am interested in any help or suggestions on putting a 71 camaro sub under a 55 F100 truck thanks ,,,, ratso @ [email protected]
My suggestion and opinion.... Leave the I beam axle. Its more elegant, simple, sturdy....and dammit, it just looks right. I'm working on a '58 Chevy Apache right now that is retaining the I beam. Don't be afraid of that "rides like a truck" handling. Its good for you. BTTT for someone who can actually help you with the subframe. (see I'm not a total ass).
The Camaro sub is not a good swap to an F-100 for numerous reasons. Call El Polacko and get a good front end it is well worth the money.
try OSR forum...but i know there are plenty of people on here that would be more than happy to help you with putting a proper and traditional suspension under that you feeling ok tingler, being so "understanding" about a post like this...or everyone else for that matter?? wait, i know, maybe it's the holiday spirit. bah humbug! lol
Ratso, There is a series of articles on FTE that lays out most of the common suspension options for you. Well worth reading (even if I do say so myself since I contributed ). http://www.ford-trucks.com/article/idx/10/0/ The Camaro clip can & has been done & is covered in Part Five. Not my first choice, if for no other reason than every boneyard in America knows the popularity of these clips and will "clip" you in return. Also, by the time you properly rebuild the suspension & brakes, which were damaged by years of mullet-sporting teenage Camaro-lovin' goons, you will have spent a large portion of the cost of a new IFS. I second the El Polacko referral...especially since I have one of the late, lamented, Dakota crossmembers from him. Do a member search & you can drop him a PM. One last note: a guy on FTE who autocrosses as a full-time hobby & is a suspension fanatic...elected to KEEP the straight axle on his '56 panel tow vehicle...after having planned to junk it in favor of an IFS...bought it, drove it cross-country, & was impressed enough by its handling. A straight axle that has been correctly set up, in good shape, & with upgraded brakes can be outstanding. End of soapbox.
I'm keeping the I-beam axle in my '56 Ford panel truck. Just wondering. Has anybody ever seen IFS on an 18-wheeler? By the way, I've heard that Volare suspension parts are no longer available from Chrysler, and that people using those front ends have been searching for NOS Volare parts. Dave http://www.roadsters.com/
I don't know about availability of new stuff....but I hear it's a bitch trying to find decent used Volares in a yard. The Gibbon Volare bolt-in (almost) crossmember was out of production for a while, but I heard (don't KNOW) that someone is producing them again, a backyard-type operation. !8 wheeler? No....I can't see anything being able to withstand the axle loading, at least anything of a cost-effective material, size, & manufacturing process. I'm probably wrong & there is something out there. However, I have heard of a few military vehicle systems that MIGHT be able to take the loading. Mil-spec stuff is a whole different ball game. They were designed more for articulation than gross weight handling. Now that I think on it, I seem to recall Oshkosh or Pacific had a form of IFS, actually closer to Ford TTB, on a certain model.
I've worked in shops in North Carolina and in Arizona that specialized in 18-wheelers. The first time I saw one stripped down to a rolling chassis, I remarked that in terms of technology, it looked like a very large Ford Model A. When I asked why no companies like Peterbilt were using IFS and disc brakes, the reply was, "These front axles are strong and reliable, and the drum brakes always work, no matter how hard it's raining". It was that comment, plus my wanting to keep my old truck an old truck, that led to my decision to use an I-beam axle on it. Dave http://www.roadsters.com/
I want to keep my '57 Chevy truck stock, so it's keeping its I-beam up front, too. I think a truck is a truck, and should be used as such. But thats just me.
done a few 55, 56 ,p.u. with front streer clips no problems, good ride , handling,suggest u move wheelbase fordward one and three forths to fill fenderwell
I have been both ways. One with a Chevy Nova clip and a dropped axle but the thing you need to understand is............move your front end ahead one and a quarter inhes from where it's at to locate the wheel in the center of the wheel well. Really adds to the "LOOK". Here's a pic of my last one that I gave to my son before moving to Aridzona. It has a dropped axle.
When you check the link to FTE, also search the thread on Jaguar XJ6 subframes. Make sure you goto the 48-60 forum. It's simple on an F1, slightly harder on a F100. There have been posts on this board and FTE about using the Jag, it's a good swap. I installed mine in a weekend, and I'm an OK fabricator at best.
On the other hand.....I put the clip in this panel about 6 years ago. Works just fine. The bottom line is...there are lots of ways to skin this cat. Listen to the opinions on the board then make your OWN decison. Be honest with yout self about how much you are willing to spend, how long it will take and your skill level. Good luck, -Abone.
53-56 F100's have a 110 inch wheelbase on the shortbed models, 118 inch on the long bed. Here's a good link for reference material, I have most of the service manuals, etc so if you need more detailed info send me a PM... http://www.clubfte.com/users/earl/Reference_Material/Reference_Material.html
I find it interesting that the Camaro guys are all putting MII/Heidt's/TCI or whatever aftermarket IFS in their cars to get rid of the clunky 35 year old suspensions, and the F100 guys are taking their cast-offs thinking that they're making a good upgrade. I have a Corvette C4 and a Corvette C5 IFS sitting here ready for my 56 F100...just can't decide which one to use yet, seems to me that if you are going to go IFS then you may as well go all the way. I can buy a Corvette IFS for about a third of what a MII costs and have a quality suspension to boot. And before I hear from the guys who gave me grief over my "uber-polished" Corvette suspensions in my Merc....NO, I'm not polishing the IFS for the truck!
Actually yes, Quite a few really. In the early 60's GMC pioneered a true Double A arm with air sleeve front end and they rode quite well, for a semi. There are even manufacturers that provide aftermarket systems for motorcoaches and busses now. Just a simple question, why does everyone want to compare suspension systems to those of the heavy truck industry. 'Cause they aren't exactly known for ride and comfort,
Camaro clips kick ass...and they're cheap. less than 200 bucks for a complete Trans am clip (bigger sway bar, better box) and a polyurethane rebuild kit (including ball joints and the like) less than 300. someone, please show me where you can get a mustang II kit-complete from disc to disc,with everything you need for steering as well, for less than 500 bucks. once you got it, show me that you can install it quickly and easily. and once it's on there...good luck with those headers. and beyond all of that, when you break something...on the road...how many of your parts can you get at Auto Zone? and even after all that...it still won't corner as well as a Camaro clip. period.
Dood, are you seriously comparing a used F-body clip to a new Mustang II suspension? For a real world comparison you can get an entire MII front end and crossmember from a donor (parts yard) for about $200.00 or so and install it into your frame. Upgrade disc brake kits can be had for around $250.00 and rebuild kits for about $125.00. That's all new ball joints, bushings and new brakes for $575.00! That is how it was done 15-20 years ago before the aftermarket kit was available. Best part of the conversion was the simple design with the rack and pinion steering that allowed you to retain the frame horns in tact and thus all your existing sheetmetal with minimal modification. Granted, finding a donor MII may be dificult due to age and popularity but then again finding an F-body clip not whanged up around here is even harder because of the popularity of them in circle track racing. G-body clips are even harder! But we have hashed all this out before, handling and ride comparisons. I do question the viability of using a MII on something as large as late fifties pickup, but F-body wouldn't be my first choice.
I have to agree with Lux, especially if you rebuild both. A Z-28 or Trans-Am will way outhandle a Rustang II, were closer in weight to an F-100, and are more plentiful. I can't remember the last time I saw a Mustang II...except expensive parts in a Street Rod catalog.
Here's the 53 that we're SLOWLY making progress on... 71 camaro clip. The only real issue we're having is with the motor. The only reason (so far) I would have gone with something different, like a MII would be so I can fit it easier. I really want to keep the nailhead but we need to figure out what to do with the steering gear in order to get some decent looking motor mounts in it. Went together real well, and is super stout. I like the stance too. I'm gonna figure the motor mounts out... I'm, determined! Hope the pics help you out some. -B
I have found SCADS of Camaro stuff, and continue to walk past the "King Cobra" Mustang at the same yard as where I get them from. as far as sheet metal is concerned, I have never had a problem making it all line up- and when it comes to pick ups, the front end of a Camaro (HEAVY) is an easy choice. as far as Rack and pinion is concerned, we both know there are large amounts of conversions avalible for Camaro...but who cares? you don't have the same Bump steer woes with the camaro- back to good geometry versus bad geometry- and I have ZERO fear of setting a big block on top of an f-body clip, where as a mustang II-it gets a little shady once you cross the 600 pound mark. Face it, Ford guy...Camaro clip better than Mustang clip and easier to install,too.
http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=148978&&showall=1 Ratso, check Lux's thread-it's for a Chevy truck, but will give you an idea of what's involved.
I recently suck a 455 where a nailhead once lived...I have a suggestion. Find an original Nailhead application car, and steal the mount stands off of it. (the part the motor mount bolts to), remove the stands from the camaro, and (with the exhaust manifolds ON) set it in place. I think you will find that you will be pretty darn close just letting it sit where it sits- a little work with a pry bar, and you can snug it up right nice. no pcis,though...for all I know, you have the mona lisa of motor mounts goin' on, and I am telling you to "go stock!"
NO. where the camaro frame rails drop "straight back" (if you look at them from above) the g-body sweeps out- they are perimiter frame design. besides, the f-body has better geometry, and the only real advantage of the g over the f is larger brakes- which is pretty easy to accomplish. b body spindles bolt in, and a 91 (?) and newer f-body caliper bolts in. but if you are looking for bigger rotors and brakes, there are multidudes of kits avalible that do the same thing without a junkyard crawl.
Ford Guy? You have got to be kidding me. Where did you come up with that one. I was just responding to the statement you made about MII's not being able to be done in the $500.00 range. I never said anything about using one on an F100. In fact I have been quite active against using these front ends on bigger mid-sized pickups. For the proper applicaction the Mustang II is a very wise choice, it is hardly universal. I have never been a fan of sub-framing. And before you spout off I want you to know I have done several in my time. I always limit them to applications where conventional stuff just doesn't work. Sub-frames work for you, cool, but they are not for everyone. And not every region of the country is littered with these things. A decent G-body clip that is still complete can set you back $500.00 around here, IF you can find one! Cutting the frame off and welding on something else is easy, it is fitting the front sheet metal, attaching the bumper and odd stuff like modifying core supports and custom radiators for some of the front steer applications that are dificult. Lord know how many projects have been given up on after the sub-frame has been installed. I know our Auto Trader is speckled with examples showing the "hard work" done durring auction season. As mentioned before I manufactured a weld in crossmember that uses Dodge Dakota truck suspensions. Something more than adequate for the job, easy to install and easy to finish the project. Is it cheap, nope, it isn't. Never intened for it to be. I did however intend it to be well made and be easy enough for the average hot rodder to get his truck on the road and driving better than average with a minimum of hassle, modifications an parts swapping to get the job done.
Hey-I wasn't trying to piss you off, Polacko... I was simply stating that given the choice of Camaro versus MII...I am gonna go Camaro. I am a huge fan of the clip swap in applications where you can't see it...it certianly ain't the prettiest thing in the world, but it works extremely well, and it is very easy to make work-for example when Speedway sells narrowed control arms, you can guarrantee that you will have goodies well into the future-that are easy to get ahold of. So again, Sorry if I peed in your oatmeal, but my point wasn't to ruffle feathers-it was to answer the question on the header.
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