1930s Era Champ Car - new project

After HJManiac posted that photo of an aluminum tube with a bead on the end I decided I needed a tubing beader so I made up this small die for starters. It screws on to the end of my bead roller instead of slipping over the large diameter shaft. Now I have to make a receiver die and try it out on some tubing. It will work for tubing as small as 3/4" I.D.


I'm going to find a piece of aluminum - an electrical conduit, a piece of lawn furniture, etc. - and make a right angle stat outlet.

 

I made a codpiece for the lower part of the nose.




Since I did not have a piece of metal that was big enough to make the receiver die for my tube bead roller I just grabbed a die from my Diacro bender and turned a bushing insert just for a proof-of-concept tryout. It works.

 

As I stared at the rat hole in the front of the nose I had planned on welding it shut at some time, but then I thought it might look better if I put a cranking hole in it and my question is
-did any cars have a cranking hole - or were they all push started?
-or did some have starter motors?
I'm talking late '30s early '40s.
I'll add a hole if that is historically accurate.

 

This one had an auxiliary starter inserted in front.

 

This might interest you and confuse the question at hand.

The auxiliary starter is like the one in the first video.
The second video has an onboard starter.
Vintage Indy Cars- Startup and Race- Awesome Engine Sounds, Enjoy!! - YouTube

Old Race Cars Never Die - YouTube

 

1932 Hupp Comet crank started. Nice crank handle I might add.

1932 Hupp Comet #4 Indy Car (seriouswheels.com)

 

WOW!
Thanks HJ. Those videos are treasures. I plan to watch them again and again for reference. The quality of those rides just amazes me. They are truly rolling works of art.

I'm taking a little break this weekend and heading your way to Ohio to race a couple of drag cars. I hope to see you there.

 

Looking at the cars from '37-40, (and excluding stock-block and foreign-engined cars), most don't have a visible hole for a starter, but a few do.




Since they came either way, do what you think looks better.

 

Put a crank/auxiliary starter hole in it. Good conversation starter.

 

I think I will plan to add a hole - with a shiny bezel around it.
This got me thinking - were the holes for an electric starter, i.e., an advancement over push starting the car, or were they used for a hand crank, a throwback to earlier years of the brass era where most cars were hand crank started?

The pic with the taped up grille openings is interesting. I wonder if it was done during qualifying attempts? I guess everything in racing has been tried before.

 

I picked a plumbing escutcheon bezel out of my scrap bucket to try out a concept. Cut the hole out of the middle to enlarge for the crank hole. A little black out in the middle showed me what that could look like for a starter crank hole. I'll find one in polished stainless to modify for real.




I thought about friction shocks too. I cut out some star adjuster blanks and a lever arm. Need pressure plates and friction discs.

 

This week was not real productive. Last weekend I raced a couple of cars at Thompson and that kept me busy. I suffered some breakage. The ladder bar bushings on my Willys coupe were so hammered out that the car wanted to change lanes as I let off the gas going through the lights. I withdrew from competition. My other car lost first round. Such is racing. I have the car in the shop and replacement parts on order.

I did manage to make a preliminary pattern for the hood. It is a trapezoidal affair. Plans are to make it of aluminum for easy removal. To retain it I'll use leather straps with buckles and springs. The pieces under the header and carbs will probably be fixed in place with bolts - or hidden Dzus fasteners.

 

Thompson Gasser Meet 2021

It was great seeing you again!

 

Thanks Mike. It was good to see you. Great pic of me and George racing our six bangers. Our "Loose Screws" hoodlum hot rodder group is coming over this week to help with repairs to the Willys. The shock bushings are also shot. The gas gauge is not working so as long as we have to drop the exhaust and unfasten the rear axle we will also drop the trailer hitch / parachute pack and gas tank to see what's up. That may eat into my champ car build time.

 

Hoods are a tedious build because WE tend to be more critical then "Its just a racecar"

 

Champ cars (Indy cars) have to be able to start and move off from standing start. They have to have some way to start the engine with the vehicle setting still. That can be an internal or external starting motor. Sprint cars and midgets do not and require a push start.

 

Some hood design ideas here.

The Miller/Offenhauser Photo & Sound Gallery Page (milleroffy.com)

 

Thanks for the link - lots to drool over.
I think I'll be using these strap tensioners:

https://www.jegs.com/i/Limeworks/67...9pfq4nwxw3bWhyJhHUmvCOafe8Lh9F4hoCMrIQAvD_BwE

I like the look. I wonder how they're made?

 

With a "spring in their step"

 

• 302 Stainless Steel
• .135 inch diameter wire
• 2.48 inches tall
• 2.23 inches wide

I think the minimum bend radius is the wire diameter or about .270" diameter.

 

Another Idea from the peanut gallery

Episode #44 A bit O this and a bit O that.. - Bing video

 

After watching the video I realized I have nearly the same spring on my back screen door as a limit spring.
Still thinking of the real deal tensioners mentioned earlier.

 

A little philosophical wandering for today, only tangentially related to building this car.

I am advancing in age. I have had this build going on for years.
That's OK.
I'm nothing if not patient. I like having a project I can look forward to advancing toward completion, but I have realized if I am to enjoy driving this toy I better git a move on and git 'er done. That has changed my attitude on some things, like conserving my resources. By "resources" I mean both money invested in this project and materials and parts I have saved for using "someday".
Take the hood strap hold down springs for example. The kit referenced above is 300 bucks! A pair of screen door limit springs is probably ten bucks at a hardware store. In years past I would have opted for the less expensive option. Either would function OK.
But at this point in my life if I think the car will look more traditional with the costlier part that is what it will get. I recently ordered a flip-up gas cap from Speedway for $100. In my younger days I would have used a cheap gas cap salvaged from a farm implement or whatever. Likewise if I look in my material collection for a piece of metal to machine I no longer think "that's too good of a piece to use now - I'll save it for a later need."
Now is later.
I'm pulling out the stops on this project. Life is short and getting shorter. Whatever it needs is what it will get.
Likewise for my languishing Attic Anglia project.

 

^^^^^^You are not alone in your thoughts, I used to say I would live till 200, not any more if I plan to drive and ride what I’m working on.
Love your build !,

 

Thanks Barrelnose. I love your avatar car and your coupe too. I can't imagine how hard it is to build traditional American based hot rods overseas.

 

You summed it up pretty well. Working on my "Match race" altered wheelbase '64 Dodge and having similar thoughts on how I want the build to go. The concept all along was to build it how I would have in my garage back in the mid '60s. Not looking for a show car, but a fun, different style hotrod to enjoy driving. As a friend said of my straight axle '57 Chevy station wagon back in '66 it's going to be a 50/50 build for the cosmetics (50 feet at 50 mph) but the mechanical parts will be good and it's going to put a big smile on my face the first time it hits the streets around here.

Then I can get back on the HA/GR project and get back to racing.

 

THERMOSTAT EXCITEMENT

I found a universal right-angle thermostat housing for a small block chevrolet on line. I decided it would save me a lot of fab time to buy the kit and hack up the right-angle piece to weld to my Ford stat housing plate.
When the part arrived I had an idea. Maybe the entire piece could be used by sandwiching my heater opening block off plate between the head and the chevy mounting plate. I measured the C-C distances of the attachment bolts. The chevy holes are spaced .190" further apart than the Ford stat housing holes.
But... The chev uses 3/8" diameter bolts. The Ford head uses 5/16" diameter bolts. With a little additional wiggle room on the bolt holes the chevy part just may bolt up to my Ford head, saving me fabricating and welding time. I laid the Chevy part over my adapter plate and lo-and-behold - the holes align! There is even enough room on the counterbore for the 5/16" Allen head bolts to clear without having to spot face a larger counterbore.

That was a lot easier than I expected. Sometimes its much better to be lucky than good.



Traditionalist b*llet haters don't go nutz. This is a polished casting not a billet.

 

Here is a little humor.
I was asked by a friend to make a running board caddy for a Brass Era 1904 Rambler. In fact he wanted ten of them. [I didn't know ten 1904 Ramblers even existed, much less that they all needed a running board caddy, but they do and they do!] This thing held oil or acetylene or kerosene or some such, in little stamped depressions retained by brass spring clips. I explained the hardest part of making this part would be the depressions in the base. Even the original example had die breakout in two places. I tried making a stamping die. No good - it puckered the surrounding metal. I tried bead rolling. No good - the dies interfered with the adjacent depression. I finally decided to hammer form the depression and weld in the bottom.
After I successfully made the depressions in the first part blank I went and got the original to see how my depressions compared.
How did I do?
DUH!

Anyway, back on the champ car.

View attachment 5096137

 

They look pretty good.

 

Thanks Flyer, Loving your build.
The avatar car was thrown together for a desert race meet (Lake Perkolilli) out of mainly bits and peices I had tucked away and the Coupe is an ongoing project.
You’re right, it’s not the easiest to build a rod down here as parts are few and far between but if you want something bad enough.