was considering running copper fuel line(appearance reasons), but I have heard varying opinions on this..one said that the copper would react in some way with the gasoline and cause problems? I know that it was used on early cars and bikes, but still unsure about running it on a 283 v-8...I am a mechanical idiot here, so detailed opinions would be really appreciated here
Yes, bad idea. It doesn't hold up well to vibration in the long term. Not worth taking a chance on with fuel. A definite no-no for brakes too. Real bad idea there, in case anyone was wondering..... Get some SS tubing, it'll stay looking nice.
I've had good luck with copper fuel lines, but I use a piece of rubber fuel hose (hidden somewhere) to absorb the virbration between engine and frame.
They make Copper coated steel line... it looks bitchin, and it's classic because all the ney sayer's, make sure they stop you to tell you how unsafe "copper line" is... blah, blah, blah... most of the time i like to play dumb and go really "you don't think it's a good idea for brakes"? The down side is that it is quite a bit more expensive. I have never seen it in sticks (like they have at the part store with double flares, and brass fittings...) so you have to flare your own, and brass fit it all up... Personally I think the look is really cool looking, and adds detail that counts. good luck.
I don't know about reacting with gas but copper hardens with age and hot and cold cycles and will become brittle. As mentioned above use SST or plain steel with copper plating if you want the look of copper. Now, having said all that my '55 Studebaker has a '56 Stude 289 in it with what appear to be the original copper fuel lines from the pump to the carb and they look to be fine. Just the same when I redo the engine I am replacing them.
I've been using copper line for oil pressure lines for years.....I just put a couple of loops in it for vibration.....
I worked in the oil/chemical industry for almost 40 years mostly in R&D. Using any type of hydrocarbon in copper tubing was not allowed. The hydrocarbons flowing thru copper will leach material out of the copper and contaminate the oil or chemical. There were test done pumping gasoline thru a length of copper tubing for 24 hours 7 days a week. The tubing after a short time became brittle and after a longer time, the actual ID of the tubing increased. The only time we used copper was for air, water or low pressure nitrogen. Just an addition please, use of small diameter copper tubing in a non-flowing application such as tubing going to a pressure gauge, is ok to do. It's the continuous flowing that causes problems.
copper fuel line is OK, no problem. BUT it must be fix-mounted, since it will crack if it vibrates/bends, Wich by the way steel lines will do to, and aluminium tubes. Its called Metal Fatigue. I guess: The reason for this talk about unsafe copper fuel lines is that the old homemechanic mounted the copper line from the tank to the carb on the engine without any rubber or hose where the fuel line goes over to the engine. And when you start the engine it will vibrate and "bend" the fuel line until it fatigues and cracks. same thing will happen if you use a steel line. You can test the theory by bending a paperclip back and forward until it brake.
Me too, and also gas and Diesel fuel. Never had a problem. OEM truck and busses years ago used nothing but copper for gas , fuel oil, engine oil, and compressed air. The car manufactures switched to steel cause it's cheaper and only needed to last 3 years. IMO I like copper shined up with a scuff pad and clear laquer on top. Frank
thanks for the input guys! wanted to use it for all my lines actually and your advice has really helped(didn't know about the copper plated steel)
Been using copper fuel line on my Austin since 1989 and covered near 50k miles is that a good enough test? Like everyone else says as long as you have a rubber hose between any moving parts it'll last just fine. I've seen cars using a neat looking coil of copper pipe to absorb the vibrationbut always wondered how long it would last.
Andamo, would you think that in a car application that is not flowing 24 hrs a day, that the small volume of fuel that actually goes thru the line would help it last longer than in the application you are mentioning? Just a thought, cause I've worked on old trucks and buses with copper and not seen problems other than chaffing damage and an occassional broken flare from repeated ass'y and dis-ass'y. Frank
There are different types and grades of copper, steel, aluminum, stainless, etc. They are rated for chemical resistance, temperature range, bendability, and so on. I'm using 1/2 copper tubing for a full flow oil filter connection directly attached to the block, which is rated for this application: Copper Alloy 122, for use with water, air, oil, hydraulic fluid, -425° to +400° F, bendable, flareable, meets ASTM B75. If you do some research and get the right alloy for your application and you should be fine. For fuel or brake lines, I prefer, pre-fab steel or stainless lines from http://www.inlinetube.com/ You could copper-plate the steel lines, for looks. <br><br>
My Dad ran copper fuel line on his coronet for years, never one leak. It had race gas run through it too.
Flower wanted the "copper look" for her fuel lines on her flatty......I wouldn't allow it so she pulled her 1/4" stainless fuel line through some slightly larger copper tubing and........voila!.....she has the look she wants with the safety and security of a proper steel line. It was just a little harder to bend and a little tricky to flare but it worked out cool.
It's just like anything else. You can always find folks who've not followed what science recommends, but yet had really good results. Me personally, the scariest thing that could happen to a car is fire. Are you a gamblin man?
We have ran copper fuel lines on most of the drag cars for 20 plus years (wanna talk about vibration!) with very good success. Basically a lot of the cars were budget built, and copper was cheap, quick and easy. Use short lengths of rubber where you can (only allowed a certain amount on a drag car) to absorb vibrations and really there should be no problem. Now having said that, I personally wouldn't do it anymore. On the dragsters and super gas cars we now run stainless braided lines, and any car I put together in the past couple years has been steel or stainless steel. My bracket chevelle has had copper lines for at least 10 years, with absolutely no problems and it sees much street/strip use. If I redid the car, I'd use steel. Just not worth the gamble.
I love posts like this. 50% say yes and 50% say no. How's the guy asking the question supposed to know what to believe? I've messed around with mostly 60's and 70's "furrin" cars and I have never seen an OEM fuel line that wasn't rubber or cad plated steel. Must be a reason...
I know Copper is against building code for natural gas because the gas supposedly will make the copper get corroded and brittle and eventually crack.
the guy who asked the question is going to search out copper plated steel...lol...although i may use roadrunner's info for running air lines...thanks again for all of the great info...though a tad confusing
A lot of crap basically don't you think? No Hydrocarbons in copper pipe??????? Have you ever looked in a Fridge? what were the majority of fridge systems made of for over 100 years? Copper! What is the majority of Fridge gas ??? a Hydrocarbon!. Had a look at commercial and domestic gas installations? what is the gas running through? Galvanised steel pipe and COPPER!. What is that gas? a hydrocarbon. In Europe MOSS and other companies sell replacement non corroding brake lines for anything...what is it? Copper!. Copper is essentially an innert metal,it is not affected by oxygen to the extent that dangerous oxidation occurs as it does in steel pipe ( rust) .Sure it work hardens,but any one with a bit of common sense who looks in the back of the aforementioned fridge will see that the copper tube isn't exactly breaking down with old age is it? All you to do is make sure your copper lines are not "Working" ,that means they are not being used as supports etc for anything and not being stressed by unwanted movement. From an engineering point of view I would sooner "malleable" Steel or Copper over Hard Stainless steel any day on a car. And as for not allowing copper near Fuel??? SHIT OH DEAR! What are Copper washers on fuel and oil Lines and Brass banjo fittings ( copper/tin alloy) !!!?????.
my 2 cents copper doesnt have the ability to be bent back and forth and resist cracking..fatigue is a bad item when it comes to fuel lines..yes you can isolate the vibration with rubber hose, but you would be doing that also with your steel lines too..Ive just personally never seen a production auto in the 20th century that used copper..must be a reason for it. personally i wouldnt use it with the options you have out there today. even if it was ever used why flert with disaster?
An urban myth ! It was started when some one suggested that the 'oderant' introduced into natural gas ( so you smell a gas leak) supposedly ate copper pipe.There is NO scientific evidence to back it up .In fact a lot of research shows that gasses actually DEPOSIT substances to no ill effect on on the surface of copper pipe. I just Spent the last month rebuilding three large Commercial Clothes dryers which run on natural gas.All the lines including the mains into the building from the street ( 6" diameter natural gas!) are copper and parts of which are close to 60 years old.No cracking any where!.
Neither does any other metal except pure gold. The reason for not using copper today is the same reason Alloy radiators and fibre optics are used today. COST! Copper is $25KG !. All Early to Mid 20th Century manufactures used copper everywhere. late 20th Century and early 21st century has given us plastics.
I have heard all the myths too. I have used copper fuel in ALL my race cars and street cars for almost 40 years. Never not once ever have i had a problem . BTW some of your MR Gasket and such dual feed lines are chrome plated copper. . Putting a loop in solves the vibration problem for solid mount or a short neoprene hose also works . No more than 1 foot of hose on any car is our rule. I asked one of my friends who was quite vocal what he would use. Aluminum fuelline was the reply. No thanks I will stick to copper. I have no issue with steel lne except it rusts although in a race car it is not likely to ever happen. Stainless? Cant stand the glare of shiny stuff. Makes me dizzy
I don't know......, we had a gas dryer plumbed with copper. Changed it out when we moved the washer/dryer. After 12 years the old copper had all kinds of black scale inside that poured out. We checked it over closely and it was full of pin holes. Scared me!
Ich luge nicht. If I say I used it no trouble then i did. I am not in the habit of shooting the breeze. if you dont want to use it fine. Why do the factories use steel and rubber because it is cheaper. It also roots and rusts and i have in my 40 years as a professional mech /machinst replaced probably 40 or fifty of them. If it was a carbuerated car i always used Copper as i know a hundred years from now it will still be good. EFi which has high pressure would not tolerate copper i think so we have no chioce but to use the rusting rotten overpriced expensive line that the factory sells or spend the price of a small house for stainless. If the lawmakers had any brains this is one place they would step in a make the car makers install rust proof fuel lines. Sure would e a lot fewer fires and driveways would last longer too. Nothing like 55 PSI squirting fuel out of a rusted out fuel line on some older cavalier to make you sit up and take notice. No excuse for not doing it but that has nothing to do with your question does it. sorry. I got carried away.
This is a cultural bugaboo for some reason. Fatigue cracking affects ALL metals. I've had steel brake lines fail at the flare where they cracked & at the fittings where they cracked - look closely & found the lines weren't supported properly. Doesn't make a bit of difference. If it's unsupported, titanium will work harden & crack due to vibes. Run the copper, support it properly, sleep soundly.
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