, however. I have seen a few tricks to unblock the head potion of the oiling system, and also how to do the hokey workaround. But here is something I haven't seen... Is there a way to test the system out without installing the rocker arm shafts and running the truck? I know that a lot of cars your can insert a long screwdriver connected to a drill to pressurize a system, is this possible on the Yblock? If not, how do I go about this?
Yes, you can drive the oil pump with a hex bit just like any other engine. I've heard of guys removing one side of rockers and starting them. Some will pull the the rockers and plugs and crank on it and watch. The best trick I have seen to clear the passages in the head is the plate of steel drilled to fit over where the rocker stand would sit. Drill and tap a hole for a grease zerk and pump the sludge back towards the cam. While your cleaning the heads, its a good idea to clean out the shafts and the holes in the rockers as well.
Long wire oil passage cleaners work the best . Use them just like when you tear a block down to clean it . I have a couple sets of the cleaning brushes for many different engine blocks . I have also drained 2 quarts of oil out and added kerosene . Just idle it for about 5 minutes . Gotta be careful not to run it too long because it will wash the oil off the parts . Still I would use the engine cleaning brushes first . The Y block really didn't have the oiling problem , only the oil that was used back then plus people not changing the oil enough ! Keep you Y block ! Happy New Year ! RetroJim
I am actually a bit fearful. I had the covers off to do a valve adjustment. When I started the passenger side was slow to oil, but did. Later it stopped altogether. I have had the rocker shaft off and was checking the passages up top and while they had some gunk, they were not plugged up. And I have run a wire to the point where the passage jogs in the head. No sludge, but it was dry. I am crossing my fingers that this will not require a total tear down to fix since it is my driver. But it sat for about 12-5 years and was a work truck before that. So lots of miles(Hard ones too) and a long hibernation. I don't plan on removing the Y, but we have a running 400M that has been hopped up, that would fit in my 59. It would also give me a solid C6 trans, that is in much better shape than my tired three speed. But I have averaged about 15MPG or so with the Y, and I never knew of a fuel friendly Midland block... So I have to figure out what the problem is, and then figure out what is going to be the best solution. I swear I am going to have my future brother-in-law airbrush Dearborn Money Pit on the doors.
I think with not much mechanical engine knowledge it would be long term better for you to go to the 400M.
I worked in an engine rebuilding shop in the early 60's and never saw anything work to clear those passages in Y blocks once they were plugged up. The problem (as I remember it) was that the oil passages made two 90 degree turns, via a horizontal slot in the head gasket, making it impossible to get a cleaning brush or anything else any farther down than the deck of the block. As retrojim said, the oils of the day and poor maintenance eventually resulted in the passages and the hollow rocker shafts being completely plugged. We sold a kit to T into the oil gallery at the oil pressure gage sending unit and plumb oil up to a replacement hollow valve cover stud on each side which worked well but looked kind of hokey. The rocker shafts still had to be removed and cleaned out too. Most of our garage customers used that kit successfully if their customer was not up for a complete(?) engine tear down. I have not heard of the trick offered by Catholic but it sounds like it "might" work. It's worth a try. Good Luck!
Did you take the rocker arm shaft apart and clean the bar out ? Might be the problem there . Just make sure you put the shaft back the way it cam off . RetroJim
Apparently one of the problems with the Y block was that the cam bearing would turn just a bit, thus blocking the port leading to the oil galley.
i once owned a 60 ford truck mechanic at dads carlot ran copper line from side of block drill holes into valve covers he said would work engine didnt last long i ended up installing 66 caddy engine with auto trans wasnt to bad of swap
I should answer a couple of the responses here. First off, I am not inexperienced with mechanical per say, but very new with Yblocks. And it is a little tough to get good info about them locally. The reason I asked about the oil pump thing is because I know the pump sits horizontally with the crank area and I was uncertain on exactly how the pump was driven. No SBC for me, thanks though. I grew in and around Fords my whole life. I have kind of a special place in my heart for them. But this one is posing to be quite a challenge. Plus I have never used a SBC that didn't seem to have special level of disdain for me. Me and Chevy's don't see eye to eye. I have attempted to backfeed air through that passage, but I think I will give retrojim's suggestion a shot here. I have disassembled the rocker assembly, cleaned it and made sure I put it back together properly. The heads have been worked on before (and not really well, looking at some of the inconsistencies on it ) and I found galling on the shaft which concerns me. But the reason I am hoping to find other options than pulling the heads is that this Yblock is a very high mileage motor. It's numbers show it is a 59 block, so it is pretty likely that it is the original block. From little clues that my work has shown, it has lived a few different lives. Originally a Colonial White F100, it saw a metallic brown paint job somewhere in its life, and then a repaint in what was once a real nice blue. The only knowledge I can actually confirm was that when my future father-in-law picked it up, he used it as a work truck. And the company he worked for did work over four different states out here. So he was hauling pump motors from California north, Arizona, New Mexico and Nevada. It was driven hard and only had the bare necessities done to it, before being put out to pasture. So if I pull the heads, I may find issues that could make fixing the oiling issue turn into an entire rebuild. I am considering the idea of finding used block at a junkyard or Craigslist to use for a rebuild while I limp this one along. That way I can take my time rebuilding one while I limp this one along. And I had just gotten this thing to the point where it fired up without a fight and was idling easy with no drama... It is just needing some love, and I am the unfortunate sucker that wound up with the all the emotional mechanical baggage.
i have top oilers on my slEdsel. These work fine. I have heard that Ford made these engines sometimes with left and right specific heads and if they were swapped, then the oiling problem occurred. Anyone ever hear this?
FWIW that seemed to be the main cause of the problem around here back in the day, common on local logging/lumber trucks. Usual fix was the external top oiler kit.
http://www.ford-y-block.com/ http://www.ford-y-block.com/techincal.htm http://m571.com/yblock/ http://www.y-blocksforever.com/ http://yblockguy.com/
Update on the 292. I don't think I am actually going to be lucky enough to have a blocked passage. I pulled the valve covers off to find that the passenger side started oiling again, at least until it warms up... And then I pulled the drivers side off, with similar results but it never actually stopped oiling. But from cold to hot, there was a noticeable difference. I think that this poor old Y may just be tired and needs to be gone through. This makes that Midland look a lot more enticing. Has anyone here ever put a Midland block (351M or 400M) into a 59 F100? If so, how bad was it? The one we have is a front sump, will that get in the way of anything?
I had oiling problems on the 312 in my T-Bird. The cam bearings were worn, so the groove in the cam was blocked by the part of the cam bearing that was not worn. so no oil to the rockers. New cam bearings fixed it. Mart.
Well, I have been testing a few possible areas where I could be having problems on this. As I have dug in deeper the signs have all pointed to a very tired motor. Today I did what I should have done a while back, a compression test. Well over the course of all 8, I am averaging about 40 PSI a cylinder. Actually it is mostly 25PSI with a couple of 75 PSI's to throw off the average. I am surprised at how well this motor ran all things considered. I think it is safe to say that I am the owner of a 292 that needs to be rebuilt or replaced. I am having to do a lot of thinking here. If I go with the 400, I lose mileage, and since I would like to do more than gas station hop, it is not my number one choice. Any Yblock people able to answer two major questions for me? 1. What is the average cost of a Yblock rebuild? I know there are a lot of variables here, but a ball park will give me at least an idea. 2. Are there any good machine shops around Riverside county that can do a Yblock? Thanks again all, I appreciated the replies.
The last y block i did,with no machine work,just new bearings,rings,and gaskets,and doing all the work myself was just around $500.00.that was without the isky cam and new lifters,and i also had a set of new n.o.s. Pistons and a set of heads that were already done,along with other parts.alot will depend on just how bad it is when you get it apart.
My vote is for getting that little (big?) slug out of there. I never understood how anybody could like the noisy poor oiling pile that the Y-block is but to each their own. As far as mileage goes that 400 won't get any worse than your worn out Y-block. I have found many times over bigger doesn't always equal a drop in mileage. I have had both a 292 and a 400m in trucks. The 292 got 14.5 mpg and the 400 averaged 17 mpg.
From what I was always told, going synthetic required a very good engine. Since it had a tendency to find every weak seal, or poor tolerance in an engine. So in a relatively fresh rebuild it would work fine, but not something with high mileage. At the same time, proper maintenance seems to be the key with keeping the oiling system in good shape on a Yblock. Phil, I am rather enamored with the Yblock myself. It just sounds nice. And truthfully, even as tired as mine is I can light up the tires with no real effort. Good enough for me. However, my big fear was getting mileage in the single digits with the 400. The recent rains have put the brakes on any work for either motor (no covered work areas) but I am planning on pulling the 292 and opening it up some so I have a good idea on exactly what is happening inside. I am also going to get the 400 on a stand for some testing. This way I know which one will be the best runner and the other will be classifieds material.
Just stick an external top oiler kit on it, shut the hood and drive it. you like the way it sounds, it runs ok, lights the tyres up. A simple bolt on swap is easier than an engine swap, plus sometimes with a truck the original motor is more desirable than a mongrel swap. Just my opinion. Mart.
I will agree with the sound, well exhaust sound anyway. They do have a nice rumble that the newer 400 V-8's don't quite match.
Just a thought CSchroom...your compression gauge may be off as I believe that you would have an engine that was nearly impossible to start with compression that low. That's not to say that it isn't tired .Is there much blow by coming from the breather? As this engine has sat unused for a long time ,the rings may be seized up in the ring lands .Filling the cylinders with a good intake cleaner like BG and letting the engine set for a week or so would help to clean up the ring lands /free the rings .Of course you would want to purge the cylinders by cranking it over ,with the plugs out and perform an oil change before starting . V7
My starter is acting up, so I know the numbers were a bit low. I did test it on my bike and had very good numbers. So even thinking that I was spinning the engine slow enough to only show 50% of potential, really it still didn't leave me with much confidence. I did have blow-by and high speed oil burning issues, which could be stuck rings as you said. However, I will be opening it up when the bad weather passes me over. That way I have a better idea on what exactly I need on it. If I am lucky, it may not be as bad as it looks right now.
Sounds like the engine has low oil pressure when it warms up the oil is thinner less pressure rockers stop oiling or get very little. Myself i would swap in the bigger engine and change the rear gears. you likely have 390 or 411 gears at present. with a 300 or 325 chunk you will get better fuel economy than the y block ever will. I have heard about the cam bearings turning. I believe that is a myth. I have taken apart dozens of Y blocks and never found spun cam bearing just a lot of sludge. OldWolf
When I was in high school ( '56 & '57 ) I worked part time for a garage. The Y blocks were new then and almost all that came in with dry rocker assemblies had the center cam bearing spun. Our quick and dirty fix was to pull the radiator, front cover and cam. Then use a long home made drill and re-drill the bearing from each side. This always worked and the drilling seemed to keep the center bearing from futher moving.
i used the old copper tubing kit, and it works great. its a cheap alternative if your broke. they dont look bad either when done right.
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