HEMI Tech- Block, head, porting/polishing, and gaskets

We might be thinking of two different ones. The one I saw was being made from something else to work with a Hemi. I wish I could remember who that was!

 

we'll have to drag up the thread involving timing covers to discuss this further, hehehe...I'm considering having the block and heads decked to bump up compression from the 9:1 "stock" to possibly 9.5 or 10:1...I'll be getting adjustable pushrods anyway, is there any other problems I'll run into?...the motor is a '53 331 being bored out .155 over with 354 +.030 pistons and the heads will be running the larger size valves that the 354's had with the stock '53 heads...am I going to be running into valve clearance issues with a .480 lift cam and decked heads/block?

 

What about the new tr waters girdle that ties all stock five caps together with studs? The only thing is it does not tie the girdle to the pan rails!

 

Re: 301.
Just a guess, but since the 301 was only introduced in 1955 as a poly to reduce costs I doubt that they spent any money to re-core a new block, so it's probably just a late (non-intergral bellhousing) 331 with thicker walls.
Remember: not the same as the early Plymouth "poly A"-based 301.

 

Since no one touched the sleeving, I'll give it a go. I ran a blown fuel 92. After so many runs, the cylinders cracked. We would bore them and put sleeves in them. I think they were .125" thick. This has been 30 years so bare with my memory. We used a girdle which was the pits. The Milodon 4 bolt caps were better in most every way. If you're running N.A., I wouldn't worry about it. You can run stock rockers wih adjustable pushrods and be in good shape. I ran unported 92 heads and they were fine. The earlier heads I know little about. The small engines make small hp. The front cover will have to be some aftermaket deal to run a fuel pump. The only thing else that I know you could save some money on would be a Mr. Gasket gear drive. It had a plate that bolted on the front of the block and the idler was another crank gear bored out and a bearing inserted in it. The location of the plate is critical. If it's off, you'll fry a bearing somewhere. If someone has one of these, it would be easy to clone.

 

I believe the Milodon gear drive that's currently available is the same as what you're talking about.

 

After reading all of these post it has gotten a little side tracked but to answer some questions, When I built mine I had it magged, lined bored, pressure tested all for peace of mind. The person boring his 331 to 354 + 030 you might want to check the piston dome diameter and the cylinder head area to make sure that the piston deck does not interfere with the bottom of the cylinder head. I know of two motors(both 392) where they were bored 030 and the head was not opened up to allow for this and the piston hit the bottom of the heads. Higher quality pistons like JE and Arias have landings built into there pistons to compensate for this. Good luck to all

 

I don't think so... my 301 block has a unique casting number - different than the 331 or 354 blocks. I have actually seen three examples of 1619829 (354 casting number) blocks bored only to 331, but no 331 blocks bored to only 301...

 

There really is no easy way to tie into the pan rails with a girdle, that is why I designed mine as I did. ( I am sure some of you have seen the old center main girdles which required you to cut out the oil pan) These new ones are available for Chrysler 331 and 354, 392, All Dodges, and the Desotos are on the way. I personally feel the girdle is a cost effect alternative to 4 bolt caps. That, and the fact that 4 bolt caps are not available for every early hemi model.

 

I need to bump this up for FREEZE PLUGS. What are my options and what's the best to use?? Anyone have installation tips? These will be installed on a motor that is already completely done. What have you guys experienced??

Another question...

What do you guys recommend for cleaning out water passages on a motor that's already built? I need some tips here.

Thanks!

 

Brass is better than steel. I put a little JB Weld on after installing them.

 

Around the edge to create a "just in case" seal? How are the spring type? Are they any good? Do you have any thoughts on cleaning the out water jackets? Is there something good to flush through the block that won't kill the gaskets and seals?

 

Thinking about these:
http://www.hothemiheads.com/main_caps/freeze_plugs_stainless.html

or these:
http://www.hothemiheads.com/main_caps/freeze_plugs_expansion.html

 

I'd suggest talking to one or more of the better known hemi builders. If they are reputable, they will give you some advice, and guidelines. They are all machine shops, and all have a lot of experience.

 

Those look good, positive sealing, at a considerably higher price. With JB, I don't think they would come out on thier own or possibly otherwise! I used OEM type. Dished with the bulge out. Put a ball peen hammer's round end on the plug & whack the ball peen with a 4 lb.er. Expands the plug & leaves a dimple. The JB is a safety thing. I've seen pictures of blocks with the step milled out to take modern plugs.

 

Car & truck heads through '55 have hardend valves & seats, after '55 only "Power Package" & 300 engines have them, plus Dodge & Chr hemis used in Dodge trucks. Still need info on marine & ind.

 

Main Caps: If you're building a naturally aspirated street motor - don't worry about a girdle or special main caps. If you're running a blown motor, then consider replacing the three center caps with ProGram 4-bolt steel caps . . . or all five if you really want to spend the coin. Another alternative is a main girdle - but these are somewhat of a pain in the ass. Back in the day, they were really thick items that picked up the pan rails and required extensive pan modifications. TW Waters (seen below) makes a lighter weight and less strong model - that should help tie the main caps together, but will not do a heck of alot to increase the total strength of the lower end.

Keep in mind that once you fit new caps, that you'll need to align bore/hone - which is a few hundred $$$ (at least).

If I was building a blown engine with some high dollars in it - than I'd go with a minimum of the 3 center 4-bolt mains.

Block: If you're going to sink any real money into any vintage engine, I'd have it magged and potentially sonic tested if you're considering a big overbore. It is cheap insurance . . . to prevent a potentially huge cost of building another engine. I also had my block de-rusted at Redi-Strip. I've seen many early blocks with all kinds of rust/scale in them . . . which can easily flake off into the oil and ruin bearings on a new engine. As far as sleeving goes - same rules apply as any other modern OHV . . . the less sleeves . . . the better. Plus . . . it isn't cheep to install them.

 

Need some tech advice please guys, I can get a good "58C" 392 block that has had the front engine mounting tabs partially removed as required in early dragster and F/C chassis. My question is can the front of the block be drilled and tapped with 3/8" threads similar to the accessory holes on SBC and BBC engines. Is there water behind there or is it solid and thick enough through to the crankcase area. This modification would allow me to fabricate a crossmember similar to Chev marine installations etc. Thanks for this great thread.

 

Most OEM bolt holes go into water. The usual thing was to make a mount plate that fit behind the water pump.

 

Just got a call asking similar questions refering to George's reply. Experience says that you must tie the sides together, that is, use a single piece across the front. Remember that, unlike the B-RB engines with 3-bolts, our EarlyHemi assemblies have only 2 bolts per side and 'elephant ears' will move around when the engine starts squirming under load. The usual result is a water leak. If you can't tie the sides together then find another bolt somewhere on each side to incorporate.

 

Gary... should the rear of the block be supported as well in mounting cases like this? I've been told that when front mounting Hemis you have to use rear block mounts as well.

Reasoning?

 

Here's a thread I started on head gaskets recently:

http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=310595&highlight=hemi

 

I'm also going to add this here... This is a thread, done by budd, on cleaning the area of your heads where the plug tubes sit as well as the tubes. Good stuff!

http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=268994&highlight=hemi

 

Not sure if an added mount at the adapter would be required since the front mount is only moving a couple of inches, but, and I always like butts, if also depends on the position (distance) of the trans mount and design and material of the adapter. From an engineering standpoint, all of the critical bolts are above the crank centreline so the bending moment of the assembly will really test the tensile strength of the bolts located @ 3 o'clock and 9 o'clock. To help minimize this effect, I certainly would add small block style struts between the block and the trans case as insurance. Actually, I like to add these anyway. Readily available, cheap, easy to adapt.
Some adapters are better suited to adding mounts than others and the creative types among us will always figure out something to bolt to if the adapter itself is not used.

Gary

.

 

Research Q. A guy on EBay has heads that he says are '57 354, would have to be truck heads if that's what they are. Casting # is 1677441-1, not in Leo's book. Opportunity to add knowledge here.

 

Heads Casting # is clear in the photo.

 

George:
I saw those, and wondered the same thing. My 58 trk heads
are 1733463, and have no front water outlets. Also those do
not have the tall center water passage to the intake like some
trk heads.
Rich

 

Leo emailed back, they're 354 Ind. heads. Looking @ photo again, not solid front & has square under carb crossover.

 

I'm replacing my trk heads (cracked) with 331 (1486833) heads.
Everyone say's they fit. I found that they don't quite cover the
push rod holes in the block. The gasket will proably cover good
enough to stop a leak. (dab of silicon?) Just wondered if anyone else
has run into this situation. Here's a pic of the block.
Rich

 

Here's pics of the two set's of heads.
Rich