First they came for the tuners, but I did not speak, as I am not a tuner...

"If you're not into street racing, why would you need that?" Riverside Police Traffic Sergeant Skip Showalter asked an enthusiast during a similar crackdown last year. "Why would you want more power going to your car?"

That's not the point officer.

They drag the same old tired argument out for guns. It's not the point that I "need" a 50BMG rifle, the point is, it's legal, I want to own it, therefor I can. If whatever you're into is legal where you are, then you have no need to justify your interests or posessions. If their modifications violate emission or some other laws where they are, that's another thing. But this elitist attitude of thinking there has to be reasonable justification for everything has to be put down everywhere it surfaces.

 

The big thing that leaps out at me is ..... Misappropriation of funds, etc.
I don't even live in CA and I hear semi-regular stories about the states massive budgets woes. There is no way 100 citations and 20 impounds is going to come close to the $500K the article says was spent on this raid.

 

"Power tends to corrupt; absolute power corrupts absolutely."

Lord Acton

 

I used to go the the same Big Box parking lot as Podo, 3-400 cars on a good night. Thats alot of tin to come out of the corn fields as were 40 miles east of chicago in the middle of nowhere. These Friday nights dwarfed organized car shows in our area. As I remember it, The Tuner crowd were the ones Racing up & down the lanes of Parked Cars, They were the ones tossing the garbage on the ground when there were plenty of Cans. These kids were the ones harassing the women as they came out of the stores, and these same kids were the ones Fighting. It was all pretty much done when a tuner or a kid in a 4x4 punched a guys Street Rod in the Ass as they werent paying attn. I wasnt there that night so Im not sure what it was exactly. This Summer who knows where the hangout will be.

We're all kids at heart, I dont feel like Im going to be 40 on Monday. Im sure that the respect for others property comes with age, Just having a place to sit & talk cars is a privilege these days. I can totally understand the tuners being harassed, as the ones around here have Earned the Right to be Targets. The Fast & furious helped with that!

Out here in the sticks, you pretty much have to be an ASS to draw attn to yourself like that. I know that the press loves a good street racing story, but Id bet that there is alot more involved & that was just a good excuse to get into those cars. With The Meth and Heroin problems in our area High Schools the cops have better things to do than sit with the noise meter or pull over a Deuce without a hood and check to see what size holley they are running. You can bet that the Tuner crowd is watched more than the Older Street Rod & Muscle Car Crowd because of it.

 

Good, hopefully those people die in a flaming car wreck............free free to pass along the location info, I feel like making some S'mores.

 

"I am gravely disappointed. Again you have made me unleash my dogs of war."

Lord Humungus

 

First they came for the tuners, but I did not speak, as I am not a tuner.

Next they came for the 4x4'ers, but I did not speak, as I am not a 4x4'er.

Then they came for the lowriders, but I did not speak, as I am not a lowrider.

Finally they came for the hot rodders, and there was no one left to speak for me.

I borrowed the format of a poem originally about the Nazis taking over Germany. I am glad so many people are outraged. You should be. This is happening all the way to the highest levels.

I offer half an apology for starting a politically slanted thread on a lazy friday.

*Oh, by the way, how many is an "assembly"? 100? 50? 2? 1?

 

I agree with the original poster. Less and less rights everyday. There're not gonna stop taking until we have none. They say the magic words, "suspected street racer" and they get to do what ever in the hell they want? WTF? Just like if they say, "suspected drug dealer", or "suspected terrorist". And sheeple just accept that and think they have their best interests in mind. Ha ha ha. What are they gonna suspect you of to stomp all over your rights?
Nazi Police. "To protect and serve?", more like "Cite and harrass." I have no use for them.
Could you sit and watch someone crush your car? No fucking way. I'd have to kill or die over that one.
That's all I'm gonna say about that. Later Josh

 

It was never stated that they had or didn't have permission to gather. Sounds like a cruise night or something to me.

Actually, it had almost to be a planned event. How else would the cops know to spend $503K and assemble 9 agencies to block off all the entrances? It wasn't on a whim...

 

My little brother has a mitsubishi evolution with all sorts of crap done to it (it runs 33lbs of boost) it's fast, however he is not a loon in it. One night he calls to ask me to come help him the hose running from the air cleaner to the intake poped off and he lost the clamp. I show up in the 54 3100 and we start puting things together and the man shows up I explain and she says I will give you 10 min before I haul this pile off. She says nothing about the truck not parked in a spot.

 

those oath breaking spineless honorless pigs should be taught a lesson for violating our rights.

 

Crooks with badges.

 

No, they aren't. They know there's no way to rule innocent men. When there aren't enough criminals, a government makes them. You declare so many things to be illegal that it becomes impossible to live without breaking laws. The governmant knows they can't survive or grow on a Nation of law abiding citizens. They create so many laws they can't be observed or enforced, therefor they create a Nation of lawbreakers. You have to fight for your rights, not just expect them to be observed.

Everyone need to step back, remember, and keep in mind the Constitution was created to limit GOVERNMENT, not the People.

 

they aint touchin my cars or my guns, if they try then there going to
find out its very unprofitable to screw with me, ill fight till my ammo runs dry
and my hands no longer have the strength to squeeze the life outta those
who wish to do me harm.

 

Any assembly would be on someone's property.

 

Honestly, I'd have to side with the police on this one.

If the citations and impoundings were because of illegal modifications or improper paperwork, then I see no problem with them. These people knew those things were illegal. Maybe they disagree with the laws. Well, that doesn't give these people the right to break them. If I think I should be able to murder people, would you side with me if I just went out and starting shooting people? I doubt it. If you disagree with the law, then contact your politicians, write your local newspaper, do what you can to change the laws. Don't just break the law like it doesn't exist.

Also, these people are complaining that the police should have a warrant. Well, let me pose another question. If two men were loitering on a corner known for being frequented by drug dealers, would you want the police to wait for a warrant, or just stop and find out what's going on? If these people were gathering in an area known for illegal street racing, then they're making themselves suspects.

I think the problem is not that these so-called "tuners" are being harrassed, it's that people nowadays are too quick to villanize the good guys.

 

Police dept's are a business. Criminals don't pay for shit....I mean, they're criminals, right....
It's easier to get law-abiding folks to PAY UP......so stupid laws, etc, are made to bring in that cash from people that the government's know will just pay.....

Easy money man......

 

Freedom isn't free.

 

You are correct sir. You are socially stupid and can I add Scary. Perhaps you should visit the Law Enforcement memorial in Wash. D.C. and see the list of men and woman who died while doing their "job ".

 

As a police officer. I totally disagree with going in to a situation like this. I hate the fact that California has its stupid, MODIFYING ENGINE LAWS, no one goes into your house and says, HEY YOUR GAS HEATER IS TOO OLD, YOU NEED A NEW ONE OR ILL WRITE YOU A TICKET, so why do they worry about the gas you put through your car or the muffler on your vehicle.

I also think that a parked car is just a pile of steel and composite material. Now if you are driving, then its a different game. Don't race on the street. That is how PEOPLE DIE. If you wanna race, we have tracks for it. Now did I race when I was a kid YES. do I now? NO. The road is too dangerous, besides pot holes and stuff, its the other drivers and let alone when some racers TBONE a ambulance with a pregnant lady in the back because they were driving 100 + down the road and didn't hear the sirens approaching.

If you race and I'm there, you'll just get the ticket, No big deal. its part of the risk. I just dont like going into a parking lot where everyone is parked and acusing them of something I cant prove.

I think California SUCKS anyways. I live in IA, NO EMISSIONS LAWS and NO STUPID crackdowns.

Sorry for venting, but I hate when cops do shit like this just to get money. Being a cop I can say that its BULLSHIT.

WOW Im all pissed off now. And I dont even like imports.

And we dont need warrants if there is a crime committed just for your info. Everyone wants a warrant these days....

 

its just a hop, skip, and a jump before they start doing this to car shows... or public gatherings with no harm intended. if someone would do this bullshit to me, or even threaten to crush my car, they wouldnt even touch a door handle before there was 2 lawyers present.

 

What?

 

A shopping center is considered limited private and there has to be a notice given from the property owner PRIOR to a trespassing issuance from police. If there are signs saying the premises are closed between certain hours, then it thats the same. No notice, no right to claim trespass.

And just for the record - constitutional rights DO succeed property rights......

And the cops are in GROSS violation of the owners rights (who woulda thought, cops acting outside the law). Yes, in some states, having you car registered automaticly precludes any need for a search warant - otherwords you want to drive your car, a cop can search it anytime. BUT, the cop is not allowed to issue a citation based on his opinion. He is not allowed to serve judgement at the scene. And they are not allowed to confiscate a vehicle unless it has been either involved in the act of a crime, in possession of contraband, or enacting in dangerous behavior.

I can't believe there are actually people defending the cops. Look at the larger picture behind it all. What are you really willing to trade your rights for?

Open pipes, open wheels, Ardun heads could easily fall under their "judgements".....

 

Being a calif resident (from right here in Riversider) and a former "tuner" ... I can say that -- that article while mildly entertaining was sensational journalism at best.
A better article is here:
http://www.pe.com/localnews/riverside/stories/PE_News_Local_R_streetrace01.4234d9b.html

To clear up some points: 1. The average "modified" car tickets run around 12$ (if you can clean your stuff up) and require a free smog check from the local BAR referee. These tests are a PITA because these referees have been trained to spot things like modified ignitions, intakes, etc...and require you to have all your CARB exemption orders in tact. The also have been trained as to what options/engines/features are available to each car and trim. Sorry, but they know that your Honda Civic HX did not come with that Integra motor.

Sadly most of the "tuner" parts out there carry no such EO #s as the process to get them is very expensive (on the manufacturers side) and leads to increased cost at the market place. To date - I beleive AEM is the only intake manufacturer that supplies valiid EO #s. Lots of asian made parts manufacturers will steal EO #s and provide fake certs.

As for the cops -- they get as little as 8hrs of "training" on how to spot "suspicious" mods. The old days of placing a nightstick to the ground to measure ride height (or a soda can) are gone, and the amount of knowledge one has to have to properly survey a modern distributorless-fuel-injected engine has gone up. Not to mention the lengths some people will go to hide - obvious modifications. It may not be right -- but if they look in your hood and they see a nice shiny chrome intake tucked into the wheel well or a intercooler sitting infront of your radiator where your bumper should be -- they are going to throw up a red flag.

I was at the Target raid a few years ago, yeah it sucked. But as people have said, you put yourself in the situation. Its not just "individuals meeting to talk about their passion"...you have idiots doing burnouts across the lot -- you have people thinking that these are tryouts for the next D1 competition etc. If I was a property owner (like the others in that parking lot -- Hooters and Johns Incredible Pizza [think Chucky Cheeze]), I would draw an issue as well. This wasn't a "one time" gathering. This was quickly becoming an epidemic and there were some serious close calls that prompted the attention of the flatfoots.

Most of the time -- if you have your stuff in order and you have complied -- you can get out with a little more than "don't put yourself in a place like this"...its the other contingent, the ones that are already breaking the law -- riding the fine line -- that are usually the biggest complainers. You played the game -- you modified your car -- you were effectively breaking the law -- you got caught, pay your fine and get back out. Period.

As for the "right to assemble". Rights are very interesting, we all have the basic right to free speech and freedom of expression -- but that doesn't preclude us from negligence brought about by expressing that right. I cannot to this day yell "fire" in a crowded movie theater. Granted -- its my right to freedom of speech -- but I must be responsible for how I use that right. The same goes to "assembly". If you are assembled on a public place and you are making a nuisance of yourself, or endangering the public -- you are now at the mercy of the local authorities. Now, if you are on "private" property (as most parking lots are) -- all bets are off. You are not afforded any real "civil" rights at all -- and are relegated to the permissions granted by the property owner.

Ok...thats enough out of me...ill go back to lurking....

 

that my friend is a list on men and women that were doing their job and they knew the risks of such ...this shit,,is shit period! as i said before they come after those of us who have money..because it isnt about law enforcement anymore its about revinue..MONEY!

there is one thing i have learned thruought my life..."you cant win with a loser". the law enforcment know this on all levels..the deadbeats and losers have no money and dont care..therefore the cops and courts have learned dont waste your time on the losers..go where the money is no matter how small it is its more than you can get for busting the bum with nothing to give the "system"

 

This man had got his crap together! Some police don't understand why people don't like them, Well what happened to these kids certainly want get police the respect they deserve. Now there are a lot more they just added to their people who hate authority list. Just my $0.02

 

It is kind of funny to me that a couple of guys here think that this situation is ok because it might be true that they DID have illegal modifications and improper paperwork...


Have you guys looked at your cars???

I know my old tunnel ram camaro had illegal rear end height, illegal hood height, illegal exhaust, etc, etc. My current car has a pair of cherry bombs with no tail pipes, a illegal license cover, no wipers, etc, etc. I would guess that the cops could circle a hundred of our cars and find the exact same minor issues on many of them...

Regarding thinking these tuner guys are unique regarding bad paperwork, how about the titles that are being sold for "historic" value on this site?

I know someone who has a homebuilt model a style pickup that is titled as a mid 80's Ford truck because that is what he took apart for the running gear.

I think this hits closer to home than some of you guys want to admit.

And to PoPo, thanks for speaking up from your point of view. Standup guy.

 

Im probably one of those guys who is OK with it. Im a gun fan, GUNS don't Kill Pople, People dont Kill people. A gun can save your life, or if you are a jag and not safe with it, it will take it. Same with the Cars, Its not so much that I cant appreciate what the Tuner guys do as far as making these cars Fast, It is that the way they act behind the wheel that has gotten some really bad Attn. Most of the accidents which you see on TV are YOUNG in experienced drivers, not thinking about that cross traffic, or kid on his bike. Geekspeed's post was from an X insider. I highly Doubt that There gonna come after us in the 50s cars unless were doing Pro Stock Burnouts or Doh nuts in the Parking Lot. As far as the Shady side, we're less than worth their while to pull over and look for Drugs. More likely to find Viagra & Geratol, and they know that. It really comes down to a bunch of Jags ruining it for everyone. It doesnt matter that they are in LA, it still has the potential to ripple all the way to our corn fields. Jags being Jags equals Bad Attn to our Hobby.

 

.........That was in response to bigblock35w

 

When do they go from the parking lot to just stopping everyone to check for sales slips. No slip= crush.