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Technical Winters quick change helical gear install

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Badrodder, Jun 23, 2014.

  1. Badrodder
    Joined: Aug 27, 2011
    Posts: 53

    Badrodder
    Member

    Winters QC Gears 007.JPG This is how to install the helical cut quiet gears in a V8 QC . You must check the end play from the shoulder of the gears with a straight edge across the housing with the gasket in place . It will be from 0.020 to 0.080 , order the correct shims from your supplier with the gears . You must not have too much gap as the gear will hit the bearings each time you accelerate otherwise . If you don't want the noise this is the way to go .. Ford11 002.JPG
     
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  2. Ulu
    Joined: Feb 26, 2014
    Posts: 1,767

    Ulu
    Member
    from CenCal

    Those are beautiful man.

    Anytime you set up a gear box that produces thrust (anything except straight cut spur gears) you need to keep the thrust washer clearances to the absolute minimum. If you don't it causes eccentric prying forces in the shafts and gear case.

    I once worked for a company that made small gearcases (not for cars) that had worm gears. If those things weren't set up nice and tight, they would literally wedge the gear case apart, just a bit, but causing misalignment and tons of friction. The boxes literally bound up and nearly quit working completely.
     
  3. thanks for posting guys.....
     
  4. And check the rear cover bearings every 15,000 miles, they have a life also.
     

  5. Badrodder
    Joined: Aug 27, 2011
    Posts: 53

    Badrodder
    Member

    According to the experts at Winters , quote " should last as long as your not drag racing with slicks " .
     
  6. They shouldn't claim anything that construes a warranty since street tires have incorporated traction technology!

    Twisted and snapped axles are the next concern with these technologies.

    I have concerns about the rear cover and bearings extra load and wondering if that should be redesigned.

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  7. Badrodder
    Joined: Aug 27, 2011
    Posts: 53

    Badrodder
    Member

    Someone with bearing knowledge might be able to come up with a part number for a thrust roller bearing that would fit the rear housing . I did a little research and ball bearings in place now can take some thrust as long as its not excessive , I think it was 15 % of the axial load . Only one thrust bearing would be required as one gear thrust aft and the other forward .
     
  8. What should the end play be after the shims are installed?
     
  9. Badrodder
    Joined: Aug 27, 2011
    Posts: 53

    Badrodder
    Member

    I was told 0.015 in. Max ,but you are limited by the thickness of the spacers Winters sells . They are on the winters site on the page with the helical gears . I think they come in 15,30 and 60 thou, you would have to double check though .


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  10. Badrodder
    Joined: Aug 27, 2011
    Posts: 53

    Badrodder
    Member

    What boxes ? Quick changes ?


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  11. Ned Ludd
    Joined: May 15, 2009
    Posts: 4,250

    Ned Ludd
    Member

    I seem to recall coming across some nice thrust needle bearings in the course of looking for something else. They'd be barely thicker than the thrust washer shown above. I can't remember where it was, though, but I'm fairly sure it was one of the major bearing manufacturers' website.
     
  12. pitman
    Joined: May 14, 2006
    Posts: 5,079

    pitman

    Agreed. 'Helicals' displace a portion of radial loads, into axial loads. You'll be quieter, but with new forces acting along-the-shaft. Speaking in general terms, (not QC's) there were some shouldered ball-bearing designs that could handle greater non-radial loads. Peak load, and consistant load, challenges to solve when space is limited.
     
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2014
  13. Mike VV
    Joined: Sep 28, 2010
    Posts: 2,394

    Mike VV
    Member
    from SoCal

    While this isn't bad advice...NOT ALL Quick Change axles...can be checked this way.
    The cover on my housing is flat across the back with the gear cavity in the cover...NOT the axle housing...

    The Heavy Duty Champianship (the one I have) or the newer Extremeliner housing need a bit more care in checking. Though mine still has it's straight cut gears.

    Mike
     
  14. The shouldered ball bearings are FAG Part Number 6304 Y . HB, also sold by Winters under part number 7532 - 01.
     
  15. Great info...!

    But I guess I'll stick to the noise and being a general nuisance to the neighborhood!
     
  16. Badrodder
    Joined: Aug 27, 2011
    Posts: 53

    Badrodder
    Member

    Will check them out..I really don't think helicals are too big a problem loading the cover bearings as the thrust loads aren't that great except as said before hard launches with big rubber , but I wouldn't mind having a set of thrust bearings on hand just in case they were ever needed on a longer trip . That said there is still a whine but you can actually have a conversation without raising your voice , when I take to the drags next well just stick the straight cuts in it for the runs .


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  17. Badrodder
    Joined: Aug 27, 2011
    Posts: 53

    Badrodder
    Member

    Just a quick update with my Helical Gears now with some mileage and lots of bursts of energy they are holding up fine with the stock bearings , no weird noises at all just a little whine as since installed ..
     
  18. racemad55
    Joined: Dec 14, 2005
    Posts: 1,149

    racemad55
    Member

    Same here with about 3000 mi. on my set.(frankland rear)
     
  19. ago
    Joined: Oct 12, 2005
    Posts: 2,199

    ago
    Member
    from pgh. pa.

    Same here with 14,000 miles
     
  20. Ebbsspeed
    Joined: Nov 11, 2005
    Posts: 5,534

    Ebbsspeed
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Do you install the shims on the non-thrust side of each gear (the side of the gear that bears the thrust in the forward transmission gears, as it would change in reverse)?
     
  21. Badrodder
    Joined: Aug 27, 2011
    Posts: 53

    Badrodder
    Member

    I installed shims on both shafts fwd of both gears to keep 0.010 gap .
     

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