dont buy any cars from this guy!!

To me it is all about the car and price. I don't care who I am buying it from as long as I am happy with what I am buying and agree on price.

Classic car dealers make cars available world wide where most private sellers (most, don't anyone freak out) only sell local and sometimes they do a poor job of that.

I see what you mean by paying for someone else's mark up but that happens on most anything you buy and not just cars.

 

Old cars is OLD cars. Ya take yer chances buyin stuff on the Net, sometimes ya win sometimes ya lose. Kwityerkickin

 

Don't buy anything sight unseen that you aren't comfortable taking the purchasing amount of money and setting it on fire.

You are both at fault: him for not telling you all the problems, you for not looking the car over in person.

Sorry you don't like the car. Part it out and make your money back.

 

I buy cars often sight unseen, but they are never priced at more than $500. I figure I can part and drive it across the scales for that. I bought a 40 plymouth coupe out of Pennsylvania off the Xbay for what to me was a lot of money. Before I paid, I had local AACA member go by and check it out for me. He reported the condition for me then I completed the deal.

future advice for the OP...contact a HAMB member who lives close. Most will do you a favor and give it a quick once over before you plop down your stash. Barring that, put your own hands on it if it's pricey (as most others have recommended)

 

I've been selling classic cars for about 3-4 years now, I make sure to get a walk around video of the car inside, outside, underneath, trunk, engine, have the car running just about everything so you see what your getting I also put up 15-20 pictures and more if requested and give all the info I know about the car...I'd be beyond pissed if I bought a car that wasent what I expected so I take that into consideration when I sell a car

havent had a single problem yet and I'd like to keep it that way...do as much research as possible before buying a car without seeing it!! and very good advice by JDHolmes..I'm sure any HAMB member would be nice enough to check out the car for you..I'd do it in a heartbeat if someone wasent from my area and was looking to buy a car..done it many times for friends

I believe in karma what goes around comes around..always best to be honest & trust worthy or eventually it'll bite you in the ass one way or another

 

When I bought my Daytona, I asked for pictures of the frame, floor and rocker panels and then from all four corners. And I drove out to CA from MI to pick it up in person before laying the money out. The car was as advertised. I have a hard time paying for transportation and without seeing the car....?

 

I think buying online is dangerous but CAN be done. I got slightly burned buying my '50 FLEETLINE but ultimately I blame it on myself. You just have to know to ask the right questions. I was so jazzed to be getting the car I didn't ask ENOUGH questions. I know, don't let emotion cloud your judgment ! They told me the car had no reverse, they didn't tell me the battery was dead, it ran on 5 cylinders or it had NO brakes whatsoever!! I think the car was worth what I paid for it though. I have a friend who has bought alot of cars off of e-bay, on two separate occasions he felt that the cars weren't represented honestly. Upon delivery, he called the parties and told them he wasn't happy. He told them he was still interested, but either they worked something out or they were getting their cars back! On both occasions the sellers refunded 2 grand to make it right. O.K. so that might not work for you or I , but it worked for him ! I would think if someone posted for help to go look at a car a fellow HAMBER local to the car would go look at it for them. I know I would do it !

 

With 40,000+ HAMB members out there worldwide, I'd never hesitate to ask one of them in the area to scope out a car. I've done it with an other HAMBer around here for a fella in England. Had fun doing it too. Don't know if he bought the car, but we shot him straight, straighter than the seller was, that's for sure.
Never buy a car sight unseen without at the very least getting an uninterested 3rd party to check it out.

 

I couldn't agree more. The first experience I received in this hobby started with a 300 mile drive to a small time wanna-be dealer and ended up being a 1000.00 lesson. He kept bragging about all the cars that he had sold to places that were far far away. I later learned why he didn't have any local customers! Like I've said before "the school of hard knocks-where the tuition is high but the retention is exceptional".
I look forward to reading your story.

 

I wonder if the seller is bitching/posting somewhere "don't sell cars to this guy, he didnt look at before he paid me!"

I mean really that sucks, but like all have said, it depends what you paid for it, and what you expected for your money sight unseen is very subjective. If you were buying a very expensive vehicle you should have at the very least had someone look at it for you, or gone to have seen it yourself. Sorry man...

 

View attachment What_to_ask_Buying_Vintage_car.doc

Attached is the list of things to have the Seller fill out BEFORE you negotiate. If they are willing to fill this out completely, I'd say you're at least 1 step closer to having an honest sales person. Then you will have good information to ask questions of, and more importantly pictures / videos. I made this list years ago, and it has been published a few times for some clubs. In the past I had Vehicle A.D.D. and I would impulse purchase too many times, not covering the basics. If I get all of these questions answered, then I tend to make better judgments on vehicles. <?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-comfficeffice" /><o></o>
<o></o>
While I am not promoting buying a car unseen, as you should probably see any sizeable investment up front, but if it just isn't in the cards, then I offer this tool. <o></o>

 

Another one that burned me bad on a 40 Ford street rod serveral years ago was Hooked on Classics in MN. I was looking for a car I didn't have to do work on while I was finishing another car. I found this one looked great in pics asked tons of questions and paid a good chunk of change for the car. My plan was a wheel change to steelies and caps with wide whites and drive the piss out of it. Waited for the transport truck like a little kid only to see a piece of crap arrive at me office. It was not even safe to drive let alone the nice turn key car I was buying. I had take 6 months off my project car just to make 1/2 a car out of the piece of crap I bought.

Stay away from Hooked on Classics in MN and look at a car in person if at all possible.

 

What a great list Bugbox...I'll bet that will solve a lot of problems for those persisting on buying something without checking it with their hands...

Many thanx...

R-

 

Not putting your own hands on the car before you buy puts you in almost for sure
chance of a screwing! If he does not help rectify this situation send a link to this site and thread to let him know how many people know about this bad deal

 

This sucks but the reality is there is no reason to not have some idea of what you are buying. There are companies all around the country that will send someone to look at a car. They test drive (if possible), take pictures and create a report on the entire car. I did it two years ago, was the best hundred bux I have spent and a hell of a lot better than ending up with junk for a bunch of money. In my case, the car was represented very well and we purchased it.

 

lets see the car,,

 

G'day ,

We have a problem of a fairly good pond between us and the good ole US of A where we like to buy cars and all Aussies would have a horror story they have heard . I sell Classics for a living and when I bought a '61 Coupe Deville from San Fran last year off Evilbay the photo's the guy sent me is what I would sent to a potencial buyer and I was surprised , so I bought it . A couple of Months later the car arrived and I couldn't have been happier , Great result from an honest seller , it wasn't a huge amount of money so the risk wasn't great but I had a gut feeling the seller was genuine and this time I was right , sorry to hear of your bad luck , hope some good comes out of it ,

Cad.

 

Tip number one just because the seller has Museum in its name, doesn't make it so. I'd avoid them w/o having an inspection.

Tip number two and I've found out the hard way pictures sure can lie. I have a money pit sitting in the garage thats taking too much time to get it straighten out.

Tip number three just because you've talked to a seller and he is potentially friends with other people you know, be it on a forum or club doesn't mean he isn't out for his own interest. Friend of a friend, of a friend, of a friend, oh i know the guy. Found that out too.

Who says you can't can't teach old dog new tricks.

 

Sorry you got snookered. There are just too many of these horror stories anymore. Some folks just aren't honest If I can't see it myself I don't buy it. I guess I would consider having someone I trust evaluate a car for me, but here in AZ there are just too many nice projects to have to go elsewhere.

 

I ran into the same problem about 15 years ago. I bought a 57 Ranchero from a guy in New York, who had it advertised in "Wheel and deals". The car looked good, from the picture in the book. I talked to him over the phone and explained I lived in Kentucky. I didn't want to drive the distance, nor bother someone from the NSRA Fellowpages. I ask him if there was any rust anywhere on the car, since it was an upstate car with harsher winters than in Ky. He said, not a speck of rust anywhere, the car had been stored indoors in a barn on blocks for the past 30 years. I thought man this is great, and sent him a deposit. I contacted a carrier service, and sent the balance with them. When the car got to my house, the driver called me and asked where should he offload it, and that I owed him more money because the car didn't run as was stated in our contract. When I got outside to show him where I wanted it, I saw daylight coming through the bed. The whole floorboard and part of the bed was completely rusted through. Talk about being pissed. I called the guy up and told him I was sending the car back to him and he would have to pay the carrier's fee. He said, you may as well keep it, I have already spent your money. When I asked him about all the rust under the car, he said, what do you expect from a New York state car that has set outside for the past 20 years. I learned my lesson after that. Now if I can't see it, I don't buy it.

 

I am also from up by Green Iowa and although I have never bought anything from him it always seemed to me that most of what he advertises looks too good to be true coming from a place with harsh winters and tons of salt. I am sure he probably purchases cars from all over but since he doesnt have a huge warehouse on site they are going to be exposed to the elements.

On a side note he does have a lot of cars there and if anyone runs across something they want more information on I would be willing to stop in and take a few pics and ask questions on your behalf.
I know what its like to buy something and not have it be as described.

 

Had a 55 Chev Bel Air two door post for sale about 22 years ago. No engine, a big hole in the hood where someone had had a thunderbolt hood scoop and either a Pontiac or Olds rear end under the back. It was a solid body and good frame with a clear title. I was asking 350 cash for it at the time and had who knows how many people show up and ask if it ran or complain because it had one door that wasn't a Bel Air door

On buying a car sight unseen. There are very few areas in the country that we don't have someone close enough that would go take a look and take photos to send for no more than gas and burger money at the most. If the seller won't let you have someone of your own choosing check it out it most likely isn't something you want to buy anyhow. Sometimes someone will probably know the car in question or know the seller.
Plus Google is your friend when buying almost anything as if there is dirt on the seller on the net you will find it there.

 

It is too bad the OP feels taken advantage of. I hope it can be worked out. We don't have much information to go on. I think Little Wing is on the right track, we need more info and photos. But, this post has kind of taken a turn to discussing classic car dealers in general. As a dealer, I felt my $.02 needed to be added.

The list provided by "thebugbox" is a great starting point. I was anticipating more. Not criticizing at all, but that would be a cakewalk to me. We usually get a much more exhaustive list of questions when a caller is seriously interested in one of ours.

So do dealers really serve a purpose? One service we provide it to go through a list like this, and much more, before we buy the vehicle. As professionals that do this all day, every day, it becomes second nature. Truthfully, the afore mentioned list of questions is usually answered before I even venture out to look at a prospective purchase.

As a customer of a classic car dealership, you would certainly hope that all these questions, and more, were already answered. You would hope the issues were addressed.

Dealers take a huge risk in purchasing cars from private individuals, preparing them for sale, spending thousands on advertising and incurring the operating expenses of doing business legally. We invest lots and lots of money and it can take years before some of our inventory ever sells.

We get calls every day from all over the Midwest by folks looking to sell their cars. By sifting through them and making them available to the general public, a service has been provided.

In Wisconsin, every vehicle offered for sale by a licensed dealer must display a buyer's guide, offering full disclosure. Many of the areas addressed by the list provided by "thebugbox" are included in said document. This document must be shared with the customer and they sign off that they are in understanding.

Dealers in WI also must be licensed/bonded/regulated. This is not true about private sellers. Dealers are also responsible for collecting sales tax. We don't have the opportunity to "fudge" the selling price. You know exactly what I am referring to.

Repeat customers are very important to a dealer. Word of mouth is, too. Bad PR goes much further than good...as is evidenced by this very thread.

What recourse does a customer have with a private seller?

Yes, the buyer should beware. As a buyer, I find the answers I get from another dealer are easier to evaluate than those from some of the "professional" private sellers. Reputable/surviving dealers will not succeed by being dishonest. Sooner or later, it will come back to bite them.

Go to a swap meet. Buy a car at an auction. How much information do you get? Do you have time for multiple photographs (some folks ask for 50 or more), do you get to fill out your "list", can you ask for the vehicle to be elevated for underbody inspection? I doubt any of those can be done to the level you can get and should expect from a classic car dealership.

And finally, would you even bitch on a public forum about a private individual that sold you a POS? Would anybody listen? Would anybody post a link to their website?

If you don't feel a dealership deserves a margin, then buy from a private individual. Are you certain they aren't earning a margin? It takes a lot of money each month to open the doors and turn on the lights, especially if you conduct business in a legal and ethical fashion.

So there is my $.02 worth. Another expense to account for! And I hope this post helps explain the value brought to the table by classic car dealerships.

 

Couldn't agree more on this comment. I know the door can swing both ways, buyer or seller, but in my experience the people selling vintage cars have them WAY overpriced. I've been to several junkyards as well and these vehicles as well as parts are way overpriced as well. Most recently, my brother and I were checking out a 60 impala at a collector car lot. The quarters were shot and bondoed over. The floors were rotted and repaired with metal screwed through the remains of the floor. But the paint was relatively slick and the interior was pretty nice. The engine compartment needed cleaned up. I didn't start or drive the car. His price 12,500. He said after he saw us looking it over, "I know it needs two quarter panels, but that is still a hell of a deal on that car." I said thanks for letting us look and left.

 

That website looks like a red flag to me.

 

This would be worth a plane ticket for a good old ass beatin'

 

2 rules to go by.......... 1.. never buy a car in the dark.......2... never buy a car in the rain ......... lol the rest is simple

 

2 rules to go by.......... 1.. never buy a car in the dark.......2... never buy a car in the rain ......... lol the rest is simple so if u cant see it up close pass

 

My grandpa always said those two and also "never buy a car in primer that just needs paint"

I guess I've let him down plenty b/c I've done all three......once at the same time!!HA

 

I for one have had better luck buying or trading cars with a licensed dealer than I have had with the general public. This goes for used late model car as well as collector cars. And also in my experience as a former used car dealer a few years ago I noticed some in the general public selling an extra car seemed to think they have "carte blanche" to lie and misrepresent their car for sale or trade in. Obviously not all dealers of ANYTHING are totally honest but in my experience a licensed dealer who spends alot of money advertising is interested in repeat business and WANTS to stay in business long term. That being said, I highly recommend doing business with Bobwop in WI who has treated me very good in several deals. I consider him a very good friend after having done business with him. However he sells nice cars and not rough project cars like this fellow in IA. And like the others have mentioned we have 94,000 members of this board and would be a good idea to ask one to look at your potential new purchase before you pay.