Spalding Grant Flamethrower - Hemi Mounting

Okay! YES! I know there are lots of threads on Spalding Grant Flamethrower ignitions. But I wanted to put the idea out there about CONVERTING them from one make to another a little easier. (hope I'm not stepping on anyone's toes who already does this or something)

Does anyone happen to have a Spalding Grant Flamethrower intended for an early Mopar application (331/354, 392, or even LA style) apart or would be willing to share some photos, maybe even some dimensions of the base assembly and construction?

Would be cool to make up some drawings for the base unit to machine the correct base to swap out on a Ford, SBC, Pontiac, or whatever to make any body usable on an Early Hemi or even a later Poly, or whatever.

Anyone out there want to share?

 

I have done this quite a few times , will load some pics from work tomorrow.

 

Hers a example of a Mallory (chevrolet) to Caddy 331. The "butt" is made out of billett and then press fitted to the mallory.
In this case the mallory shaft was used as the caddy is flat at oil pump drive so no shaft change was needed.

Nice unit, i acid dip with (purple power) the entire aluminum housing to make them all one color and clear coat , looks orginal . This pic is pre dip...

Orginal drive gear is used...

 

Heres another , this one is pretty cool as they never made a Flamethrower for the flathead.
This is a machine and run as the chevrolet had enough meat to trim down and shorten.

 

That is seriously cool, Jim! Thanks for adding the pictures!

So essentially you're actually using the base stem and mounting flange, cutting the stem, and pressing in a newly made "billet" piece appropriate for the application. Right?

Are the internal drive shafts all one piece that Spalding would have made per application, or is there a standard drive shaft for the unit with a coupled lower drive shaft to fit each application?

 

Actually there is a couple ways to do the shaft ( depending on how hard the lower end is to make ie: oil pump drive etc)

One would be to just use the Spaulding shaft and cut off to fit new design distributor.

The other is to cut old donor shaft in two and splice ( using a press fit and roll pin) the spaulding top shaft to other lower unit.

The Spaulding is a .490 shaft ( like the chevrolets and many others in the market) pretty standard.....

 

Actually there is a couple ways to do the shaft ( depending on how hard the lower end is to make ie: oil pump drive etc)

One would be to just use the Spaulding shaft and cut off to fit new design distributor.

The other is to cut old donor shaft in two and splice ( using a press fit and roll pin) the spaulding top shaft to other lower unit.

The Spaulding is a .490 shaft ( like the chevrolets and many others in the market) pretty standard.....

 

I would like to see a definitive "Hemi" shaft length chart. Using a pics like this one .
This one is a 392 hemi shaft for a Flamethrower ....at 4.5 inches...

 

OH! So the shaft simply goes to that drive plate with the indexing pins. Very interesting. Not what I expected at all!

And I would ALSO like to see a nice little chart showing shaft and base mounting dimensions for each breed of Hemi and Mopar distributor.

 

Someone...maybe Tommy?...posted some length info awhile back from an old Mallory? catalogue...or was it an old Honest Charlie catalogue? The only noted difference was a very slight variance for one of the DeSotos. (Typically, we group them as 241-260-270; 392; and everything else.)

Hopefully, 'someone' will see this thread.

.

 

http://www.hotrodreference.com/1310/mopar-distributor-identification-by-shaft-length/

 

Interesting to see the inside of a Grant/Spalding Dizzy, I have one for a Mopar Low Deck Engine (B) that I've wanted to put into a 440 which is a tall deck (RB) block.

Looks like might be able to simply modify a stock 440 one or fabricate a new drive shaft and mount.

I love the idea of two Chrysler OE electronic ignition pickups in a Flamethrower powering two GM HEI modules. All hidden tastefully out of sight, of course.

 

There's what we need!! Thanks!!

Here's the info outside the link to simplify things:
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Measured from mounting surface to end of distributor shaft.

Mopar LA engine – 3 7/8″

Mopar B engine – 3.5″

Mopar RB engine – 4″

Chrysler 331/354 Hemi – 4.25″

Chrysler 392 Hemi – 4.5″

Dodge 241/260/270 Hemi – 3 7/8″

Dodge 315/325 Hemi – 4.25″

Desoto 276/291 Hemi – 4.00″

Take care when swapping distributors as the rotation is not always the same. That information will be added as it becomes available.
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I believe Troy Ladd may have done this. Saw a picture somewhere. I think there was some discussion about this in another thread, maybe not being such a good idea.

 

I would only use that as a reference but double check before any cutting. I have a stock Marine 270 and a stock 241, they don't interchange because of length of shaft. Mating surfaces seem to be the same ?????????

 

If anyone finds any mistakes in the list above I will change it. Let me know! I don't want to confuse anyone and for that matter, if it's wrong it simply just needs to be fixed. The internet is a great place for info, good and bad.

 

A weak point with the flamethrowers is the rotor system.
It simply cant take high current as both the rotor and caps are open gaps . You dont want high secondary voltages as the caps and rotor will burn up.
Twin pertronixs would work and we have done a couple but primary ressitance ( ie : correct coils and resistances ) must be maintained.

The advantage of the flamethrower is the two four cylinder systems allowing a higher dwell providing good spark out put at higher rpm. They will run 10,000 rpm with no problem.....

 

After modifying the drive shaft for this; milling the flats, etc., are you sending this out to be rehardened or just doing it in-shop with Kasonite?

That whole base (including the original portion of the base) and the drive shaft with the plate, looks like it would be a fun machining project.

 

to get around this issue i use the factory shaft out of a chrysler distributor and attach the tip plate from the spaulding to the top and tig weld (only the top center area...

 

Yeah! That makes total sense!

 

Bumping this up... I got one!

However, I can't seem to figure out what it's for. Shaft from mounting seat to tip measures 3.375". That doesn't jive with anything on that list above!! What the hell do I have?? There is a sticker on the bottom that has four hand-written numbers; 9343. Is that anything worth noting?

 

Here's the same one (without shaft collar)and I can tell you what it doesn't fit, shaft won't reach to pump shaft on my 241 or my 270, haven't tried it on my Marine 270 ......................

 

Look inside...what direction does it spin? Your length is close to the B engine.

.

 

Changing the rotation is a bit more work and takes some parts. The distributor cam turns over and its marked. But the center hold down bolt is a different thread as well as the advance plate attached to it.
I am doing a couple now if anyone needs to see pics........

 

I'm pretty sure they actually did. Has an extra "nub" on the side of the distributor body (not the base) for a clamp. A couple have been on eBay in the past and sold for big $$$.

I probably have photos of them saved away somewhere on the home computer. Too disorganized to be able to find them, though.

 

Some Grant info from the 1963 Catalog. They never offered a unit for the flathead and the ones i have seen with the aluminum nub was put there by a very capable shop somewhere.

Note the Chrysler measurement chart for the shaft etc...

 

Ya just gotta love the old catalogues!!

.

 

I like that, at the bottom it says "If Your Shaft is Different, Say So"

Bubba, the bottom of the page is cut off, can you re post? Thanks

 

Ah! GREAT!! So I'm guessing it's SUPPOSED to be 3.5" shaft distance. Not sure why the big difference in mine.

Were the rotating assemblies all the same (shaft ect.) and then they just varied the base/butt design for the different applications? Did I already ask that??

 

So, it appears I have the Golden Commando distributor (361/383/400 B style) which is also a LEFT rotation. BOOO! So that means the rotation has to be reversed, vacuum pot flipped over for the advance (if that's possible) and then change the mounting height or the shaft length.

Uhg... (sigh)

 

To answer a couple questions on one post.

To determine rotation loosen center mounting bolt ( be carefull here as they make both directions) (hold drive gear in vice) if the bolt loosens ( comes out) by turning CW its CW rotation.....and vs versa.........

Direction may be changed by turning upper cam upside down and reinstalling , sometimes they are marked.
The center bolt and advance hold down must be changed, different thread on center bolt etc. Hold down could be heli coiled for new thread.

Advance weights must be removed and all pins carefully pressed out and reinstalled on the other side.....
These pins just press fit into weights.......

Heres a hemi lower end off the unit....