Register now to get rid of these ads!

Technical Flathead ford V8 engine colors ?

Discussion in 'Traditional Hot Rods' started by quickgene, Aug 25, 2009.

  1. quickgene
    Joined: Aug 7, 2009
    Posts: 141

    quickgene
    Member
    from duluth mn

    I'm putting a 49 Merc engine in my 34 Ford fenderless & hoodless 5 window coupe. I don't like the looks of the newer 49 Merc engine lighter green color. I was thinking of painting the engine the older 34 engine dark green color. I've searched for info on these two shades of green. Not much info on the older color. Does anyone know what years Ford ran the dark green ? What color is it ? I looked at Rust-oleum, Hammered 721502 dark hunter green or Protective enamal 7733502 gloss dark hunter green. Any thoughts ? I would like to do the wheels & some body flames with the same color. I want a nice darker green that I have seen on some old 20s or 30s Ford engines. Gene:rolleyes:
     
  2. Coupe-De-CAB
    Joined: Sep 30, 2004
    Posts: 2,098

    Coupe-De-CAB
    Member
    from Nor Cal

    "Does anyone know what years Ford ran the dark green ? "


    General Information
    The integral cast-in bell housing continued all the way through 1948 (except for the Ford trucks, which received in 1948 the newer '49-53 style engine with separate bell housing). All engines during this period had front, block-mounted water pumps (with wide belt pulleys), and twenty-four stud heads with center-located water hose outlets. Original cylinder heads for 1938 to 1942 were generally marked with "81A" for Ford or Mercury engines thru 1941; "81T" for truck engines from 1938 to 1942; "41T" heads were sold for 85/90hp trucks built from 1938 to 1942; "99T" for 100hp Ford Truck and Mercury in 1939 to 1941; and "29A" for Mercury in 1942. Heads marked "59-A" or "59AB" were used on all 90/100 hp (Ford & Mercury) engines from 1946 through 1948. The 59AB heads were sometimes used on earlier blocks in replacement rebuilds. You can find the Ford part numbers (basic 6049 and 6050 number with prefixes and suffixes) in the face of the heads and sometimes on the side edge of the head next to the intake manifold.

    The postwar cylinder blocks were also marked "59" (or "59A" or "59L" or "59X" or "59Y" or "59Z") with raised letters cast into the top of the bell housing part of the block. The Canadian version had a "C59" cast into the same area. Another block assembly (the "41A" style) was used to replace the "81A" style cylinder blocks, which were all the 85/90hp engines with 3.0625" bore. The 1938 to 1940 blocks had four small "freeze plugs" (2 each side) in the oil pan mounting surface. The 1941 (except for a short carryover) and later blocks did not have the freeze plugs. These can be noted from outside an assembled engine by the slight "bumps" in the side of the block casting, right at the oil pan mounting surface. In mid 1938 Ford modified the engine for larger diameter main bearings. For complete crankshaft bearing specs CLICK HERE. The original engines from mid 1941 to final 1942 production (when WWII ended auto production) had a raised intake manifold deck surface. Prior to these engines, the entire manifold deck surface was machined flat, right out to the edge of the cylinder deck. The postwar engines seem to have returned to the practice of machining the intake deck all flat again. The foundry would also place what were probably "lot" or "production" numbers in the castings on all blocks. These were usually a small group of letters and numbers cast on the top of the bell housing....right next to the vertical surface of the back of the block. Unfortunately, any records of these numbers are long gone and they provide no clues as to the particulars of any engines.

    Water jacket holes in the top of the cylinder area of the block will tell you what years the block may be:

    1938 Blocks: Large triangular shaped holes between the center cylinder bores
    1939-42 Blocks: Three openings between the center cylinder bores: top one is triangular;
    center and bottom holes are trapazoidal (or keystone) shaped.
    1945-48 Blocks: The three center openings: top one is triangular;
    center and bottom holes are large round holes.



    All 24 stud engines using cast iron heads were equipped with dome-top pistons (in either aluminum or steel). Engines built through 1939 had a pressed-on timing gear on the camshaft. Beginning in 1940 this gear was bolted on to the camshaft. All engines up through 1948 had "mushroom" style valve stem ends and split valve guides. Some engines (including 59A style) had removable hardened valve seat inserts. It's not uncommon for an early (pre 1946) engine to have the valve seats installed by an engine rebuilder at some point in its life.

    As for original paint colors, the Ford and Mercury engines through 1940 were a dark green. Ford cars continued the color until 1942. Mercury engine had a dark blue color from 1941 thru 1948. Postwar Ford engines were dark blue thru 1948. Ford truck engines were generally the same as Ford cars during the years of this group.


    Hope this info helps a bit about the color of the engines for the year your going for:)
    cheers,
    cab
     
  3. quickgene
    Joined: Aug 7, 2009
    Posts: 141

    quickgene
    Member
    from duluth mn

    I like the pre 1940 green color. Does anyone know what that color is. All I can find is pics of old engines & a descrition of dark green. A name of a company that makes it, part # or maybe a color chart sample. Any help ? Thanks Gene:confused:
     
  4. blown49
    Joined: Jul 25, 2004
    Posts: 2,213

    blown49
    Member Emeritus

    Excellent post Cab

    Jim
     
    Register now to get rid of these ads!

  5. quickgene
    Joined: Aug 7, 2009
    Posts: 141

    quickgene
    Member
    from duluth mn

    Thanks cab for your input. I know what year my engine is if it doesn't turn out to be a bad block. I just haven't been able to find out how to get the pre 40 dark green paint. Thanks again Gene
     
  6. GreenMonster48
    Joined: Oct 4, 2007
    Posts: 1,340

    GreenMonster48
    Member

    Gene, I think I remember Eastwood Company carrying that color?
     
  7. pinstripebob
    Joined: Dec 2, 2007
    Posts: 118

    pinstripebob
    Member
    from Carmel, IN

  8. Ralph Moore
    Joined: May 1, 2007
    Posts: 409

    Ralph Moore
    Member

    I found a 500 degree engine paint at NAPA that closly resembles the early Ford green. I'll see if I can dig up the can when I get home and send a picture of the flattie painted that color.
     
  9. quickgene
    Joined: Aug 7, 2009
    Posts: 141

    quickgene
    Member
    from duluth mn

    Wow that is some great info. All you hambers are great ! Gene:D
     
  10. Ralph Moore
    Joined: May 1, 2007
    Posts: 409

    Ralph Moore
    Member

    I could not find the can, but here's the color on my 59AB.
     

    Attached Files:

  11. wideglide74
    Joined: Jul 1, 2002
    Posts: 1,722

    wideglide74
    Member

    This green came from the local "Old Car Centre", it's called "Early Ford Engine Green" or something like that and comes in a rattle can. Jason...
     

    Attached Files:

  12. Flathead 34
    Joined: Jun 5, 2006
    Posts: 170

    Flathead 34
    Member

    I agree with Pinstripebob I have used the early Ford green from Bill Hirch. It is great paint. It cost a little more. You can either brush it on or spray it. The nice thing about it, it does not leave brush marks. It has alot of pigment in it and it covers the cast iron really well. Give it a try, you will be glad you did. The color is right on the money. I have it on my orginial 34 roadster motor and will use it on my 50 blown mercury in my 34 3 window.
     
  13. mctim64
    Joined: Dec 4, 2008
    Posts: 5,625

    mctim64
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    This one here is "Antique Ford Green" from Pioneer, I think it has a nice look to it. ;)

    [​IMG]
     
  14. havi
    Joined: Dec 30, 2008
    Posts: 1,869

    havi
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    [​IMG]
    Here's a cool one with the dark green.
     
  15. Slick Willy
    Joined: Aug 3, 2008
    Posts: 2,951

    Slick Willy
    Member

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    Model A Ford Green
    part number M-200
    from Snyder's
    I used just over one can for the entire engine and it worked great. The motor is a '37 and i believe that is "color correct".
     
  16. 1950Effie
    Joined: Sep 30, 2006
    Posts: 798

    1950Effie
    Member
    from no where

    This might help you. I have this information saved for future builds. For exact color formulas or modern equivelants. I would contact the Early Ford V9 Club. Good resource.


    Engine Colors:
    Ford engines were generally dark blue in 1949 and changed to bronze in late '49 production through 1951. For 1952 and 1953 the Ford engine was either tangerine red or green. The Ford truck engines were red from 1948 through 1951, and then changed to green for 1952-53.
    Mercury engines were green in color from 1949 through 1951. From 1952 to 1953 they were either green or tangerine

    <TABLE border=8 cellSpacing=10 cellPadding=9 bgColor=#ffffff><TBODY><TR><TD bgColor=#ffffff>YEAR
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>FORD
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>MERCURY
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>TRUCKS
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>COMMERCIAL
    </TD></TR><TR><TD bgColor=#ffffff>1932
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Green
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>N/A
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Green
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Green
    </TD></TR><TR><TD bgColor=#ffffff>1933
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Green
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>N/A
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Green
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Green
    </TD></TR><TR><TD bgColor=#ffffff>1934
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Green
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>N/A
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Green
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Green
    </TD></TR><TR><TD bgColor=#ffffff>1935
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Green
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>N/A
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Green
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Green
    </TD></TR><TR><TD bgColor=#ffffff>1936
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Green
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>N/A
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Green
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Green
    </TD></TR><TR><TD bgColor=#ffffff>1937
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Green
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>N/A
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Green
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Green
    </TD></TR><TR><TD bgColor=#ffffff>1938
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Green
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>N/A
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Green
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Green
    </TD></TR><TR><TD bgColor=#ffffff>1939
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Green
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Green
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Green
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Green
    </TD></TR><TR><TD bgColor=#ffffff>1940
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Green
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Green
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Green
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Green
    </TD></TR><TR><TD bgColor=#ffffff>1941
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Green or Dark Blue
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Blue
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Green
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Blue
    </TD></TR><TR><TD bgColor=#ffffff>1942
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Green
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Blue
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Green or Dark Blue
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Blue
    </TD></TR><TR><TD bgColor=#ffffff>1943
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>? ? ? ?
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>? ? ? ?
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>? ? ? ?
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>? ? ? ?
    </TD></TR><TR><TD bgColor=#ffffff>1944
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>? ? ? ?
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>? ? ? ?
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>? ? ? ?
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>? ? ? ?
    </TD></TR><TR><TD bgColor=#ffffff>1945
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>? ? ? ?
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>? ? ? ?
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>? ? ? ?
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>? ? ? ?
    </TD></TR><TR><TD bgColor=#ffffff>1946
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Blue
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Blue
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Blue
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Blue
    </TD></TR><TR><TD bgColor=#ffffff>1947
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Blue
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Blue
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Blue
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Blue
    </TD></TR><TR><TD bgColor=#ffffff>1948
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Blue
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Blue
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Blue
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Deep Red
    </TD></TR><TR><TD bgColor=#ffffff>1949
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Blue
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Green
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Dark Blue or Green
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Deep Red
    </TD></TR><TR><TD bgColor=#ffffff>1949 1/2
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Bronze
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Green
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Bronze or Green
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Deep red
    </TD></TR><TR><TD bgColor=#ffffff>1950
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Bronze
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Green
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Bronze or Green
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Deep Red
    </TD></TR><TR><TD bgColor=#ffffff>1951
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Bronze
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Green
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Bronze or Green
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Deep Red
    </TD></TR><TR><TD bgColor=#ffffff>1952
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Tangerine or Green*
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Tangerine or Green*
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Green*
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Green*
    </TD></TR><TR><TD bgColor=#ffffff>1953
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Tangerine or Green*
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Tangerine or Green*
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Green*
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Green*
    </TD></TR><TR><TD bgColor=#ffffff>1954
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Green*
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Green*
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Green*
    </TD><TD bgColor=#ffffff>Green*

    </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>​
     
  17. quickgene
    Joined: Aug 7, 2009
    Posts: 141

    quickgene
    Member
    from duluth mn

    I like the looks of Ralphs engine color for mine. I'll check with NAPA. I have to go get some brake lines there tomorrow. I couldn't find a pioneer site. Only stereo stuff. The pics are very helpfull to figure out what works on my paint scheem. I figure on edging some body flames with a simular color. I checked out some rust-olem dark green today. It looks close to what I want to paint some body parts. Thanks;)
     
  18. 8flat
    Joined: Apr 2, 2006
    Posts: 1,316

    8flat
    Member

    1950Effie: THANK YOU! You've vindicated me. I've had arguments with people about the 8ba in my '51 truck, many people don't believe that Ford painted them red.
     
  19. quickgene
    Joined: Aug 7, 2009
    Posts: 141

    quickgene
    Member
    from duluth mn

    Lots of different shades. Seems as though whatever I choose it will be hard to argue if it's period correct. Gene
     
  20. 1950Effie
    Joined: Sep 30, 2006
    Posts: 798

    1950Effie
    Member
    from no where

    8flat...Your on the ball man! Glad I could help out.
    My '50 8BA in my F1 is all the way Ford engine red. VHT and Krylon, Hirsch as well. There all dead on with the correct color. There was a little change in some regards to the commercial vs truck applications. The truck meant HD applications and the commercial meant PU's. Not sure why just that away. Infact some of the truck application got painted the commercial colors and visa versa. This has been a point of discussion in the V8 Club for a while.
     

    Attached Files:

    • 055.jpg
      055.jpg
      File size:
      512.4 KB
      Views:
      433
    • 056.jpg
      056.jpg
      File size:
      505.2 KB
      Views:
      464
    Last edited: Aug 26, 2009
  21. GreenMonster48
    Joined: Oct 4, 2007
    Posts: 1,340

    GreenMonster48
    Member

    I thought that the bronze colored flatheads were Ford replacement blocks and not regular production motors?
     
  22. quickgene
    Joined: Aug 7, 2009
    Posts: 141

    quickgene
    Member
    from duluth mn

    It would be nice to see a pics of the other colors, a bronze or tangerine engine. Or maybe some of the other colors. The 49 Merc engine I was after has a bad cracked block. The fellow said he has a couple more Merc blocks that he sold the cranks out of. He's checking them out. He uses a air pressure test then a visual inside looksee. I'm not sure if I'll end up with a Merc, Ford or a Ford with the Merc crank. Gene:eek:
     
  23. quickgene
    Joined: Aug 7, 2009
    Posts: 141

    quickgene
    Member
    from duluth mn

    <TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD noWrap align=right width="100%">Now watching in My eBay (156 items)[​IMG]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
    You&#8217;re the first person to watch this item. Don&#8217;t let it get away!
    44 items can still be added to your watch list.

    Save this seller|Track your items in My eBay





    <TABLE id=vi-tTbl cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 border=0><TBODY><TR><TD id=vi-tTblC1><TABLE class="r3 c gy-br" cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0><THEAD class=""><TR><TD class=r3_t></TD></TR></THEAD><TBODY><TR><TD class=r3_c><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD colSpan=2>Ford Dark Green High Temp Ceramic Engine Paint Qt




    </TD></TR><TR><TD class=ipics-cell><FORM name=ssFrm action=http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?VISuperSize&item=230363232728 method=post target=ssFrmWin><INPUT type=hidden value=1 name=ssr><INPUT type=hidden value=0#http://images.channeladvisor.com/Sell/SSProfiles/53000068/Images/27#51624_Thumb.jpg#51624_Thumb.jpg name=iurls><INPUT type=hidden value=0 name=dtid><INPUT type=hidden value=1 name=vs><INPUT type=hidden value=1 name=sh><INPUT type=hidden value="Ford Dark Green High Temp Ceramic Engine Paint Qt" name=title></FORM><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=vs_w-a><CENTER>[​IMG]</CENTER>

    </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

    </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

    </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
    </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
     
  24. quickgene
    Joined: Aug 7, 2009
    Posts: 141

    quickgene
    Member
    from duluth mn

    This is my 34. It was a stock car in the 50s. The guy I got it from painted it to look like has dads 50s era stock car. I want to set it up to drive on the street. The engine in it 47-48 ford has badly rusted cylinders. Other than that looks like 40 ford running gear. Gene<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=2><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=middle><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width=502><TBODY><TR><TD align=middle width="100%">[​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD><TD width=20 rowSpan=2>[​IMG]</TD><TD vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=5><TBODY><TR><TD align=middle>[​IMG]</TD><TD align=middle>[​IMG]</TD></TR><TR><TD align=middle>[​IMG]</TD><TD align=middle>[​IMG]</TD></TR><TR><TD align=middle>[​IMG]</TD><TD align=middle>[​IMG]</TD></TR><TR><TD align=middle>[​IMG]</TD><TD align=middle>[​IMG]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
     
  25. quickgene
    Joined: Aug 7, 2009
    Posts: 141

    quickgene
    Member
    from duluth mn

  26. GreenMonster48
    Joined: Oct 4, 2007
    Posts: 1,340

    GreenMonster48
    Member

    I love that coupe, Gene!
     
  27. quickgene
    Joined: Aug 7, 2009
    Posts: 141

    quickgene
    Member
    from duluth mn

    It makes me ill to think of all the cool oldes that were destroyed having fun. But I guess I'm guilty myself. My brothers & I hauled alot of cars to the scrap crusher. Wish I had them back now. But they're gone forever.:(
     
  28. Ralph Moore
    Joined: May 1, 2007
    Posts: 409

    Ralph Moore
    Member

    Found the number for the NAPA green, it's a DE 1644 Racing Green engine paint.
    Hope that helps.
     
  29. havi
    Joined: Dec 30, 2008
    Posts: 1,869

    havi
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

  30. quickgene
    Joined: Aug 7, 2009
    Posts: 141

    quickgene
    Member
    from duluth mn

    Back to Napa today for brake parts for the old pickup. I'll check on 1644 thanks.
    I see on another Ford site they list the paint code for 1934 Ford Engine/transmission Green TCP4013. They don't show that color. Gene
     

Share This Page

Register now to get rid of these ads!

Archive

Copyright © 1995-2013 The Jalopy Journal: Steal our stuff, we'll kick your teeth in. Terms of Service. Privacy Policy.

Atomic Industry
Forum software by XenForo™ ©2010-2014 XenForo Ltd.