Title questions and serial numbers that don't jive ALWAYS prompt me to visit the NEXT vehicle for sale. There is an ass for every seat, but my ass will always be on the seat of a vehicle with a valid title and valid serial number.
This truck still needs a lot for the price. I know it's nice because it's close, but that is a lot, unless you like the suspension and wheel combo. Those trucks are out there and for good prices. Titus has a 33 for sale right now for half the price http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/threads/1933-ford-truck.964610/
Vehicles without clean paperwork get pennies on the dollar from me, and never more than I'd be willing to part with entirely. Here in NJ, people scoff at the procedures to get a vehicle reVINed through the DMV and state police, but in actuality it's the smartest way to go. If you have a vehicle with no numbers whatsoever, for whatever reason, if you bring the car and proper documentation to the State Police they will hold it, run searches, do a general investigation. You may have to take an ad out in the local newspaper. It's a PITA. But in the end, you have brand new VIN number with clean paperwork in your name. The car may be 100 years old, but from a paper trail standpoint it's as if the car was just built. It's history with that number begins with you.
I called an office in Texas this morning. The numbers are legit, but whats odd is the old title they have in the system from the 30's has the same vin and says 32. So when the guy in Texas brought this truck in from Missouri, the title he had from what I presume is the original owner had the same info.
We have gone thru this many times : the differences between 32 and 33/34. Just a quick review, the reason Ford added the large strengthening bulge on the rear panel was the same reason that Ford shoved the firewall out, to GAIN ROOM IN THE CAB. most 33's Don't have the upper bulge and the panel tended to "OIL CAN". I hope we ALL know 32's have a "bolt in firewall", 33/34's are spot welded. On the frame, 33/34 swoop up, 32's are straight from firewall out. 32 fenders won't fit 33/34 frames, Another tell-tale clue, radiator for 32 mount ON TOP of cross member, 33/34 in FRONT of cross member. One more thing, W.B. on 33/34 were longer than 32's allowing rear fenders to be centered on bed, instead of ugly longer bed behind fender on 32's. Look for gas tank. different, BLAH, blah, blah. Many other differences probably known only to old FORD BUFFS. here's enuff to get you "in a few lively discussions,"
I think that you might be missing the point. I don't think there's doubt that the title is legit and the previous title could have very well been from Missouri. The problem is, does that title actually link to the truck? Is that vin actually on that truck anywhere? Or did the owner (or previous owner) just register the vin on that title and put the plates on the truck, or I guess in this case do nothing and is just claiming that the title is correct for the truck? What links that title to that truck?
Nothing, and THAT is the problem. If the vehicle that the title belongs to shows up, one, the other, or both of these vehicles could end up confiscated. What happens to one, the other, or both owners is up to the courts to decide. That might not ever happen, but if it does, was it worth risking $12,500.00? I would not bother.
The way things are these days, if I could not find a VIN on the truck that matches the one on the title, I'd walk.
Can't argue with that. It used to be all too common to use a title that you bought somewhere on a rig you built with no vin on the rig but now They get real serious about the vin on the rig and having it be proper now.
Or if someone actual has the title that matches the vin on that truck they can show up and claim it as still being theirs and all you have to prove otherwise is a title that says you own a different truck that isn't even the same year. Step back and look at the situation, if it were me I'd walk away.
Washington State Patrol took my 65 Mustang, to impound, had it for 6 months, brought it back with new title and new numbers, said it had been stolen 11 year before, insurance had paid $1700.00. Told them case was closed, and give it back to me. For $500.00 I still don't know who got $500.00 cash from me.
With modified vehicles this old, you are most likely dealing with something assembled from a pile of parts, so it's no surprise to find a '34 cab on a '32 frame. A friend in Alabama has a '27 Model T roadster pickup built on a '29 Model A frame. The only serial number is on the frame, Ford didn't put the serial number anywhere on the body until '49. The body is actually the front half of a touring car that he pulled out of a ravine, probably dumped there when some farmer used the frame and axles to build a farm wagon. The Model A frame came with a bill of sale (all Alabama requires on vehicles that old) and a readable serial number, so it's registered as a '29 even though it has a '27 body. The body and frame met each other for the first time in Gary's shop. To further confuse things, Ford made a fair number of running changes that didn't coincide with a model year change, and Ford liked to use up leftover parts. So, as a general rule it's a '34 cab if it has the wide beltline across the back of the cab, but I would not be shocked to find an original very late '33 with a "'34" cab or a very early production '34 with a "'33" cab. Sometimes weird stuff happens even on later model stuff with more standardized VIN numbers. Years ago when we lived in Maryland, I had an OT '86 Ford Tempo that the state of MD insisted on titling as an '85. The serial number indicated it was an '86. It had the third brake light in the back window, which is the biggest difference between an '85 and an '86. Serial number on the title matched what was on the car, but the state insisted it was an '85. Didn't really care as long as I could get a tag for it, cheap reliable transportation from Point A to Point B.
I realize you aren't in my area, but here's a good example of a less desirable model than a 33, it's a 29, but still a good deal and a lot less $$$$. Clean title. I haven't seen this truck, but I'm just giving it the benefit of the doubt. Just food for thought. https://boston.craigslist.org/gbs/cto/5804685377.html
Nice effort,but when your looking at a 32-34 closed cab Ford, a 28-29 Ford roadster PU hardly fill the need/want. IMO
Maybe I missed it but is the frame an original Henry or aftermarket? I have a feeling the old Texas title they have on file might be correct, just the title back then was on another truck, probably a 32. Tons of hot rods out there with "purchased" titles. A lot of them have aftermarket frames with old numbers someone stamped. Doesn't mean their legal. Personally, I won't buy a vehicle unless it has a factory stamped or state issued vin, anything else is just too sketchy. State police came show up anytime in the future and just take it, no matter what your paperwork says if they determine the vin is not legit.
Very true. I just re-read the whole thread, especially the OP's posts. I'm not sure he actually is looking for a 33-34 closed cab Ford, specifically. He mentions his oldest car is a 65 Caddy, and he would like to "put some steelies on and have a running rod for not a lot of $". Paintslinger tossed up this suggestion as an alternative: Then Murocmaru showed a '33 for sale right here on hamb for $6500 needs work but has a lot going for it. OP never really chimed in on either, if he was dead set on a 32-34 closed cab p/u I would think that would peek interest. If he was set on a running rod for a little work and not a lot of $, it seems there are a lot of options out there for $12500, but he seems set on the original truck with the funky paperwork, despite a lot of older hambers suggesting it was overpriced. I know it's easy to get excited and fixated on a deal, especially once the negotiation starts, even a bad deal looks good. I could be dead wrong, but the OP still doesn't seem clear on exactly what he wants, just tossing out another idea if he wasn't set on a 32-34.
I would runaway from that truck if the numbers on the title are not stamped on the frame or body,if you would have to do a out of state inspection where they see if the numbers match you would be screwed.
The seller was hospitalized, so he hasn't swapped the title to florida. I won't even go look at it if that doesn't happen first. As far as the truck goes I am not dead set on anything. This particular truck is closer than most things in my budget. I thought that if the numbers are on the truck somewhere (I haven't seen it so I don't know) it would be a decent deal. I do know that I don't want a roadster, I WANT(ed) a model A but I cannot afford one that I like.
Cool, that makes sense. Maybe someone here can make some suggestions knowing what your budget is, and what your scope is. Myself, I own a 60 caddy and would really like an AV8 traditional hot rod coupe or 4 door (mostly the opportunity to build one myself). I never have any money, so right now it's a mute point, but if I ran into $12500 I could use, then I would start a thread and ask for hambers' help and advise, they have bitcin' old school networks where they find great deals, I have only CL and HAMB classifieds. They have been helpful a couple times pointing out bad deals I might have made. Hope the truck in FL works out, like people are saying, a 33 is pretty cool.
The best you will get out of this deal is a truck and a title but they very well may not be related. You are on the right track with insisting he give you a clean title but unless you can prove to yourself (and that's always a problem when one is hot on the trail of a new project) that they match, there will be a problem down the road. My vote is to keep looking.
With the devious direction some folks have taken, it's difficult to be certain someone is on the up and up, when you're trying to spend your hard earned money wisely.
just something to ponder. evert state registers things different. In 1991 I bought a 1951 chevy pickup from the original owner. I got the original title, thing is Wisconsin titled it using the engine serial number! So if you changed out the engine nothing would have match . I brought this to the attention of the dmv at the time and they added the serial number of the body to my new title. But had I not questioned it and changed out the motor , which I did when I built it . There would have been no way to match the title and the serial number on the truck. who knows what the history of this truck has been over the last 82 years!!! Larry
If that's what you want start saving your money and don't spend your hard warned cash on the pile of crap,you will never get your money back. The Hamb classifieds are full of Model A's a lot less expensive than the pile you are looking at.HRP
It doesn't seem to be that hard to use a bogus title to get a car on the road, but if it's insured and you have a loss the insurance company will look for fraud a lot harder than the DOT did. This has been discussed on the HAMB before. I have a "Specially Constructed Vehicle" title and it doesn't bother me a bit. I know it's legitimate. Gary
Back in the '50's, so many states used the engine number on the title, instead of the vehicle serial number. For the exact reasons you mentioned, using the engine number just never made any sense. On the M.S.O. (manufactures statement of origin), which was given to the dealer, from the assembly plant, that M.S.O. utilized the vehicle serial number. Many states chose not to follow through with what the factory provided.
So I have decided (thanks largely in part to you guys here) to not pursue the truck. I want a model A so that is what I am going to focus my efforts on.
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