Not the same argument in my mind. That is a socio/politcal argument (and not in the what are your political views sense but in the world events sense)not one of innovation and design like you mention in the article.
You are absolutely right. But my point isn't really one of semantics. It's of literal inputs vs outputs given the resources at hand. I believe the 777 car achieved much more than any Nazi Germany car did before it with way less resources at hand. And it did so purely because of innovation and passion. HOT RODDING. I'm not REALLY trying to compare the two cars. I'm really comparing what was behind each. I could have made similar arguments between the T80 and Poteet's SBC powered record holder from a few years back. Like I said, not very well written on my part.
Under that context, I can see your point and agree. Absolutely, the 777 car achieved much more with much less. Innovation and passion versus pride and glory. I won't comment or judge on that aspect, as I'm not a writer. That being said, I think discourse is a healthy thing. Arguing the merits and points, not the political intentions, is a good aspect for this thread. Challenging one's mind is good for all of us.
I'm 100% with you. My biggest problem as a writer is getting my point across concisely. Always has been...
'Speedy Canuck'- "I won't comment or judge on that aspect, as I'm not a writer. That being said, I think discourse is a healthy thing. Arguing the merits and points, not the political intentions, is a good aspect for this thread. Challenging one's mind is good for all of us." Well said gentlemen. Ric
They had probably learned about loss of traction problems at high speeds. I daresay this phenomenon resulted in many of the crashes of early speed record attempts. Perhaps the believed downforce was the answer. But at some point the drag is too much of a hinderance. I think most LRS racers these days use weight to maintain traction
Anyone know how much of that was motor? Well, @ 3+ tons, Newton's law of motion certainly comes into play...
Great read for my breakfast wake up. I'm thinking the political part comes from your descriptive wording, regarding Nazis, but I overlooked that, knowing that the article as a whole, was not about that at all. I really don't want to comment any further on this part, as it's not relevant, and don't want to see a good thread screwed up. What I do want to comment on, is the odd rod. Ever since I first saw it, I've been fascinated with it. It's the sort of odd thing I would build, had I been around back then. It makes no sense, has the aero dynamics of a brick, and yet it still turned a good time. I'm trying to remember where I first read about it, and I'm sure it started life as something without the body? I'm thinking it's in "The birth of hot rodding", so I've just dug it outer the bookshelf, and I'll go take a look. As for perspective, I like brains over brawn, except for cars. With cars, give me muscle any day. An open header hillbilly V8 does something for me, that no other engine can do, even a finely tuned V12.
Lesson learned: it pays to read all of a post, eh? Yeah, agreed. That transmission/transaxle assembly looks like it must weigh quite a bit too. Edit: Looks like Ryan beat me to it by two minutes. I guess I was typing as he was posting. I find it kind of funny in an odd way that they just threw some wood blocks under the frame for the picture. With a blank check build and knowing the German mindset in regards to quality, I would have thought they would have made some purpose built stands for this thing. I like the gussets running up and down the spine were the tubing meets. It is certainly a piece of automotive design art...
I just got a huge laugh out of you referring to Hitler blowing smoke out of his methamphetamine burned asshole. That is f..kin' classic.
The only thing political I got from this is America rules, Nazi's drool. Sent from my SM-G900T using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
Well- I am glad you posted it. That is a cool looking design- I love those '30s streamliners. And who can't respect Mr. Porsche's engineering prowess? And props to the HAMB's own Nick's Garage for recreating the Oddrod.
wow... that is pretty unreal. the aluminum casting for the transaxle to drive four wheels... what appears to be an 8-10" eliptical tube frame member that is curved and shaped... damn an unlimited budget looks fun!
Didn't one of the Auto Union cars hit an overpass support trying to set a speed record earlier in the 30s? Maybe they're accounting for a bit more rigidity, stability and driver safety with this one...
By the end of the war alone technology was leaps and bounds beyond where it was in 1939. One thing about war is it always results in rapid technological advancement. Imagine what the records would have been if a group of engineers were given free reign and tasked with setting records without any mind to the cost, throwing all practicality out the window, in 1945. Or 1952. Those were some of the best engineers in Europe. I also wonder how often Ferdinand had to go and pick Hans Ledwinka's brain for ideas? The W125 that ran 268mph had a 725hp engine, the T80 had a 3000hp engine. That's a little over 4x the power of the W125. How fast it would have run is anyone's guess but I'm sure it would have been impressive. Wouldn't it have been something to have seen the Auto Unions and Mercedes-Benz (Benzes?) run in the day, especially considering what consisted of transport for the average person at the time. Most of Europe was still reliant on horses at least in the country. They must have seemed like "spacecraft".
very interesting topic - especially when you see the amazing design & creativity back then. for more info on the T80 plenty on line like: https://oldmachinepress.com/2012/10/01/mercedes-benz-t80-type-80/ but, don't forget Bonneville early days, like Teddy Tetzlaff in the Blitzen-Benz 1914=141.73MPH. Then Sir Malcom Campbell in the Campbell-Railton Blue Bird (acknowledged as the first Bonneville Streamliner) 1935= 301.29 - powered by a Rolls-Royce "R" Schneider Trophy Aircraft Engine with 2500HP @ 3200 RPM
The photos of it undressed tell the real story of building in an unlimited world vs. building using hot rod ingenuity. That thing appears more sophisticated than many of the modern race cars we are subjected to, often also with extravagant budgets, and it was built 80 YEARS AGO! Their jackstand budget sucked wind for sure, and I LOL'ed when Ryan pointed that out. Nobody focuses on only the subject at hand like a German Engineer.
Germans always excelled at building fine machinery, no wonder they could produce this with unlimited money and the best talent.
Just because you like something some one did (or built), it doesn't mean you approve of them or everything they did. Don't tip-toe around stuff because some one is looking for a way to be offended or might "misinterpret you." It's a hell of a car so don't worry about admiring it.. If the devil had designed the 40 Ford, I'd still want one.
This makes me drool... r https://www.google.com/search?q=Mer...gsjSAhUCxmMKHZp-Af4Q_AUICSgC&biw=1600&bih=810
i would probably guess from the german built machinery i have dealt with, that that car would have surprised us with what it could do.................of course, using that same logic............it would have required many days to prep for a run, if it broke it would have required a small army of men and a warehouse full of specialized tools to fix it. and if it did make a pass the "maintenance schedule" would have bankrupt the german tax payers. .............the pen may be mightier than the sword but the pencil always works.
The Jalopy Journal
