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Hot Rods Who's put a Dodge Red Ram in a '28 Model A?

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by midroad, Nov 28, 2014.

  1. midroad
    Joined: Mar 8, 2013
    Posts: 290

    midroad
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    I need to know if it is possible to fit a Red Ram, 241 or 270, into a '28 model a Ford without cutting the firewall or moving the radiator forward too far.
    I have a flathead with a '39 trans now and want to keep the trans and use an adapter.
    I've searched the Hamb and can't find exactly what I'm looking for. Plenty of Hemi's in Model A's but all recessed firewalls
     
  2. D.N.D.
    Joined: Aug 15, 2012
    Posts: 1,385

    D.N.D.
    Member Emeritus

    Hi Mid

    I think that little hemi is a bit shorter than its big brother, so it just might slip right in

    Be interesting to see the info you get here on the HAMB

    G Don
     
  3. midroad
    Joined: Mar 8, 2013
    Posts: 290

    midroad
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    I've found overall length measurement on the net for most of the Hemis and the Red Ram is a couple of inches shorter, plus I think a SBC waterpump saves a bit as well.
     
  4. This (241 Red Ram)was in My T on an a frame before I got it.Has stock radiator and shell in original position. Will measure the length and report back. JW
    [​IMG]
     
    volvobrynk likes this.

  5. Radiator to firewall is 32 inches. JW
     
  6. desotot
    Joined: Jan 29, 2008
    Posts: 1,828

    desotot
    Member

    Here is a pic of my old 27 rpu with a desoto which has larger valve covers than a dodge but I don't know if the water pump setup is the same lenght as a dodge but I got it in between the firewall and rad which was in the stock position, however I did have to put a cup in the firewall to clear the distributor.

    [​IMG]
     
  7. midroad
    Joined: Mar 8, 2013
    Posts: 290

    midroad
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Thanks for your pictures. I should have given more info about my car. It has a stock A chassis, stock front cross member and a '32 style K member locating the '39 trans. The firewall is stock and the roadster body is in stock position. All measurements came from the Bishop Tardell Av8 book. Looking at those two T's it seems to fit OK, but I'd like to see pics of something like my Model A.
     
  8. Reds 29
    Joined: Jan 16, 2006
    Posts: 436

    Reds 29
    Member

    Overall length of the Red Ram Dodge motor is the same as a small block chevy, width is wider, weight is only a 15-20 lbs. more. Recessed firewalls are usually necessary with the chevy so it's probably go to need one for the Dodge. I just swapped a Red Ram for a SBC but it isn't in a Model A. It went into the same space.
     
  9. I believe the recessing of the firewall is on the 30-31 models. JW
     
  10. Andy
    Joined: Nov 17, 2002
    Posts: 4,669

    Andy
    Member

    PICT0347.JPG The Dodge is at least an inch shorter than a SBC. I have one in my 32 with stock firewall and radiator. They will fit anywhere a flathead will fit. The valve covers will keep you from running hood sides.
    I am running a stock water pump and a flat flex fan.
     
    Fly'n Kolors and Hotrodmyk like this.
  11. sunbeam
    Joined: Oct 22, 2010
    Posts: 5,085

    sunbeam
    Member

    The low deck Dodge is about 28.5 inches from the bellhousing flange to the front of the water pump stock or with a sbc long pump. It is 1 inch narrower than a sbc with exhaust manfolds.
     
  12. mt shasta steve
    Joined: Mar 26, 2010
    Posts: 270

    mt shasta steve
    Member

    I had a 241 Red Ram in my first hot rod in high school. As I remember the firewall was recessed . This is stretching my memory about 50 years!
     
  13. D.N.D.
    Joined: Aug 15, 2012
    Posts: 1,385

    D.N.D.
    Member Emeritus

    Hey Andy

    Those are pretty slick Rocker Covers you have on your mini hemi

    G Don
     
  14. ago
    Joined: Oct 12, 2005
    Posts: 2,199

    ago
    Member
    from pgh. pa.

    I believe the Red Ram is shorter than the SMC with Dodge water pump
     
  15. D2Denny
    Joined: Jan 17, 2012
    Posts: 54

    D2Denny
    Member

    Here is one in a 29 HiBoy roadster with 32 rails. However the 32 has about a 3" longer wheelbase. Mounted the engine about as far forward as possible with a little more than 1" fan to radiator clearance.. I just had to trim the floor board mounting flange to clear the bellhousing. I also used a SBC short waterpump to shorten the engine. If you need any measurements shout. DSCN1753.JPG DSCN1751.JPG DSCN1713.JPG
     
  16. midroad
    Joined: Mar 8, 2013
    Posts: 290

    midroad
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    I see nobody has posted here telling me they have done the swap how I wanted to do it. This tells me it probably isn't possible. I measured the engine bay and just going by the 28.5 inch Red Ram length it won't fit. I thought of a '32 chassis because it does have 3" more wheelbase which solves the problem. I should even be able to use a Chrysler hemi, 331, 354 or 392 , which are easier to find in Australia.
     
  17. Do you know the radiator to firewall measurement for a 28-29 A on an A frame? JW
     
  18. midroad
    Joined: Mar 8, 2013
    Posts: 290

    midroad
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    I'm not where the car is but looking at the Wescotts frame diagram the distance from the radiator mount holes to the front body mount holes is 31 5/8 inches. the radiator is about 3" thick so you lose 1.5 inches there and the distance from the body hole to the front of the firewall is another inch so there is only about 29 inches left. It might be enough if a Chevrolet water pump saves another inch.
     
  19. It's more complicated than that. I gather he already has a 39 gearbox mounted to a 32 K member. That will dictate the space available forward of it, also needing to factor in engine/box adaptor too.

    Apart from the length gearbox face to fan, there is also the bellhousing etc. diameter to factor in.

    Why so anal about the firewall? If it's close, something has to give and the firewall would be easy, it might not take much. If it's way out of size, well, come up with a new plan.
     
  20. midroad
    Joined: Mar 8, 2013
    Posts: 290

    midroad
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    I know it's complicated, that's why I asked the question. The rest of the car is already built but Av8's with flatheads are getting too common.
    Would you chop up a mint firewall?
     
    57 Fargo likes this.
  21. Fly'n Kolors
    Joined: Sep 21, 2008
    Posts: 407

    Fly'n Kolors
    Member

    '28-'29=28" '30-'31=30" Hope this helps.
     
  22. Hey, I'm just trying to help folks get a clear idea of your situation!
     
  23. midroad
    Joined: Mar 8, 2013
    Posts: 290

    midroad
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    It does. Tells me exactly what I wanted to know. Thanks.
     
  24. That's all im trying to do also X38 and im not being ANAL about it. JW
     
  25. ago
    Joined: Oct 12, 2005
    Posts: 2,199

    ago
    Member
    from pgh. pa.

    I know the Dodge water pump is shorter on my 241 Dodge. Plus the Dodge engine motor mount is on the water pump.
     
  26. sunbeam
    Joined: Oct 22, 2010
    Posts: 5,085

    sunbeam
    Member

    The Dodge water pump is 7 inches a short sbc 5 5/8 - long 7" plus 3/4" for adapter
     
  27. Here's an "A" truck with a Redram: 100_1862.jpg
     
  28. sunbeam
    Joined: Oct 22, 2010
    Posts: 5,085

    sunbeam
    Member

    If you go to Hemi Tech TR Waters put up a nice drawing of a Dodge hemi dimensions/\.
     
  29. midroad
    Joined: Mar 8, 2013
    Posts: 290

    midroad
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Thanks, this is the information I am looking for.
    Does an AA truck have the same length engine bay as a car?
     
  30. da dodge brother
    Joined: Apr 2, 2010
    Posts: 386

    da dodge brother
    Member
    from wisconsin

    I'm just picking up on this tread... Am I reading that a small block chev. water pump will bolt on to the 270 HEMI. I thought it would just adapt to the Chrysler or Desoto... Any special notes to make it fit ????
     

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