History We ALL Love a DARE! PIX of TRULY Extinct Makes?

1 dollar in 1910 is worth approx 21 dollars today according to this site:

http://mykindred.com/cloud/TX/Documents/dollar/

 

Found the pix of the 1914 Dayton CycleCar and scanned them. I recall the owners specifying it was a 1914 model and this one says it is #57 on the VIN tag. Sorry it took a while to respond on this.

 

That is a 1934 or '35 Hudson or Terraplane convertible coupe body. Did you take these pics in southeast Michigan around 20 years ago? If so I have a story and if so it is a '34 Terraplane for certain. Was it cut in half through the center of the floor from side to side?

 

Thanks, AJ. WOW! So even the $20,000 version of the Burg would equate to a $40,000-plus car in today's terms. That was in a time when even a physician might make at best $2-3,000 a year. Again, WOW. I become more convinced all the time that early autos were only accessible to society's upper crust.

 

Gosh, StillOutThere, this has to be a super-scarce car! And, unlike most cyclecars, this one seems to have a more potent engine. Sort of a hotrod in its day???

No need to apologize for taking time, man. I think everybody on here knows it takes TIME to find a surviving example of a lot of the 2,000-or-so car makes built before 1925 or 1930, right? One source only puts these as being made from 1909 to 1911 by the W.D. Dayton Automobile Co., Chicago, IL. But facts seem to vary on such early cars, I guess. THANKS for the pix!!! What the thread is all about!


1914 Dayton cyclecar

 

Here's another try at presenting a pic of the Stude
concept atomic-powered and gyroscopically balanced
Astral. This pic is thanks to an article posted on the
net by Paul "Kneeslider" Crowe and is of the Astral
while on display at the Peterson Museum. Its perm-
anent residence is, not surprisingly, in South Bend,
Indiana. And, yes, Studebaker only made one.

 

Okay, I've got another bugaboo make I can't find anything on, it being the Dragon automobile of Chicago, made only in 1920-1. SO, if anybody has any info, pix or even an ad drawing, it would be more than I've found! Since it fizzled within a year, I'm reckoning that NO 1920 Dragon still survives today. Thoughts, anybody?

________________________________________________________________


That said, Dragon is a name that has surfaced several times in the auto world (right, HJ? LOL). But WAY before Henry Kaiser okayed the DRAGON name for one of his more successful models, there was the Dragon of 1906 to 1908. I've wanted to write this make up for some time, because it seems a case of a company getting off on the right foot, then falling apart and crashing in humiliating flames!

To begin with, the company was founded in Maine by several men with sound composite experience in autos, engineering, manufacturing and even racing. Production began in Detroit, then quickly shifted to Philadelphia when a better plant was secured, through connections of one of the backers. Dragons were reasonably priced for the time, around $2,000.

But quality control issues surfaced right away, after several of the company leaders bolted for other automotive endeavors. Also, Dragon was apparently under-capitalized and was by 1907 already in trouble with suppliers including engine-maker Herschell-Spillman and electronics maker Splitdorf. A bank which had loaned over $100,000 dollars secured the loan with 200 Dragon cars, essentially held in storage, to be sold only when/if the bank called in the loan.

By 1907's close, the 18-month-old company had thrown in the towel, though few of the original leaders were still around. The company, though, was reorganized and determined to concentrate on tourers for the taxi trade. Though re-capitalized to the tune of a million dollars, the revamped Dragon company was again in receivership by March of '08! Assets, including about 75 unfinished touring cars, were sold at public auction by April '08.

In the end, a company that had started well, stepped metaphorically in a few cow patties and, well, flopped! Was it due to money matters, fragmented leadership, the Panic of 1907? Maybe a combination of such factors. Anyhow, what's for sure is Dragon joined the scrap heap with the majority of failed U.S. auto-making efforts.

The actual number of Dragon cars completed seems to total only in the hundreds, not thousands. So, an '07 or '08 Dragon is a rare commodity today! Below is a nice one, residing safely in Pennsylvania's Boyertown Museum of Historic Vehicles.


1907 Dragon, thanks to Bruno Costers who has shot most or all of the museum's collection at Boyertown. Mr. Costers' photo was uploaded to Webshots by him to the American Greetings site (rides.webshots.com/album/562281999bMJNcP).


<CENTER> </CENTER><CENTER>
1907 Dragon Automobile Co. Magazine Ad is </CENTER><CENTER>THANKS to AmericanAutomobiles.com to whom </CENTER><CENTER>sincere appreciation is expressed. Please note </CENTER><CENTER>illustration of the Herschell-Spillman four-cylinder.</CENTER>

 

Thanks for the I.D. "Still Out There" I'm pretty sure I did not take the pics in S.E. Michigan but I (and I'm sure the others here) would love to hear your story anyways.

 

Raymond Loewy's custom '32 Hupmobile with Raymond Loewy driving.

 

I LOVE 32/33 Hupps. I believe that is the only Conv Sedan I have ever seen.

 

It may be the only one ever made since it was custom built for Raymond Loewy.

 

You gotta check this thread out that our friend twin6 started, there is some really cool stuff there.

History Photos taken before WW2 - history in black and white

http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=483757

 

Thanks Sunroofcord. I've got a lot of photos from before WW2, and after, and wanted to see if interest within the HAMB community would support a thread for pix taken before WW2. So far, so good, but we could use some help. I've got lots of pix that were taken after WW2 of really old and cool stuff, so will try and stop in here from time to time, and share those. I know I have a photo of a surviving Dragon, at a car show ages ago, and will post it here tomorrow. Might make Jimi's day, even if it's the one now at Boyertown.

 

Here is my Stuz special on a street in Yonkers NY circa 1934. The car was built by Schumacher Motor Services between 1928 and 1932. The original consigner paid 10k towards the car and then lost all his money in the stock market crash so it was finished by the builder with his own funds. When business was slow they would tow one of the race cars around NY city trolling for business.

 

More on the Birmingham:

1922 Birmingham Demonstration
The Birmingham (1921-1923) was a 55 hp Continental-engined six on a 124-inch wheelbase with standard components used throughout but a most unusual flexible suspension system. Three transverse springs and an independent rear axle were combined with two transverse springs in front that made for a four-wheel independent suspension and the "easiest riding car ever put on the market," as advertising said. Alas, getting the Birmingham on the market was the hard part.

Because the suspension system was similar to that which had appeared on the Cornelian built by the Blood Brothers in Kalamazoo, Cyrus E. Weaver, the designer of the Birmingham, purchased all relevant patents held by the Blood Brothers. This was perhaps the only aspect of the Birmingham venture that went right.

The first Birmingham prototype sedan was completed and tested in Detroit in May of 1921, but already Jamestown, New York, had been selected as the factory site. The mayor of Jamestown, Samuel A. Carlson, agreed to serve as president of Birmingham Motors Corporation, accepting no salary for the position. Because he believed Birmingham would do for Jamestown what Franklin had done for Syracuse (and even, grandiosely, what Ford had done for Detroit), Carlson asked only for out-of-pocket expenses for promoting this new industry for his community.

Demonstrations of the new Birmingham were set up in numerous towns in Upstate New York and elsewhere, with an office opened in each for the sale of stock. Five cars were assembled in nearby Falconer by early 1922, these joined the two further cars previously put together in Detroit, and this fleet of demonstrators had soon hit as many as 50 cities. One of them was New York City for the National Automobile Show in January 1922.


Stock was selling quickly for the new company but a defamatory article about the company had appeared in the stock market publication, known as the U.S. Investor.
Initially it was thought this malicious piece of journalism could be turned to Birmingham’s advantage. But in August 1922 the AP wire service buzzed with the news that a Federal grand jury in Washington had filed a presentment following a 10-month investigation by the U.S. Post Office. The charge was fraudulent use of the mails to sell more than $300,000 of worthless stock. 18 Birmingham men were named ion the named action including Mayor Samuel Carlson. Newspapers that were not friendly to Carlson had a field day with these charges.
Production continued and during the next two months Birmingham assembled 26 cars. But a stockholders meeting in October ended in bedlam, with one local stock salesman stabbed to death.
In June of 1923, the indictment against Birmingham officials was dismissed in court but the damage was done. To generate favorable publicity, a Duesenberg-engined Birmingham racecar was built to compete in the 1923 Indianapolis 500. But with all the controversy and slacking sales the money ran out before it could be completed. In December of 1923 the company was forced to close.
One final attempt was made in 1924 to revive the Birmingham as a new car to be called the Wright for the Canadian market. This plan fell apart quickly.
There were as many as 50 Birmingham vehicles built during the short life of the company. Records for the company are difficult to find so tracking cars has proven to be impossible. None of the cars are believed to exist today.
In March James B. Mansfield (a noted automotive engineer and president of Mansfield Steel Corporation, Mansfield Truck Company, and Detroit Trailer Company) had been hired as consulting engineer, and Charles A. Towne (who had served in both houses of the U.S. Congress and who had run for the vice-presidency of the United States with Williams Jennings Bryan) came aboard as counsel. Stock was selling like hotcakes. But Mayor Carlson soon fell victim to his political enemies. Already a defamatory article about the company had appeared in the stock market publication, U.S. Investor.

Initially it was thought this malicious piece of journalism could be turned to Birmingham's advantage. But in August 1922 the AP wire service buzzed with the news that a Federal grand jury in Washington had filed a presentment following a 10-month investigation by the U.S. Post Office. The charge was fraudulent use of the mails to sell more than $300,000 of worthless stock, and among the 18 Birmingham men named was Mayor Samuel Carlson. Newspapers not friendly to Carlson had a heyday.

During the next two months Birmingham assembled 26 cars and chassis to prove its viability. But a stock holders meeting in October ended in bedlam, with one local stock salesman stabbed to death. A Birmingham official smashed his way through a plate- glass window to escape. In June of 1923, the indictment against Birmingham officials was dismissed in court. But the exoneration came far too late for Birmingham Motors. A valiant attempt was made to generate favorable publicity with a Duesenberg-engined special-built Birmingham race car to compete in the 1923 Indianapolis 500, but the money ran out before it could be completed. In December mortgage foreclosure arrived. In 1924 there was an attempt to revive the Birmingham as a new car to be called the Wright for the Canadian market.

This plan fell apart quickly. As many as 50 Birminghams may have been built during the contentious short life of the company. None of the cars are believed to exist today.
Here is another interesting bit.............
Other cars made in Jamestown!
[SIZE=+0]The automobile changed forever the lifestyles of the American people. Technological advances throughout the 20th century made the 2-car(and 3 and 4-car) family commonplace and brought about social changes unanticipated and unimagined by automobile pioneers.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=+0]Jamestown entrepreneurs mad several bids to join the ranks of automobile manufacturing in its fledgling years. None was successful for many reasons. Six Duquesnes were assembled about 1905, but their parts were defective and the company failed. An unknown number of Darts were also assembled, and several other ventures were attempted, some producing one car, others apparently producing none. More successful was the Birmingham auto, with about 50 being built in the plant in nearby Falconer in 1922-23. The offices for the operation were located in the Humphrey House in Brooklyn Square, the industrial and commercial center of the city of Jamestown at that time. There are no known surviving examples of any of these attempts.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=+0]Although automobile manufacturing never became an industry in Jamestown, a number of companies have manufactured automobile parts for many years. Thus, Jamestown has been a part of an industry whose impact on our society has been enormous and whose total ramifications are still to be realized.[/SIZE]

 

As mentioned previously..........
The EXTINCT Duquense


1906 Duquense Tonneau
Duquesne Construction Co. Jamestown, NY
1903-1906

 

1907 Dragon, at a car show a long time ago, location not known. Owner was Emery Sanderson, and the car appears to be the same one now at the Boyertown Museum.

 

Frustrating when a pic won't translate. BUT, I went to ol' reliable, Royal Feltner's site, Early American Automobiles, and there was the same view I'd tried to show from the Boyertown Museum collection. This was the Dragon Model 4 of 1907. Here goes the college try!




And here's a different view of what is apparently the same
Dragon shown by Twin6. Heck, rare as Dragons are, all pix
may be the SAME car!

 

SQWI said: As mentioned previously..........
The EXTINCT Duquense


1906 Duquense Tonneau

SWI, this is an exquisite view! Looks as though THIS was one expensive car!!! Jamestown was an interesting site; so many auto attempts.

 

Some time back, we kicked around the Cutting (1909-1912) of Jackson, Michigan, with regard to if there might have been a connection between or among several companies of that era -- one leading to another, etc. In the end, I don't think enough hard info was available to draw many firm conclusions -- though there were some strong hints!

Jumping ahead, though, we found no pic of a Cutting car, and I ran onto this visual (seems to be an artist's rendering not pic) on Amesbury, MA, enthusiast Royal Feltner's site.

Though a good many of the other company names we examined made CYCLECARS, this Cutting pic does not say "cyclecar" to me. Add to that, the Cutting used a variety of 4-cylinder engines, most of considerable CID, even approaching 400. If you guys agree this is not a cyclecar, Ill be more disinclined to think there was a direct connection between Cutting and the others.

Among THOSE names were Continental cyclecar, Indiana Motor & Mfg. Co. Minneapolis, MN. (These were equipped with a air cooled T-head engine of 4 cylinder, BTW.) These, however, may well relate to the Continental made in Franklin, IN, by the Indiana Motor & Mfg. Co., 1910-1914.

The real orphans here seem still to be the Bull Moose and Baby Moose cyclecars of Minneapolis, made apparently only in 1914.


1910 Cutting tonneau, thanks to Royal Feltner of Amesbury, MA

 

Jimi previously plead: "The Birmingham stock and mail-fraud flap is described by Wiki as a "political scandal," apparently since the Birmingham president was also Jamestown's mayor. It would be interesting to know more about him (his name is not mentioned) and how the matter was settled. Did he go to the slammer like Sam Pandolfo? Get dragged before an SEC inquest like Tucker?

"Well, as you can see, ONE PIC can raise more questions than it answers!!! I hope others in HAMBland know how to fill in some of the blanks (help!). At any rate, not much money seems to have gotten raised, since only some 50 Birminghams were built. And the stated contention that none made it to modern times lands the Birmingham on our EXTINCT LIST (as SWI says, until somebody shows evidence of a survivor!)."


Apparently the B-Series so-called "California" Touring, featuring
what the company referred to as a "cape" top. I'd never heard the
term before, but just look at the top style on Margaret's
Birmingham.




Jimi adds: SWI, man! This is all great background! Heck, who would have guessed all the behind-the-scenes turmoil at Birmingham? Almost as scandalous as the Sheridan back-story, eh?

Eye-opening citations: "Jamestown, New York, had been selected as the factory site. The mayor of Jamestown, Samuel A. Carlson, agreed to serve as president of Birmingham Motors Corporation, accepting no salary for the position. Because he believed Birmingham would do for Jamestown what Franklin had done for Syracuse (and even, grandiosely, what Ford had done for Detroit), Carlson asked only for out-of-pocket expenses for promoting this new industry for his community."

"Mayor Carlson soon fell victim to his political enemies"

"In August 1922 the AP wire service buzzed with the news that a Federal grand jury in Washington had filed a presentment following a 10-month investigation by the U.S. Post Office. The charge was fraudulent use of the mails to sell more than $300,000 of worthless stock. 18 Birmingham men were named in the named action including Mayor Samuel Carlson. Newspapers that were not friendly to Carlson had a field day with these charges.
Production continued and during the next two months Birmingham assembled 26 cars. But a stockholders meeting in October ended in bedlam, with one local stock salesman stabbed to death. In June of 1923, the indictment against Birmingham officials was dismissed in court but the damage was done."

"As many as 50 Birminghams may have been built during the contentious short life of the company. None of the cars are believed to exist today."

Jimi: This is some pretty heavy shit. Mayor Carlson's enemies must have really despised him. And, I'll bet they got away without a scratch, though they ruined a car company and TRIED to ruin a man and his partners!

 

Hmmm, my apologies guys. I thought I was posting my Stutz to the pre-war picture thread. I need to learn how to use a computer one of these days.

 

Hey there, AJ. I don't see any problem. We've posted a lot of unique vehicles. Now, this sounds like a car that was right "in the family."

 

Man, this has to be rare, if not extinct: The Mason, made from 1906 to 1910. Edward Mason founded the company in Des Moines and engaged the young auto phenoms Fred & August Duesenberg to design his cars. The first models were two-cylinders, opposed. By the end of the Mason run, though, the make was known for fuel economy (a claimed 26 mpg), coupled with hill-climbing powers -- once one of THE top promotional selling points for autos.

Speaking of promotional stunts, a Mason climbed the 40-percent grade of the Iowa State Capitol. The postcard pic below shows a '10 Mason subsequently pulling a 50-percent grade at the Iowa State Fair.

The Mason was succeeded by the Maytag -- designed by Fred D. -- running all the way through 1915. It was made by the Maytag-Mason Co. of Waterloo, IA. Both the Mason and Maytag were popular cars in their time, but they are quite scarce today! Anyone with a photo (or knowledge of) a SURVIVING specimen, please submit it for display on this thread!!! Thanks!



The images above and below are with sincere THANKS to American-Automobiles.com!

 

That was easy:





<TABLE border=0 cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width=1100 height=2902 cool gridx="16" gridy="16" showgridx showgridy usegridx usegridy><TBODY><TR height=43><TD height=43 vAlign=top width=768 colSpan=6 content xpos="3" csheight="32">

[FONT=Helvetica, Geneva, Arial, SunSans-Regular, sans-serif]George Hess is a Maytag-Mason expert[/FONT]

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</TD><TD height=43 width=1><SPACER width="1" height="43" type="block"></TD></TR><TR height=799><TD height=799 width=5 colSpan=2></TD><TD height=799 vAlign=top width=774 colSpan=6 content xpos="5" csheight="783">On the road, George Hess gets a wave from almost every car when he&#8217;s driving his 1910 Maytag-Mason. It is so unusual to see a car of this vintage, much less see one rolling down the road under its own power, that people can&#8217;t help but respond.
The Maytag-Mason is a fairly obscure car. The first Mason was designed and built in Des Moines in 1905 by Fred and August Duesenberg. Their car has a two-cylinder, 200-cubic-inch engine mounted under the seat. It produces between 24 and 28 horsepower. Fred L. Maytag invested in the company in 1909 and moved the factory to Waterloo in 1910. Maytag soon sold his interest in the company and by 1912 the name reverted back to Mason Motor Co. The company went bankrupt in 1915 and was totally out of business by 1917. Approximately 1,500 cars were built, but only about 20 of them exist today. One is in the Everest Kansas Historical Society.
</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

 

So, Maytag washed his hands of the business??? LOL

 

Seriously, though, good work, SWI. If there are some 15 Masons & Maytags surviving, then, they'd go on our ultra-rare list, rather than the extinct or near-extinct list.

It's been fun (though time-consuming!) to explore what autos fall into which categories, hasn't it? SOOOO many early ones either don't appear on the lists at all, OR no info or pix are available.

Some of the "regional" makes have been like that. And some others that were in business for some years have few, if any, survivors at all (Luverne, Spaulding, the '06 Heine-Velox and Geronimo spring to mind).

It's been edifying AND fun, getting to know these nearly-forgotten makes better, don't you think?

 

Maybe a case in point, here's a 1910 Hunt from Royal Feltner's site.
He believes it to be the only one. The Hunt was said to be built by
the Hunt brothers in National City, CA. Incidentally, the Hunter of
1920 and the Huntington of 1907 appear on few, if any oldies lists.

 

Here's one likely to be the only example in existence: 1908 Frayer Miller, that once belonged to Bill Harrah. Manufactured in Ohio.

 

As for Extinct.........and Maytag-Mason
Are there any of the Maytag "Trucks" left?

<BIG><BIG><BIG>Maytag Trucks</BIG></BIG></BIG>

Model "10"


Model "11"



Model "12" Two In One

Model "12" Two In One
Pleasure or Bussiness available in one or the other model or with kit to convert back an forth between the two.

Text Taken From Maytag Add
Two cylinder opposed five inch bore, five inch stroke. Actual 25 brake horse power, cylinders, pistons, crank shafts, cam shafts, etc., ground to a limit that insures absolutely accurate bearings. The crank shaft is drop forged from 30-40 point carbon steel, supported in two long, die cast Parson's white brass bearings. Connecting rod bearings are of the same material, hand scraped, assuring perfect fit. Splitdorf magneto is mounted on top of crank case, and gear driven. Water pump is located on end of crank shaft, thus doing away with one set of gears.


Intake Manifold is cast integral with cylinders and crank case, which stops all chance of leaks, pockets, etc., between carburetor and intake valves. This also assures uniform temperature of the mixture in all conditions. Two cylinder motors are economically operated require less gasoline and lubricating oil than the four cylinder-and the assembly as a whole is less complex.

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