Edelbrock 1404 ,starved and wont start after sitting for a few days. any ideas?

edlebrock carb ,i have never been a fan of these carbs,,

but after the car has sits for about 3 or four days ACCORDING TO THE PREVIOUS OWNER,AS I HAVE JUST PURCHASED IT THIS MONDAY AND HAVENT LET IT SIT FOR MORE THAN A DAY OR TWO WITHOUT STARTING IT it wont start unless you prime it (pour gas down carb)

the fuel pump has been replaced,it has a flow thru fuel filter, someone said accelerator pump,but?????? any ideas?

 

It could be as simple as a slow seepage at a hose clamp.
Is this like a Carter Carb?
I dont recall the # thats all.

But you may have a stuck metering valve that is allowing fuel to bleed off.

Get it to operating temp, and shut it off. Go look in the top of the carb to see if there is any "white smoke"

That is gas dribbling out after shutoff.

If that is the case pop off the little metering rod covers and pull the rods out, then put them back, make sure they spring up and down.

Then change the oil because the extra gas in the crankcase isn't doing any good.

 

shoot,i beleive i am deslisic.its a 1404, (500 cfm manual choke)
yes the old carter type.

i know what you are saying about the white smoke,i have seen that before on holleys when the needles stick,but havent seen that on this carb,,,but i check into that ,thanks for the info

 

I have the same problem with mine. Some say it's siphoning back but I have seen others say its a carb problem leaking raw gas into the intake. I'll be watching this post too to see if anyone knows.

 

Under those 2 kidney shaped covers at each end of the air horn, are the metering rods. THere is a spring in there with it. For whatever reason, the spring binds up on little burrs on the rod. Then, the rod no longer goes up and down. A main cause that I have noticed for either shitty fuel economy or fuel starvation like you describe. Usually both together.

 

What type of fuel pump are you using? Also, is the gas tank a sealed system with tank baffles or not?

Edlebrock carbs are basically aftermarket AFB's, fyi.

 

First, let me say that there is no such thing as fuel siphoning back through the carb...there is NO way that fuel is going to back flow through the seat that's located on the very top of the bowl. What may be happening is that the little rubber one way valve in the fuel pump may have a piece of debris lodged between it and the seat. This will allow fuel to leak back down the fuel line from the carb inlet to the lowest point in the fuel line...but not siphon out what's in the bowl. But you've replaced the pump. What is most likely happening is that the gas is percolating off, once the hot engine is shut down, or evaporating through the bowl vent. Modern gasoline is formulated for a "closed" fuel system (fuel injection), and has a very low vapor pressure. Gasoline for carburated engines was formulated for an "open" system, and had a higher vapor pressure. I have the same problem with my 2x4 DeSoto...idleing in traffic for a long time on a really hot day, restarting a hot engine after a few minutes, or after sitting for a few days. I cured it, once and for all. Installed a cheapo electric pump just in front of the gas tank, with a toggle switch inder the dash. Before starting, I hit the switch for a few seconds, until I hear the tone change (carbs full) turn it off then start. Completely elimimnated the problem.. I got mine at Sacramento Vintage For (6V, flow-thru type)...

 

I run Eddies on both my cars (four total) and one on Dad's. If they sit for more than say five days or more, it takes about 15-20 seconds of cranking for the fuel to fill the bowls and finally start. This is their nature, I haven't seen one yet that didn't have that issue, I love the carbs and just deal with it. An electric fuel pump would eliminate excessive cranking.

 

I may be all wet here---but I seem to remember disassembling one of these carbs, and---Right at the point where the gas line enters the carb, there is an anti-flowback valve consisting of a small steel ball resting in a cone shaped socket. This is not in any way part of the needle and seat and float bowl. Its sole purpose seemed to be to prevent gas in the line from gradually backflowing thru the fuel pump to the gas tank while the car was setting for extended periods of time.---then again, it might have been a quadrajet that I'm remembering..

 

If your car can't crank long enough to refill a carburetor, forcing a manual prime......you've got bigger issues than the carb.

good luck

 

Every Edelbrock carb I have owned has done this, and I have owned a bunch. drive it every day and no problems.

 

The fuel we buy is the problem. I put an electric fuel pump back by the tank to prime the system, use a switch on the dash. The carb is vented to the atmosphere, the fuel evaporates in three days time. The Edelbrocks are very reliable, and easy to tune.

 

I've had issues with the inlet valve sticking closed. Even though it's upside down, it would stick closed. I've pulled it apart and found it like that. It only happened in the winter, with the winter blend gas. I'd have to carry a plastic hammer, and smack the carb a couple of times. I could hear the fuel rushing back into the bowls.

 

I've had same problem with edelbrocks on customers cars, don't seem to have same problem with hollys (might soon enough if they go tits up). Think i'll set up to do a bench test on an edelbrock.
Don't want to steal this thread, i'll start new one. oj

 

Percolating. Happens with my tri-power if it sits for a week. Electric fuel pump would solve the problem.

 

I put an electric pump on mine, a 750 and it cured it. The 800 on the truck has to crank a little, I will probably put an electric on it too.

 

Something that can happen too is that when you shut it off its kind of like water hammer in your pipes. The pump and bowl pressure will rise momentarily along with percolation from heat soak and push fuel through the needle and seat causing a nozzle drip. Once it starts siphoning it out, its like siphoning gas out of your car, it will keep on siphoning out through the boosters, or most likely the idle system too until the fuel supply is almost gone, the lowest point. Its a slow process, but it can drip for awhile, a couple of hours. The mechanical fuel pump then after a few days loses its prime and takes a few strokes to pull fuel up. The combination of the two can make them do this. If you went out the next day its likely that the pump still has a prime and it will fill the bowls back up.

Gas evaporates worse today than it used to. The RVP around here is 9 in the winter and 7 in the summer. It used to be 7 and 5. Its the ethanol they are mixing in. Something else too, the fuel line on the suction side can pull in air through the hose and make getting the fuel to the pump slower. Make sure the hose isn't weather checked and your connections are tight. You would be surprised that fuel wont leak but it can still pull in air. Also mechanical pumps dont care for filters on the suction side. Put your filter between the pressure side of the pump to the carb.

 

i'll second (or third) that EVERY edelbrock i've seen in the shop or in my driveway does this.

i never really gave it much thought. i just figgered the gas was evaporating thru the vent tubes or something simple like that...

i've never been gravely concerned because when i do drive the car regularly, it starts right up, first time, every time.

 

I had those stinkers on 5 cars and every one did the same thing and with a mechanical fule pump you have to crank the hell out of them to make it start. About 2 months ago I sold ever one of them on ebay and did a honest description but they still sold. If I started them every day it was never an issue but 3 days and they were empty. I replaced every one of them with Holley Advengers and problem solved,

 

There's another thread on this topic. I put this up there. I think we forget that fuel evaporates.

"It likely has little to do with the carb having a fault, but rather just a characteristic of the design. First off, hard starting after sitting for several days is most often because all traces of a combustible mixture evaporated away through the air intake tract. Then the large number of cars using these with open air cleaners means a high number of them are exposing the carb vents to air flow while sitting. This will evaporate the fuel from the bowls. Show me one having this problem with a closed aircleaner and a full intake tube into calm air.
Othe carb types cover the symptoms better with excessive accellerator pump shots that saturate the intake charge on one pump and have different vent configurations."

 

maybe i should say this, i just picked up the car monday,
but ,before i bought it the then owner warned me about this issue with the car,he stated he would have to prime the carb after sitting for more than a few days and has tried doing such things as replacing the fuel pump,the fuel tank is new as well,,

,.,i havent had the car for more than a week and it has only sat for day between starting at each time i have started it, it has started everytime no problem. i have never owned a car with an edelbrock carb, so i wanted to see if this is an problem with the carb that is common,but apparently it is a chararctistic.

the car runs and drives great,and has started up everytime for me(like i said above),it hasnt sat for more than a day two days without starting it.,but i was concerned and wanted to find out about this since the previous owner who owned the car for 2 years said he was having this issue.

i have never owned an edelbrock carb,so that is why i am asking all this,
I havent had to prime the carb,but i havent let it sit long enough either.

thanks everybody for the advice

p.s. the car has a tiny (10"??) open air cleaner (that has a date with the trash can tommorow) and the manual choke is NOT hooked up...
so i guess this could have been some of the problem as well???

 

An electric booster pump in line with your mechanical one wired to a toggle switch on the suction side of the pump as close to the tank as you can put it will take care of it, just make sure to use a keyed source to feed the toggle switch so you don't leave it on. Just turn on the key, then the toggle, let it hum until it lugs a little and hit the start. You can then turn off the pump toggle it will pass through just fine. You can leave it running if you want, but why wear it out? I believe Carter and Airtex(yuck) both make a low pressure pump that would fit this perfectly. If you feel yourself running out of fuel on the top end, hit the toggle, but with a 500 cfm carb I doubt you'll need it. I would make sure to check the switch everytime you leave the car to be sure its off. With a keyed source it will be anyway, but its just good to get in the habit to check.

 

I am having the same issue with my cars with holleys too so I just crank the motor a few seconds before hitting the pedal.

 

I currently have an Edelbrock on my Stude - after 3 days, I've got to refill the bowl by cranking.

I currently have a Holley on my O/T Mustang - after two weeks, it fires right up. Much more than 2 weeks and it requires cranking as well.

Yes, gas evaporates, but in this case, it's not the gas, it's the carb. There is a design "feature" in the Edelbrocks that allows the fuel to evaporate easier or something - it defies logic.

FWIW, both have very similar open element air cleaners...

 

I believe the carter/edelbrock vent into the secondaries is much shorter and larger than the vent on the Holleys. I'd compare if I had an AFB laying around.

 

I have a 1404 on my 55 buick. I have always started it in this manner and never had a problem.

Turn on the electric fuel pump and listen for the tone of the pump "buzz" to change as it pumps fuel. Wait about 10-15 seconds after the tone change then pump the gas pedal twice and hit the starter switch. She fires up every time and typically without even turning over once before she catches.

The Mr. Gasket 12S fuel pump from Advance Auto Parts (mounted back by the gas tank) has a max psi of 7 and seems to work great with the 1404.

 

I don't remember eddys having vent tubes like a holley or Qjet. I think it's just an opening in the casting.

It would be really interesting to know what it would take to make a vent tube kit, and if it would work. A guy oughta be able to sell a few thousand of them.

 

I have the same problem, only it occurs after only 24 hours. Plus, my truck has dual, saddle style, gas tanks, so where would I put an electric fuel pump, "as close to the gas atnk as possible"? I really HATE this carb, and feel Edelbrock should do something about it, before they become Edelbroke. Butch/56sedandelivery.

 

Are you getting any gas in your oil? 24 hrs seems pretty quick to lose prime.

I suspect alot of the fuel loss is siphoning or being pressured by percolation through the idle and off idle circuit. With the plates closed and the engine shut off, it will still hold a little vacuum for awhile, enough to start a siphoning action. Qjets do the same thing if they dont have a siphon break on a big stock 455 BOP or a 454 Chevy. Those numbered carbs had a siphon break in the upper air bleed size. They would only siphon for a little bit then run out of air to keep the siphon going.

Once its empty, it just pulls air until the idle and off idle transition emulsion circuit fills back up with fuel. A vacuum under the throttle plates is the only thing is all that will fill that circuit back up. An electric fuel pump just pushes fuel into the bowls to fill them up so it picks it up a little quicker. Even with an electric pump, I have had to crank it a little after it sat a couple of weeks to a month.

You can put a booster pump in front of your tank switch valve. These carbs really need a regulator too. They don't like over 5 lbs of pressure, and even shut off "fuel hammer" from a mechanical pump can double that momentarily. That made the biggest difference in how mine work is steady 5 lb pressure at all times.

 

Well I found this thread and so u am opening it again. Dual Edelbrock 500s on a 327. No issue on last motor (exact same configuration) but on new rebuilt 327 it will not start even after a day. Put new fuel pump on too but after a day you can crank it till the battery runs down and it will not start. Pour some fuel in the front carb and it will fire and runs great...drive it all day. But come out ghd next morning and it is the thing.