Chevy 283 or 355 in 57 chevy?

Hey guys,

Is it worth going over to a 283 (292 after boring) or will the loss of torque be too signifigant?

Or should i just put my money into the 350, buy a forged steel stroker crank and put a roller cam in it?

Here are the Specs:

my current motor is a 350 bored .030 over with a .513 lift cam and 280 duration. 10.5:1 TRW aluminum pistons, cast steel crank 1.94 valve camel hump heads off a 67 chevelle. ive already got a multispark ignition/ rev limiter.
-have a m-20 muncie and ford 9 inch with 3.08s for the street and 5.13's with a spool for the strip.
-cfm's for the carbs are 2 holley 450's so 900cfm.

i would like to replace it with the 283 for both nostalgia purposes and for a power gain if im gonna make the effort.

obviously gonna be a high revving motor. i was thinking maybe .060 over with roller cam? and like 12:1's haven't put that much thought into it yet but somewhere upwards of .600 lift and 300 duration( to bring the power band up a little closer to the 283's new red-line) i also plan to still use the tunnel ram and the camel hump heads (cuz the 283 can only take 1.94's till the valves hit cylinder wall)


i also heard the newer 283 blocks couldnt handle the .125 bore to 4" to make it a 301

if any of you are even willing to share a 283 blueprint to give me an idea for what im looking at. All i have under my belt is the 19 years of my life for experience and whatever ive been able to read

im in college and on a budget so be nice!

thanks for any input guys and also thanks for the support!

-Nick-

 

Sounds like you're describing an old Modified Production engine. Are you going to drive this on the street? If you are, I would keep the compression below 10/1. You'll be surprised how hard it is to even get the compression up to 10/1 with a 3" stroke crank. I would also keep the cam lift and duration below .500" and 280. That'll be plenty enough cam for the little motor. These motors rev to the moon so make sure that you have an SFI rated flywheel/clutch/bellhousing. It'll probably vaporize the m-20 with a hard launch and 5:13's. My $.02

 

yeah ive got a steel blowshield/ bellhousing now. My current 350 has a .513 lift and 280 duration isky in it right now. and believe me it pulls ( i havent put in my 5.13's yet so maybe im jumping the gun) but i figured if i was gonna replace it, i may as well put a little more oomph in it ya know? but maybe im just pushing myself into trouble and out of a streetable car!

 

If you build the 283 to run with the with your current 350 it will no longer be streetable. The same camshaft in a smaller engine is much wilder.

 

thanks buffalo. surprisingly i didnt really look at it in that perspective. i know its an off question but horsepower? now my current isky has an rpm range of 2500-6800 rpm. will that power range stay? or will it get bumped up some? btt

 

btt

 

My one question would be where are you going to drive this thing with 5.13 gearing? Radical combinations are fun, but that gearing will drive you absolutely nuts without an overdrive. Plan on just putting around town or just drag racing with that combo. It would make a much more usable combo to go much mellower for now, then maybe go insane and make it a more purpose built drag car later.

 

well i am still yoound so im willing to go back and forth with the 3.08's and the 5.13's so if i plan to be driving long distance/ or if i plan to go drag racing. its alot of gear oil but its the price we have to pay

 

which also what i just wrote kind of answers my own question because the 355's extra torque may come in handy when im driving around with 3.08's. but i dont know. Im torn! this is why i need help haha

 

Cool! Your young but your thinking this out! I love all the old stuff too, but if you really look, most of the radical stuff from the era was on dedicated drag stuff. I don't mean to throw a wet blanket on your dreams, but I've been there! You know that your daily driver is a bit crazy when you hope your "TRICK FUELS" delivery shows up in time to drive to work on monday! Mine was a 55 gal drum and a hand pump in the back yard cut with ocasional blasts of pump gas for longer trips than my three mile commute!! Great fun but it gets expensive real quick. Back to gears - there is always this method of dealing with deep gears - I-pod real loud! Phoenix Az., to Austin Tx. with 4.11 and 29" tall tires at about 80-85 average. Oh, 283 too! Great trip, didn't hear for two weeks.

 

Here are the two parts of your question that stood out to me.
Is there anything wrong with your current combination? Anything broken or far worn?

If you are really on a budget and want some more power, my vote goes for dialing in your current motor. Generally, a 350 is easier to eek power out of strictky based on cubic inches.

 

I have a 327 with a crossram and 88 gears. It was my daily driver all throgh high school and I wouln't have it any other way. The only problem I see with your ideas is that you are trying to build a radical motor to run on both mild gears and race gears.

What is wrong with the combo you have right now? I think you could be real happy with a set of 373 gears and everything esle remain.

 

A well built street engine will put out about 1hp/cubic inch. Do the math.
Larry T

 

well i guess theres nothing wrong yet, but i figured on starting to compile parts for the 283 before next summer! but no nothings wrong with my current motor. the 350 just doesnt seem to fit in a tri five. i guess its not a big deal but im trying to lean towards period correct. im trying to build a car that someone my age would have built maybe back in 1965. keep in mind its my only car. so its inevitable that im going to want the best of both worlds. im obviously not in a rush. and if i decide not to go with the 283, it doesnt mean im going to rip out my 350 for no reason and build it again. but i like to test myself and see what i can personally accomplish i guess.

first it was building the car from nothing and getting it running with a 200R4 and a stock 350. then it was building my first performance engine and putting in a muncie. then it was changing over from factory suspension and modifying it to hang under the frame rails for more tire clearance. Now its building a motor more gnarly than the first! as you know its a never ending game! no to mention putting in straight axles for my buddies and building their motors!

i could always build it later in life but even now 283 parts are getting kind of iffy to find up in the northeast.

 

I agree, 3.73's or 4.11's for maximum performance, also a solid lifter cam will get that 355 spinning up to 7500. I'd forget the 283 for now, probably save it for a lighter hot rod. Don't get me wrong, I've had two of them in a '55 (and every damned gear from 3.08 to 5.37) and also a 301 in a Z28 and they are a blast, it's just that the larger motor does everything so much easier and with more authority! It will also tolerate a 3.08 gear like it's not there. It also sounds like you could freshen the 355 cheaper, but one thing you said I disagree with, my 265 bored to 283 I had in high school was 12 1/2:1, .030/.030 cam, camel humps with 2.02" valves, and they never hit anything, maybe what people are referring to is that they would be shrouded.

 

Alright unclee, i think im starting to agree with you guys. i needed a little shove in the right direction. the 350 is the logical direction i guess. plus the 283 isnt going anywhere! sometimes i forget the best part about hotrodding is having fun for (relatively) cheap. thanks guys its what i needed!

also what do you mean by shrouded?

and i also had a question about hydraulic vs solid.
-does the solid camshaft let the motor spin faster than the hydraulic?

my current hydraulic camshaft's rpm range is 2500- 6800 and ive got anti pump ups which i was under the impression that they prevent valve floating to a point via probably letting me rev to around 7000- 7200?

AND should a cast steel crank shaft be ok to the rpm's? its a scat crank which is rated at 500 hp up to 7000 or 7500 rpm? or should i consider replacing it? last thing i want to do is break it this spring with a hard launch( no slicks yet but still) i have a decent amount of knowledge for my age but my experience is obviously limited. thus why i turn to you guys! thanks!!

 

find a 4-71 blower, build the 283 for it, you'll get a bit of a power increase over the lame 350 and it'll be more streetable than a high revving unblown 283. get some 3.36 gears you'll be all set

btw the cam mostly just needs to match the rearend gears...duration determines the rpm power band....

 

yes but unclee implied that solid lifter camshaft ups the rpm range as well(which i wasnt aweare of?) also 4-71 blower doesnt exactly scream budget build! haha but thanks squirrel. appreciate it! ill definitely keep it in mind

 

Grasshopper, the squirrel gives wise counsel. I've never had anything he's said not be factual.

A blower motor uses low compression and SBC 4-71's can be picked up used.

 

believe me. i would never doubt or disrespect an old school hamber! i am taking note! its actually something that didnt cross my mind and ill probably heavily consider this in the future but my budget is a little thin as of right now. for a blower motor. i mean the actual build up of the motor would be pretty close to one another as far as $$ but the cost of the blower, belt, pulleys, intake,and carbs makes me feel a little uneasy. :/

however perhaps keeping the 350 in it for now and still compiling parts in the mean time would be wise.

now on this note. IF i were to build a blower motor, would 1.94 valves and stock compression pistons be sufficient?

as stated above i was under the impression that 2.02 valves would cause interference (also to a 283 1.94 valves are like 2.02's to a 350), would 2.02's make it over valved? thus needing less duration? but then again this is a blower motor and duration doesnt shouldnt be high

 

build a 383 out of the 350 and sticker it up and dress it to look like a 283.

 

yeah then you can fool the guys who don't know much about engines....it's important to fool them.....

The blower idea was just an idea, if you can't swing it then oh well. Point being that the guys who say you can't make a streetable 283 that's more powerful than the 350 are right, unless you figure out a way around it--boost is that way around it.

 

Doesn't cost any more to stick the blower on the 350, probably less actually. And you're still making more power than an equally built 283.
Larry T

 

SO. when it comes down to it. The only reason i would put a 283 back in my car was to be strictly for nostalgia purposes.

However. horsepower can be added on with properly fed high RPM's which aslo can be more easily achieved with a 3" stroke rather than a 3.48" or 3.75" stroke. so the only thing a 283 is lacking at the point is that 'put you in your seat' Torque of the 350 or 383.

however the 283 at this point you guys classify as unstreetable? btt

 

RPM is not more easily achieved with a shorter stroke.

Engines with a shorter stroke need rpm to make power.

The cam you have would work well in a 283 at 7,000-7,500 rpm. In your 350, it works well at 5,500-6,000 rpm. You can spin your 355 to 7,500 too- you just have to design it to work up there (bigger ports, cam, etc,). Valvetrain-wise, 7,500 is 7,500. You'd still need to upgrade the valvetrain on the 283 if you wanted it to spin that high and live for awhile.

If you build a 383, same deal. Just bump the numbers up to feed the cubes, and enjoy the extra torque down low.

A relatively mild 383 will make enough power to break stuff in the rest of your car (trans, rear axle, driveshaft, etc.). That stuff needs to be strong anyway.

Cubic inches are free power. Tell everyone it's a 283 so they can dig on the nostalgia, but enjoy the extra 100 inches. Like Squirrel said- a decent motor is 1 hp/ci. That's 100 extra horses...

 

283

 

thanks scotch. great summary! thanks for clarifying

 

exactly. Who gives a shit about "foolin" anyone. Build the 383 for the free power from the more cubes yet dress it up like a nostalgic 283 if thats the look you want. Corvette aluminum valve covers, dual 4s etc

 

Faking it aint cool, infact honestly, its gay

Punch the 283 out to 355, it's been done before

Or take the 283 1/8 over and add a turned down 400 crank, for a 3.75 stroke, 383 done the traditional way, without having to find a 3/4" stroker crank

 

will that much stroke fit in the 283 block? I'd probably stick with a 327 if I were gonna try for cubes with the old block