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Asking cause I don't know.

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by bartmcneill, Sep 7, 2021.

  1. bartmcneill
    Joined: Dec 23, 2009
    Posts: 395

    bartmcneill
    Member
    from Ada, OK

    If you are building a 30 Ford coupe with original gas tank, what newer engine would be best? Regular carbuerated? Throttle Body? or Fuel injected. If you use one of the latter two, what must be done concerning fuel lines? I'm looking for an engine to drop into my aftermarket chassis. I want it done before I transfer the stock body and fenders and use original tank.
     

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  2. Squablow
    Joined: Apr 26, 2005
    Posts: 17,369

    Squablow
    Member

    The original tank is meant to work without a fuel pump, it's gravity-feed, no fuel injection system of any kind is going to work with that tank. Also, this forum doesn't do modern fuel injection engines or anything of the type.
     
  3. If you remove the firewall,and turn it around ,and reinstall you gain a couple inches to fit a longer engine.Flat heads are old school traditional. Chevy"s are shorter than many engines which helps.If you go modern on fuel systems you likely need to add a return line to the tank.injection likely needs a high pressure fuel pump installed inside the tank. It can all be done im sure just depends on how good you are.A carb would keep it simple.
     
    sloppy jalopies likes this.
  4. bartmcneill
    Joined: Dec 23, 2009
    Posts: 395

    bartmcneill
    Member
    from Ada, OK

    The car will look just like it does now except for lower and good wheels and tires.
     

  5. 19Eddy30
    Joined: Mar 27, 2011
    Posts: 2,303

    19Eddy30
    Member
    from VA

    It can be done with thought ,
    SBC with mechanical fan , Rad in stock location , fire was cut just enough to clear passenger side head/Val cover and distributor, still can use stock tank , There is a few solutions and can be accomplished, there's always away most of the time to make things work if you really want it. Fabrication, thinking outside the box ,things can be hidden.
     
    Last edited: Sep 8, 2021
    pitman likes this.
  6. BamaMav
    Joined: Jun 19, 2011
    Posts: 6,688

    BamaMav
    Member
    from Berry, AL

    Almost anything you swap in will require mods, not only the engine, but the transmission, rear end, and brakes as well. You say you have a aftermarket chassis, is it an original copy, or a street rod style chassis? Could be lots of difference there...

    Best thing is to find similar cars and study what was done to them. Then decide a plan to do yours, and stick to it. Too many cars are never finished due to "project mission creep", where one thing leads to another and nothing gets done...
     
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  7. Budget36
    Joined: Nov 29, 2014
    Posts: 13,137

    Budget36
    Member

    I told you to quit looking over the fence at my stuff!
     
    egads likes this.
  8. By the way, nice looking coupe.
     
  9. clem
    Joined: Dec 20, 2006
    Posts: 4,180

    clem
    Member

    Can’t you just use a fuel pump to support your particular application of either carb, injection etc…?
    What type of newer engine are you thinking of ?
    A flathead ford 4 or 8 cylinder with an original type carb may almost survive on gravity feed, - a fuel injected something else may require a designated pressure to run correctly.
    “Newer” (than model A), - means anything made from 1932 until today, (or for the benefit of this forum 1965).
    Choose the motor you wish to use, and then decide which set up you require to run for what you are trying to achieve, then that will dictate the fuel pressure requirements.
    I would think that choosing the motor on a gravity feed from original tank, to save the cost of a fuel pump and a little plumbing, would limit you severely in all other aspects of your build……
     
    Last edited: Sep 8, 2021
  10. You'll need the body on the chassis to mock the engine and trans and to verify clearances. It's not paint by numbers.;)
    You'll also need the chassis at ride height to verify diff pinion angles.
    I see a Yogi's sign behind the coupe.
     
  11. oldsman41
    Joined: Jun 25, 2010
    Posts: 1,556

    oldsman41
    Member

    If you want a nice four banger would be the thing. Lots of modern stuff in that bracket. Myself I would run Henry’s original
     
  12. 19Eddy30
    Joined: Mar 27, 2011
    Posts: 2,303

    19Eddy30
    Member
    from VA

    When set out to do what the Op wants to build , You have to have a vision think outside the box, A lot of detail to hide things Its not going to be open up a catalog From 1or 2 automotive after market parts , you will use parts from boats ,aviation ,Ext and fabrication parts for need.
    When I built the A, I used a stock A frame With radiator Mounted in stock Location with body , built & worked in between . Boxed frame & made my own motor / trans mounts.
    The after market frame is not going to make the build Easier, its going to add more work. The motor mounts /trans need to be cut out & changed around , & modifications to sub rails.

    & if Op does go EFI , there are item to make easy to plum & hide ,use stock tank ,not seen , with out pump in tank & the way I would do you really have to study possibly to know where pump is. Most aftermarket catalogs do not show. There's even other ways.
     
    Last edited: Sep 8, 2021
  13. Did a glass 29 roadster years ago. Had a 32 trans with later gears. Put a 2000 cc fours four in it. It was a blast.
     
  14. Blues4U
    Joined: Oct 1, 2015
    Posts: 7,589

    Blues4U
    Member
    from So Cal

    "what newer engine would be best?" I get the feeling the OP is asking about non-HAMB friendly power trains. This isn't the right place to ask this question, the thread will disappear.
     
    Squablow likes this.
  15. sloppy jalopies
    Joined: Jun 29, 2015
    Posts: 5,256

    sloppy jalopies
    Member

    IMO... reverse the firewall and use a carb... or two... or three !
     
  16. junkyardjeff
    Joined: Jul 23, 2005
    Posts: 8,586

    junkyardjeff
    Member

    Just remember the serial number is on the original frame so it would be best to not get rid of it and you should but the numbers on the new frame in the same locations or you might have problems.
     
  17. jimmy six
    Joined: Mar 21, 2006
    Posts: 14,768

    jimmy six
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Many will not agree but the OT V6’s (2/3’s of a SBC) give you plenty of room. Side by side you could mock up everything on the new frame for clearances. A friend did this with 30 closed cab pickup.
     
  18. indyjps
    Joined: Feb 21, 2007
    Posts: 5,375

    indyjps
    Member

    For driving around, and ease of fitment. Ford 2.0 2.3, 2.5 L single overhead cam with a T5, basically a Ford ranger drivetrain. There's lot of info on converting 2.3 from fuel inj to carb.

    If you want more power, or V8 power, flathead Ford and small block chevy are standards with a lot of info.
     
    Just Gary likes this.
  19. ekimneirbo
    Joined: Apr 29, 2017
    Posts: 4,182

    ekimneirbo

    The first thing you need to tell us is what kind of transmission, rear end, and suspension you plan to use.

    If you are planning to transfer the stuff from your original car, that will help decide what needs to go in front of it. It doesn't do much good to put a more powerful engine in front of the old stuff. If you plan to upgrade to an open driveline, then there are a lot of options. Obviously a small Chevy will work, and even though I'm a Chevy engine guy, due to the small engine compartment, you might want to consider one of the small lightweight Fords. The Model A type frame will need some beefing up no matter what you do.

    I would also consider using an electric fuel pump inside your fuel tank with an external fuel pressure regulator and a return line. That gives you the option to run any kind of fuel system (carb or injection) and you can change later on if you want something else. An electric fuel pump does NOT mean you have to run electronic fuel injection. It can also be used with mechanical fuel injection as well as a carburetor. It will also work with electronic fuel injection, so basically you put yourself in a situation where you are free to choose whatever system you want without having to rip out and replace anything later.
     
    Just Gary likes this.
  20. 1946caddy
    Joined: Dec 18, 2013
    Posts: 2,058

    1946caddy
    Member
    from washington

    Street Rodder ran a two part article on how to build a hot rod in three weeks, (Instant Hot Rod).
    It was in the April and May issues 2015. They use the stock tank and firewall and after market frame.
    Not all of the build is HAMB friendly but those items could be omitted from your build. These magazines are available on the net.
    th (1).jpg th (2).jpg
     
  21. Mr48chev
    Joined: Dec 28, 2007
    Posts: 33,820

    Mr48chev
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    I'd agree there. there are plenty of V6 engines around that flat kick butt but are real docile as far as driving. There are plenty of four cylinder engines including one I have here that have decent power and drive good. You don't really need a V8 and may not want one for what you want to do.
    That one would be a hard fit in an A without a lot of changes but it will run you down the road faster than you would want to ride in that car.
    The fuel tank probably isn't an issue with an engine with a carb and a mechanical fuel pump, Guys have been running Model A Fords with V8 engines, stock tank and the mechanical pumps that came with the engine since the first V8 in a Model A swap and to say you can't run an engine that isn't gravity fed is total bullshit.
    Any FI even a mechanical setup out of the 50's or early 60's from some little banger from Europe is going to most likely be a hassle with the stock tank. Most all FI setups need a return line to the tank as part of their fuel pressure control setup.
     
  22. 19Eddy30
    Joined: Mar 27, 2011
    Posts: 2,303

    19Eddy30
    Member
    from VA

    Stock 30-31 will gravity feed a small block Chevy close to 400 hp at ""normal driving,""" Until it drop Little under half tank then it will start draining bowls (because of weight of fuel ) gravity feed cannot keep up . Now thats "Normal driving, "" but even with a full tank ,you where to do a pull to 4,500ish -7,000 rpms ,
    Gravity fed from model A tank cannot keep up.
    This is Gravity fed directly to carburetor.
    No fuel pump.
     
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  23. Beanscoot
    Joined: May 14, 2008
    Posts: 3,041

    Beanscoot
    Member

    The original question is a bit open ended. How much power is wanted?
    40 hp or 400 hp?
     
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  24. Rusty O'Toole
    Joined: Sep 17, 2006
    Posts: 9,656

    Rusty O'Toole
    Member

    You can make the stock tank work with fuel injection or carburetor. With EFI you may need to add a return line and a separate electric fuel pump. With carbs just run the fuel line to the engine's fuel pump - and use a shutoff valve to stop flooding when parked.
    What kind of aftermarket chassis and what kind of engine?
     
  25. 427 sleeper
    Joined: Mar 8, 2017
    Posts: 2,857

    427 sleeper
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Carbureted V8, stock tank, and a hand pump to pressurize the tank. Isn't that the traditional way to do it? :rolleyes:
     
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  26. bartmcneill
    Joined: Dec 23, 2009
    Posts: 395

    bartmcneill
    Member
    from Ada, OK

    I'm Yogi, so named by my grandson when the movie came out 10 years ago. He was Boo Boo but looking eye to eye with me now.
     
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  27. bartmcneill
    Joined: Dec 23, 2009
    Posts: 395

    bartmcneill
    Member
    from Ada, OK

    I should have been more clear. The chassis is from a manufacturer in MO. It has a 4 inch dropped axle with hairpins up front and rack and pinion steering. 4 bar in the back with coil overs. Disc brakes all around. Set up for a small block Chevy v8 with auto trans. I want a v6 so I don't have to modify the firewall. I'd like fuel injection but that won't work with the stock tank. Looking for a nice driving car, not real fast. So from what I read I need an engine with a carb and mech. fuel pump. Kind of hard to find a good carbed engine now days. Going to build the chassis complete before moving coupe over onto it.
     

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  28. gene-koning
    Joined: Oct 28, 2016
    Posts: 4,020

    gene-koning
    Member

    The tank can be modified for efi.
    If the efi engine you are looking at still has a distributor and throttle body injection on it, it can be converted to a carb pretty easily. It gets more complicated if there is no dist, or its port injection, but its still possible.

    My 48 Plymouth coupe has a throttle body efi V6 in it, its been a great car, but I don't have a firewall mounted fuel tank.
     
  29. el Scotto
    Joined: Mar 3, 2004
    Posts: 4,698

    el Scotto
    Member
    from Tracy, CA

    I put together a 2.3l Ford with a 5 speed into a ‘30 Coupe and everything fit beautifully. Under floor pedals, steering column, everything.

    If you can’t find a Ford Ranger to drive home with that drivetrain you’re not looking hard enough.

    I used a marine 2 barrel intake with a Holley 500 CFM two barrel, Ranger factory header and hot wired a whatever Ford calls their HEI distributor and the thing was mean for a 4 cylinder.

    Ending up parting it out but the drivetrain found its way into a Shay Model A and is still tearing up the road as far as I know today…
     
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  30. gimpyshotrods
    Joined: May 20, 2009
    Posts: 23,233

    gimpyshotrods
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    This thread is going to get locked if we keep talking about EFI. I will PM you about that.

    That said, since it is set up for a Chevy V8, you can use a Chevy 4.3l V6. It is basically a 350, with two cylinders missing.

    It will mount to the mounts already on the frame, with the correct engine mounts. The earlier ones are TBI, but can easily be converted to a regular distributor, manifold, and carburetor.

    You would need to move the transmission crossmember forward, to catch to transmission mount. The front of the engine would end up, provided you use a complete short water pump setup from a 1968 and earlier style SBC. The rear of the engine would end the length of an entire cylinder farther forward, to clear the firewall.

    The back of the engine will accept any GM transmission, your choice, stick or auto.
     

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