Technical Official" 4 speed, performance clutch and bell housing thread''

Mods please delete this if I am off my rocker.

I have searched high and low for information on actual internal and external modifications to Muncie, T-10, Super T-10, Sag ect. for street strip use. With the HAMB's massive knowledge base from racing and street use in years past, I think that starting a tech thread on the subject is in order. I am a 4 speed nut and would like to aid in this as much as I can but, as a younger guy, I would probably be a freshman on the subject.

I recently built the coupe in my avatar as a severe street, performance minded hot rod. growing up in drag racing, I wanted to cross the line into crazy fast just a little while still having some street manners. The idea was to use old school parts to create as killer of a combo as I could and go beat up on new Mustangs and such, just like you guys did in the hay days of street wars. The only problem, as I am finding out, is that these old crash boxes need some modifications to make that happen. It is an art form in its self and I KNOW that this forums members have more knowledge about them than any other.

So when starting out on this journey, I was really lost when it came to 4 speed info on the web. Sure there were many searches that pointed out ID, shifters, basic info and all that I did find was greatly helpful and appreciated. But as far as an actual organized thread dedicated to the subject, I came up short.

So what do you guys think? Can we cram all of that knowledge into a thread? I (and I'm sure many more) would be pumped to learn about all of the tricks, parts, sources, costs, ID's, ratios, shifters, modifications ect. to any piece of the definitive hot rod trans.

 

You guys must be sleepin. This would be a great thread.

 

If you are talking about Muncie four speeds there is a new book out written by Paul Cangialosi it's available on amazon. Loads of good info in it.

 

Boom. That right there is good information. We should also list any literature anyone knows of. The thread should cover all of these "like" transmissions. Lets get it rolling.

Thank you kasselyn29

 

blatant self promoting post here...
I've got a 1967 Muncie M-20 wide ratio and a 1963 Borg Warner T-10 close ratio trans that can be pried from my grasp $$$

 

Larry, that is great info! Wish i could buy them both! Good luck with the sale.


Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!

 

On board here.

 

Well Hackman I'm pretty sure there was articles in HRM but damn site never lets me search...Here is first level...Grind every other syncro tooth off 2nd gear and every other tooth about 1/4" down the slider side that would engage 2nd gear and remove all the teeth from the brass syncro ring for second gear..Do the same for 3rd and 4th gears , sliders and syncro rings...Keeping the brass syncro rings allows some slow speed shifting like on the street but full no interference with speed of gear change at the strip leave the brass out but not sure how to keep the slider detents, works great in a Ford top loader as detents are in the fork rails too..Will have to shift fast all the time otherwise it burrs the teeth [from grinding] up and either binds the slider and/or wears the teeth out...Next step, not street friendly unless you can master double clutching is "face plating and Dog rings"..Check Liberty gear as I think they still make these items, at least for T5's but you will get the idea..

 

Awesome info right there! I have heard about the synchronizer modification as well. That is an old school trick and is very cool to learn more about. Keep it going guys. This could be a very helpful thread to many.


Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!

 

Someday down the road I plan to attach a T-10 to my 354 HEMI to have a time perfect 1962 build. Bob

 

I hate to say it, but I will.. I probably threw out at least five whole T10s and maybe another five in dissasembled parts back in 89' when I moved...Couldn't find anyone to take them..All Ford based..

 

That hurts me. Deep inside.

I fight tooth and nail for them around here. No one builds stick cars anymore it seems. I have been trying to buy them up as much as possible.


Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!

 

I recently picked up an early 70's M21. It's going to go into my 56 Pontiac. Hopefully I'll have no further need for this thread but now it will be easier to find if I do.

 

I think I'll get a copy of that book.
-Pat

 

sorry.....but what Fontana said - everyone seems to be talking 5 or 6 speeds.....
in my stock/cars.....T10's - Stude/GM/Ford, 833's including 833OD's and TOD'S....out of early top loaders/cars at the moment......will see if I can dig some books out but what's been mentioned would most likely be in them...

 

Stillrunners, that would be awesome! This is the kind of info im talking about. Anything will be super useful to the thread.


Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!

 

Bumpin for the day crowd.


Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!

 

There are quite a few super muncie cases out there now I dont know if they are all made by the same company or not, and iorn midplates is suppose to be a huge improvment for muncis, also some really good gear sets Italian company I think Maserio? suppose to be bullet proof but saying that there are quite a few diff gear sets and manufactures out there now. Can we modify the title to include clutch tech and which ones will actually support over 500hp
reliably?

 

That is a great idea! Thank you for the info. Going to be a super helpful thread.


Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!

 

How about that title? Does that cover it?

 

Okay, Im in. I need help too. I have a mid 60s Biscayne that is being upgraded from smallblock/Saginaw 3 speed to 496BBC/M22 this winter. I have the M22 now. It is a stock build, no Super Case or other mods. I am already paranoid about hurting it behind a big BBC. My understanding is the M22 was actually built as a road racing trans, not for drag racing and hooking up. Thats how you snap the ears of them. I know they ran one in Two Lane Blacktop, but hey, that was a movie. I also need a good clutch setup. Centerforce maybe or old school ? I do have a Lakewood sheild which will be installed. I want to keep my toes...

 

I am running the fairly expensive ($430.00 ) centerforce dual friction behind my blown small block and it is allready not a happy camper! I am afraid I am going to have to step up to the dual disc? What are you guys running? I am afraid the old school clutch setups are just not going to do what we are wanting (survive on the steets and track with mild to severe abuse) and nice street characteristics to boot.
Andy

 

I recently built a 49 Chev pickup for a customer thats a little non trad for the HAMB. The truck is outfitted with a 600 hp pump gas 427 Dart small block. The trans is a tko 5 speed and I went with a Hays single disk clutch and a billet flywheel combo. They rated it to 600 horses and I have heard good things about them. A local fellow drag racer is running the same combo with good results in a big inch Olds 442. That car stands on end.


Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!

 

My coupe has a billet Hays flywheel and a solid hub stock car disk from speedway. The pressure plate is also a stock car diaphragm unit from speedway. I will say I am impressed with how it works aside from it wanting to be in or out. But you kind of figure it out quick. I would run it in another car too. Good bang for the buck.


Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!

 

That's ok, I'm sure a nice numbers matching one will turn up when I'm out of money. Bob

 

Good thread idea. Not directly relating to my plans for Celica 5 sp behind 138" inline six. Should be a very interesting thread.

 

Did you brake in the clutch ?

 

Hey, If one wishes to tear down a muncie to check it out and replace the gaskets. Are there any special tools that are needed, or tools that make the job a whole lot easier?
-Pat

 

Subscribed


Dustin

 

Im in . How about expanding this thread to show clutch linkage pics on your hotrods. I'm building a 32 and would like to see some ideas.Thanks