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Technical TIG On Sheetmetal: bogus advice?

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Ulu, Jun 8, 2014.

  1. Ulu
    Joined: Feb 26, 2014
    Posts: 1,775

    Ulu
    Member
    from CenCal

    This doesn't seem right to me, but maybe he's welding beer cans? I read this, elsewhere:

    "...you can not start tig welding on thin sheet metal with out a foot pedal..."

    I never TIGged anything without a pedal, but was considering buying a machine without one. (No, no thumbwheel either...)

    20Ga is about the thinnest I expect to weld, but can I weld thinner by striking the arc on a prepared filler or backer?

    I figure I can always use a backer or starter bar & snag it off later.
     
  2. rockable
    Joined: Dec 21, 2009
    Posts: 4,450

    rockable
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    I think he is talking about aluminum. You can darn sure TIG all the carbon steel sheet metal you want without a foot pedal. You just need the foot pedal to start the puddle quickly on aluminum and then back it down.
     
  3. gimpyshotrods
    Joined: May 20, 2009
    Posts: 23,333

    gimpyshotrods
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    "...you cannot start tig welding on thin sheet metal with out a foot pedal..."

    Every time you read this, just think of the person saying: "I cannot start a TIG welding arc on thin sheet metal with out a foot pedal."

    They are just admitting a personal shortcoming. Welcome that, because the first step is admitting that you have a problem.
     
    Hitchhiker likes this.

  4. Ulu
    Joined: Feb 26, 2014
    Posts: 1,775

    Ulu
    Member
    from CenCal

    Great! I've only done mild steel and food grade stainless with any arc welding before and have never tried aluminum.

    But I'm not actually wanting to weld aluminum at this point either.
     
  5. langy
    Joined: Apr 27, 2006
    Posts: 5,730

    langy
    Member Emeritus

    I also think the guy means aluminium, I use a pedal as often as possible because it allows you more control, but you can still do it without.
     
  6. ems customer service
    Joined: Nov 15, 2006
    Posts: 2,634

    ems customer service
    Member

    tig welding with foot or thumb control is possible, but the best feature of tig is the instant control of heat from the foot pedal

    why go though all the trouble to avoid its best feature??
     
  7. Ulu
    Joined: Feb 26, 2014
    Posts: 1,775

    Ulu
    Member
    from CenCal

    I need to find one I can afford. I'm just a hobbyist.
    A $4000 welder isn't in the budget. :oops:
     
  8. gimpyshotrods
    Joined: May 20, 2009
    Posts: 23,333

    gimpyshotrods
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Buy used.
     
  9. tig master
    Joined: Apr 9, 2009
    Posts: 416

    tig master
    Member
    from up north

    Yes you can do steel sheet metal without a foot pedal but unless you are a accomplished tig weldor
    there will be somewhat of a steep learning curve.You will also need a machine that goes down to very low amps to keep the puddle control in order.If you haven't done any tig I don't recommend this as your beginning session with tig welding.Why don't you mig it and be done with it.Sheet metal is mig welded every day in body shops.Very few body shops use tig at all.

    T
     
    ems customer service likes this.
  10. larry k
    Joined: Feb 23, 2009
    Posts: 548

    larry k
    Member

    I can weld sheet metal with oxy / acy and it ain't got no stinking pedal... !
     
  11. rockable
    Joined: Dec 21, 2009
    Posts: 4,450

    rockable
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    I bought my Miller Synchrowave 180 from some one else, who bought it from someone else. I got a practically new machine with Miller cart, consumables and filler rods plus stick welding attachment for $1100. Craigslist is your friend. You might have to drive a little but no more than you're going to use it, you will save a lot of money.
     
  12. Kiwi Tinbender
    Joined: Feb 23, 2006
    Posts: 1,155

    Kiwi Tinbender
    Member

    I bought my Lincoln 185 brand new for $1600. Granted, that was ten years ago, but it has never failed me, and I use it daily. No water cooled torch, but a foot pedal. If you want to really learn to do it right, Tig or Oxy Acetylene....
     
  13. Ulu
    Joined: Feb 26, 2014
    Posts: 1,775

    Ulu
    Member
    from CenCal

    I have welded quite a bit with a torch actually. I can do sheetmetal OK, but I got to use a TIG machine and I'm spoiled.

    Also, having welded with stick and torch, I thought the TIG was a breeze.

    Now, granted, one of the old guys had set up the machine & all I did was turn the amps down a tad, pick up a filler, work the pedal slightly.

    I welded a nice bead on stainless pipe elbows, without practice, and I doubt it was 16 Ga. I was in love!

    While my hand might not be as steady as those days, but after that experience, I've always thought I should like to own a TIG welder. It was like welding had suddenly jumped from 1920 to the year 2000. This was technology that really worked.

    I believe that was a Miller Syncrowave machine, but it was fairly big. In fact just barely smaller than the war surplus Lincolns I learned to weld on in the 60's.
     
  14. The size of the electrode is very important for sheet metal. also properly sharpened. You can not get a good start unless you use a small electrode.
     
  15. BarryA
    Joined: Apr 22, 2007
    Posts: 643

    BarryA
    Member

    I call BS: The attached pic shows TIG welding on 1.2mm ally done with an HF-start machine, by two guys on one of my courses who up to 30 minutes beforehand had NEVER TIG welded ANYTHING.....

    Does a pedal make it easier? Absofuckinglutely....but it sure isn't a necessity, much like it is perfectly possible to shape metal perfectly without a wheeling machine, planishing hammer or any other big machinery..

    I learned TIG welding sheetmetal (without filler) on a cheap scratch-start TIG at Contour Autocraft in the UK - if it is good enough for their perfect Jag XK panels, it should be good enough for anyone. Sure the HF start makes it easier, and a pedal IS great, but it does add a layer of complexity that can actually make it harder for a beginner.

    This sums it up perfectly:
     

    Attached Files:

    gimpyshotrods likes this.
  16. Petejoe
    Joined: Nov 27, 2002
    Posts: 12,285

    Petejoe
    Member
    from Zoar, Ohio

    Yes you can weld without a pedal. Another great feature for a tig on thin sheetmetal is a pulse.
    This is an adjustment that lowers the current on a timed basis by a knob. Usually lowering the amperage very fast in spurts.
     
  17. Ulu
    Joined: Feb 26, 2014
    Posts: 1,775

    Ulu
    Member
    from CenCal

    This Eastwood setup with plasma is starting to look very affordable if I forgo a acetylene cart setup for a while:

    http://www.eastwood.com/eastwood-tig-plasma-and-cart-kit-48198.html

    Compared to other equipment I've been looking at (Hobart) it's half the price.
    For what I'm going to do, it's probably going to be perfect.

    But I worry about random sample defects. If I have to send it back to Eastwood, it would be a PITA.
    If the circuit board availability was nil, that would be a big PITA. (Most likely thing to fail IMO.)
     
  18. saltflats
    Joined: Aug 14, 2007
    Posts: 12,602

    saltflats
    Member
    from Missouri

    I shoped for a tig years ago (before Cragslist) I would whatch the paper in the big cities but could never get there before they were sold so I call American welding supply in Texas and had one trucked in cost me 1200.00 bucks for a lincoln 300 tig with water cooled torch and stick set up this thing is a beast.
     
  19. seb fontana
    Joined: Sep 1, 2005
    Posts: 8,495

    seb fontana
    Member
    from ct

    I tig all the time with my Lincoln 175, no foot pedal or thumb slide...I didn't like the feel of the foot pedal [dealer said nothing wrong with it] and the thumb slide I didn't like either as it has an "off" detent that is hard to over come to start causing torch movement, so don't use that either...someday I will take apart and make to my feel, but I always get by fine by just adjusting things at the machine as I go..
     
  20. Ulu
    Joined: Feb 26, 2014
    Posts: 1,775

    Ulu
    Member
    from CenCal

    They're at least twice that now...
     
  21. I work at a Job shop that has 6 to 7 tig machines, we put a micro swtich on the torch and start arc from it. It only takes two wires to do this works well.
     

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