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Technical Who runs Lucas TB zinc plus with oil changes?

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by 1950kale, May 1, 2014.

  1. 1950kale
    Joined: Jan 22, 2013
    Posts: 217

    1950kale

    Hi everyone, i ran into a guy who said he put over 500k on 2 of his Ford 390s and over 1million miles on a 300 without rebuilding them. He said its because he runs Delo 30w with a bottle of Lucas TB zinc plus break in oil. What do you guys think of running this additive with every oil change?
     
  2. pontiac
    Joined: Mar 21, 2006
    Posts: 768

    pontiac
    Member

    Most oils today don't have ZDDP in them, which is an anti-wear agent. It was removed from oils due to its harsh effect on catalytic converters, egr systems, etc... Anyone running an old engine, especially which have flat tappet lifters should add the zinc.

    I haven't used that particular lucas product. I run Valvoline VR1 which has the zinc already in it.
     
  3. chubbie
    Joined: Jan 14, 2009
    Posts: 2,294

    chubbie
    Member

    well, they removed the zink in modern oils. so if you want the oil protection that you enjoyed for last 20 years you have to replace it.
     
  4. 1950kale
    Joined: Jan 22, 2013
    Posts: 217

    1950kale

    yea, thats what i was thinking, iv just been adding it for the last year anyway & today when i bought some the guy at riebes said it broke down the oil after 1000 miles, but i figured that was voodoo that he was speaking anyway, haha
     
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  5. plym49
    Joined: Aug 9, 2008
    Posts: 2,797

    plym49
    Member
    from Earth

    There's plenty of science out there on the topic. Google is your friend.

    You will find that too much zinc is as bad as not enough. So you shouldn't blindly add a zinc additive without understanding what is in the oil you are using and how much your engine needs.

    Also, zinc helps with the sliding friction and high loads seen by the camshaft and lifters. It does not help the bearings or rings, so if you buddy attributes longevity to zinc well, if true, just his cam lobes.
     
  6. He must have spent a lot of years driving to put 1.5 million miles on his cars. But, yes, flat tappet motors need zinc.
     
  7. chubbie
    Joined: Jan 14, 2009
    Posts: 2,294

    chubbie
    Member

    Just cam lobes?? oil don't know the difference. It's metal to metal, i wore out a set of pushrods!!!
     
  8. primed34
    Joined: Feb 3, 2007
    Posts: 1,045

    primed34
    Member

    Used the Lucas for the last few years with no problems in the 283 in my '34.
     
  9. Gman0046
    Joined: Jul 24, 2005
    Posts: 6,238

    Gman0046
    Member

    plym49, X2. I'd take my chances depending on an oil manufacturers staff of engineers and chemists to have the right amount of Zinc and Phosphorous rather then just dump in ZDDP's. Too much causes extreme corrosion. Thats why I use Valvoline VR1 racing oil. Contains 1400 PPM of Zinc and 1300 PPM of Phosphorous.
     
    Last edited: May 2, 2014
  10. Commish
    Joined: Jan 9, 2010
    Posts: 379

    Commish
    Member
    from NW Ok

    I sometimes wonder just how hard it was on convertors, and this is just conjecture, but about the time they started reducing it technology had progressed to the point that a lot of engines were going strong at 200,000 miles. People were not trading as often. Now I am hearing of problems as early as 125,000 in some brands. Sometimes money is at the root of things. I am also in the camp that it was not just the cams, wear is wear throughout an engine.
     
  11. models916
    Joined: Apr 19, 2012
    Posts: 380

    models916
    Member

    ZDDP provides scuffing protection. Coated parts and roller everything today doesn't need it. Emissions from engines with ZDDP oil will damage the cat. That's why they took it out.
     
  12. Don's Hot Rods
    Joined: Oct 7, 2005
    Posts: 8,319

    Don's Hot Rods
    Member
    from florida

    We run the Lucas break in oil additive not only for the initial break in period, but with every oil change. We talked to a tech at Lucas and we use a whole bottle for the break in and only a half bottle with each oil change. So far, even with stiff valve springs, no cam wear.

    We had the occasion to tear down the Olds engine in my Son's rpu after he had been driving it and the cam and lifters looked brand new, so it must work. I am also building a 355 Chevy engine and have a 394 Olds that will get this same treatment.

    Don
     
  13. V8 Bob
    Joined: Feb 6, 2007
    Posts: 2,628

    V8 Bob
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Agree^^^. The zink was not removed, just reduced. Better off, and cheaper, to just use the proper oil formulated for your application. :)
     
  14. stimpy
    Joined: Apr 16, 2006
    Posts: 3,547

    stimpy

    its not just the ZDDp its the sulfur too as its a high pressure lube , when they removed it in diesel fuels and oils we saw lots of wear problems and higher metal counts specailly in the extrememly tight clearances and pressures of the fuel pumps and injectors

    you have to check the labels on the diesel oils as they to have now gone to low ZDDP and sulfur levels because of emmision devices ( soot filters (DPF) on the big trucks and catalytic converters/soot filters on the pickup trucks )

    you want a API CI-4 or SH grade oil , a higher letter ( CJ-4, or SJ) is low zddp and a additive will have to be added .

    for older cars Brad Penn, cam II ( magnum ) or the Vr-1 is reccomended . or a bottle of additive .

    some oil distributors/bulk plants are now also getting there own SF-SH rated oils made for resale in quarts , 5-15 gallon drums so you can look there too .
     
    Last edited: May 2, 2014
  15. chubbie
    Joined: Jan 14, 2009
    Posts: 2,294

    chubbie
    Member

    Racing oil isn't formulated to run 2,000-3,000 miles. racers dump the oil after X rounds. don't think so ? call the 1-800 HELP on the web sight of the brand of oil you use. remember to ask what additive to dump in your racing oil to make it run 2K miles.

    I use the small bottles of ZDDP sized for a oil change.
     
  16. stimpy
    Joined: Apr 16, 2006
    Posts: 3,547

    stimpy

    racing oil is the same blend but more wear additives for the extreme abuse , and mostly its heat break down or fuel dilution that kills it , used to go to the blending / packing plant and watch them batch it up .
     
  17. no55mad
    Joined: Dec 15, 2006
    Posts: 1,846

    no55mad
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from nipomo, ca

    Read here: www.ZDDPlus.com They are an Alliance Vendor here on the HAMB - support the Alliance Vendors!!
     
  18. 1950kale
    Joined: Jan 22, 2013
    Posts: 217

    1950kale

    ok, so i think ill just finish the break in and then add 1/2 of the bottle after my oil changes, ill still run the 30w dell, my friend is about 70 and was in the hauling business throughout the 60s and 70s so thats the 390s and the 300... I'm not sure haha
     
  19. Don's Hot Rods
    Joined: Oct 7, 2005
    Posts: 8,319

    Don's Hot Rods
    Member
    from florida

    Yep, the tech I spoke with at Lucas gave me some "parts per million" numbers as to how much the Lucas additive puts back into the typical oil pan. He said half a can would put enough PPM into the oil to protect the cam and lifters if we did that at every oil change. So far it has been working.

    Lucas makes some great additives anyways.

    Don
     
  20. Bighead440
    Joined: May 2, 2014
    Posts: 8

    Bighead440
    Member

    I run a full TB Zinc when breaking-in a flat-tappet camshaft & lifters, and 1/2 a bottle on an oil change when broken-in already. :D
     
  21. ellispreformancedistribution Is the best source on Ebay. I found his pricing and shipping the best over all other outlets. He also has a lot of facts about PPM needed so you can make a wise choice.
     
  22. I have been running Lucas additive in every oil change on my daily for a few years and am at 275K for a 2000 model truck. I also used it on the Rocky33 when I owned it and ran it in my 54 Chevy and the touring. I am sold.
     
  23. thirtytwo
    Joined: Dec 19, 2003
    Posts: 2,628

    thirtytwo
    Member

    I think I might be inclined to agree with commish we have had cats since the 70s zinc has been taken out within the last ten years... Also I am a bit curious how exactly crank case oil would effect the cat? You have 5quarts, you drive 3,000 miles you still have... 5quarts? How does all that zinc reach the cat but leave the oil in the motor?

    I think it was cheaper to make without zinc... The rest is smoke and mirrors ... Even full roller motors have a lot of rubbing going on that could benefit from the zinc... Just my opinion I guess
     
  24. Bighead440
    Joined: May 2, 2014
    Posts: 8

    Bighead440
    Member

    THANKS for this info! :D
     
  25. 1950kale
    Joined: Jan 22, 2013
    Posts: 217

    1950kale

    yea thanks! this is great
     

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