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Art & Inspiration When does traditional "expand"? (If it ever does)

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Taboo56Chevy, Jan 2, 2020.

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  1. anthony myrick
    Joined: Sep 4, 2009
    Posts: 5,043

    anthony myrick
    Member

    I don’t think any one thought you suggested a change. Just a question on what does traditional mean.
    The answer is this. The Hamb focuses on pre 65 trad styled builds.
    And traditional can also be used for late 60s, 70s, 80s, 90s.
    A 32 with a LS is about as traditional as a Fox body with a flathead.
    My students sometimes use the term traditional when referring to a muscle car with lift shackles, side pipes and slots. That would be correct for 70s early 80s stuff.
    It’s a relative term for what ever time period being discussed.
    That’s all
     
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2020
  2. Tri-power37
    Joined: Feb 10, 2019
    Posts: 385

    Tri-power37
    Member

    I wish I could actually put a picture of a flame covered PT Cruiser on here just to remind all of us how great the H.A.M.B. actually is!
     
  3. Rickybop
    Joined: May 23, 2008
    Posts: 5,937

    Rickybop
    Member
    from Michigan

    I understand.
    But I promise, not looking down or talkin down to you, RCM. Just speaking the truth.

    I'll prove it.
    I'll use myself as an example.

    I'm 62 years old. I've loved hot rods my whole life... since I was 3 years old. No exaggeration. But I'll tell you something I don't tell just everybody. I don't consider myself to be a hot-rodder! Certainly not a traditional hot rodder!

    (The rest of the guys are reading this, wondering what the hell I'm talking about LOL)

    It's because of the types of cars that I've owned and the fact that in spite of hot rods being my only real passion... (besides pretty women with dual side mounts) and even though I've owned about a dozen old cars over the years... every one of them was only a slightly modified stocker. You know... raised or lowered rear suspension and some loud exhaust pipes and you're an instant hot rodder LOL. But they weren't really hot rods, and I was only pretending to be a hot-rodder.

    Don't get me wrong. I'm capable. I know shit. I designed machines for a living. And I've studied this hot rodding stuff since I was a kid. And I've done stuff... rebuilt engines, changed out drivetrains, lots of other mechanical work, bodywork and paint, etc. But for various reasons... circumstances beyond my control or bad decisions on my part... I haven't fulfilled my dream of building a real hot rod.

    Am I really a hot rodder?
    No.
    Do I hope to be?
    Fucking a.
    And how will I do that?
    How about build a car, and make it something that we at least might have seen back in the day and called it a hot rod.

    Then maybe I'll really be hot rodding.
    And then maybe I'll really be a hot rodder.

    Just trying to show you that there's a whole lot more to it than most people understand.

    Those of us who have an interest, need to appreciate the untold hard work and dedication that real hot rodders have spent to do what they do... building these awesome time machines. They don't play at it. They don't pretend. They don't just look at hot rods, think about them, talk about them.

    They build them.

    Sent from my VS835 using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
     
  4. railcarmover
    Joined: Apr 30, 2017
    Posts: 237

    railcarmover

    Ive been a heavy equipment mechanic 43 years split my first model a with my brothers when I was 9,rode an indian army scout when I was 22,owned Cletracs,f1 pickups and suzuki samurai rock crawler to name a few.finishing a ground up 29 sport coupe banger build by this spring, 3 years,every thing from babbit to bondo.I dont have 5000 posts here cause at 61 I still work raise grandkids and build cars.I dont dream about shit,I do shit...

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2020
  5. Rickybop
    Joined: May 23, 2008
    Posts: 5,937

    Rickybop
    Member
    from Michigan

    You do shit. Cool.
    Didn't mean to offend you.
    Just the opposite, in fact.
    But if you can build something like this, it's hard for me to understand why you would say that a kid with a 99 Accord and a spray bomb and a fart can is a hot rodder.
    You threw me.
    Good luck with the rest of your build.

    Sent from my VS835 using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
     
  6. 427 sleeper
    Joined: Mar 8, 2017
    Posts: 769

    427 sleeper
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    That kid with the spray bomb and the fart can is the same kid that was emulating the brave men that had just got back from the war in the 40's. The same men that were chopping, gutting, yanking, and pulling every useless piece off of their rods just for the sake of performance not looks! Look's came later. The principle's haven't changed, the style has.
    You work with what you can afford and what's available.
    That's how the next generation progresses.
    That's just how I see it, though.
     
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2020
  7. RJP
    Joined: Oct 5, 2005
    Posts: 1,284

    RJP
    Member
    from PNW

    Right on brother. In the early days of this place, you'd have been preaching to the choir. Now days, not so much....
     
    Mopar Tony, 427 sleeper and 19Eddy30 like this.
  8. My opinion, and we all know what that smells like.
    Traditional: Adhering to past practices or established conventions. (One of several of its definitions in Miriam Webster, but it seems to fit the best. )
    The question then becomes what or whose practices or conventions are being adhered to ? Here, it is clearly laid out.
    I think the confusion for some is the word traditional, as it has different meanings in different groups, because of their conventions. I suspect people just don't read the rules here and come with their own ideas of what is traditional. And then get pissed off when they are rebuked for, in effect, not reading and understanding the rules. Go to miata.net and expect to find Miatas, only. It is their practice and convention. Go to HAMB and expect to find traditional (as defined here) customs and hot rods, only. Will the definition change here ? Maybe. Just not in the foreseeable future. And thats OK.

    Having read the op, it seems to me that he is experiencing some consternation in not being able to both ask about and refer to non traditional vehicles to get answers from this extensive collective intelligence. It is a call to learn and to be taught.
     
    BamaMav likes this.
  9. tubman
    Joined: May 16, 2007
    Posts: 4,592

    tubman
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Does traditional expand? It sure does and don't look now, but it already has. There are lots of threads about station wagons and Ramblers on the forum right now. In my day, you wouldn't have been caught dead in either one of those (except for '55-'57 Nomads).
     
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  10. Moriarity
    Joined: Apr 11, 2001
    Posts: 15,806

    Moriarity
    SUPER MODERATOR
    Staff Member

    the thing that seems to confuse people about the term traditional is this, Traditional can mean different things to different people, Sure there can be traditional 70's street machines and sure there can be 80's traditional custom vans. We do not cover those things here. Instead of the word traditional I prefer the term "era correct". And the era we cover here is 1965 and older so 65 and older cars built with 65 and older parts and in the style that was popular in 1965 and before.....
     
  11. 19Eddy30
    Joined: Mar 27, 2011
    Posts: 979

    19Eddy30
    Member
    from VA

    I would say that Over 90% of post / thread's
    Do not Comply with HAMB 1965 cut, including my cars . I have 4 pre war Fords
    My Original 32 Ford sedan is all steel
    ( all Ford steel parts) None chop full fender's 39 motor & trans. Friction shocks , non split bones , Original interior, & so on . To me this Car Does Not Fit the 1965 cut!! Because it has Reproduction newer then 1980s maybe 2000's Edelbrock Heads ,Intake 40s steel wheels , 16 inch Radial tires , fake Gen with alternator, walker Rad ,headers reproduction bumpers . It looks prewar , my 30 A roadster Looks Pre 65 Hot Rod , the only part of car that is 65 & older is body & 51 motor , & Two gauges .
    The 31 sedan looks gasser / Race Rod , Pre 65 body only . 32 Ford steel 5 window , looks 60s ish , pics have been delated 2 times because OT
    Motor combo , ( straight 6 ) .
    My cars are Hot Rods " Not Street Rods "
    The A sedan & 5 window (when complete) are street driven Drag Rods.
    I try to make them look 70s & older .
    I do not agree about Deleting Post/Pics /Threads ..
    There are Several OT threads/post that are not true to 65 cut , that have over 60 plus pages .
    I am not Preferring to tire's for Pre 65 cut , thats a Safety issue.
     
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2020
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  12. This is interesting, On a 90's mini truck it is called "body drop" but when referring to a model a or a 32 or such it is called "Channeled"

    First time I heard that term body drop I was like WTF you talking about kid !

    Don't hear the old timers saying there going to "Body drop" there A over deuce rails.
     
    anthony myrick likes this.
  13. adam401
    Joined: Dec 27, 2007
    Posts: 1,838

    adam401
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Its crazy how often this comes up. This forum is about pre 1965 hot rods and customs. Its a focused discussion about a specific time period.

    If vehicles and modifications fall outside that time frame they do not fit the criteria of this focused discussion.

    Keeping the scope fixed and focused allows those interested in this specific time period to be able to find and share information without wading through a sea of other posts.

    Other time periods are cool too. Some of us also have interests outside the scope of this forum. This place is more than fine without expanding scope. People have brought it up since Ive been here.
     
  14. liliysdad
    Joined: Apr 1, 2013
    Posts: 63

    liliysdad
    Member
    from Oklahoma

    I would argue that the kid with the spray bombed Honda is more of a hot rodder than most of the folks here....if we are referring to hot rodding's roots, that is.

    Of course, i just spit on someone's sacred cow, so I am sure I will hear about it.
     
  15. I didn't understand. In my opinion, my avatar pic was HAMB friendly a few months ago. After being on this site for less than a year, I completely agree that it has no place on the forum because literally nothing is period correct on it. What I have found here, was a informative group of individuals who have shown me what HAMB cars are about. I no longer desire some of the more "iconic" muscle car. I want a 30's pickup so bad I can taste it.

    I don't agree with the logic that everyone who customizes something on their car qualifies them to be a hot-rodder. Modifying the body of a car (removing fenders etc.) is a lot different than a $15.00 part at your local parts store. Guys who are modifying their Civics, Supra's, R34 & R35 Skylines with swapped engines, complete custom chassis, and other speed-centric upgrades (IMO) qualify as a hot rodder.

    I can drive a nail in wall to hang a picture, but that doesn't qualify me as a carpenter. I have heard though, that a half can of spray paint adds at least 7 horsepower:)

    Mike
     
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  16. loudbang
    Joined: Jul 23, 2013
    Posts: 25,258

    loudbang
    Member

    It all comes down to personal CHOICE. This site is for a certain Era and years of cars, enjoy it for what it is. There is a plethora of other sites that feature other types and eras of Hot rods you can go to and find what you are looking for for virtually ANY type of engine/vehicle.
     
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  17. Kan Kustom
    Joined: Jul 20, 2009
    Posts: 2,337

    Kan Kustom
    Member

    That is me. I still can't believe anyone would be caught dead in a station wagon that were the family mini van back in our day. I am happy for anyone that thinks it's cool. It's their choice, their life. I just don't get it.
     
  18. Just a couple notes here. My youngest sons friends come over and have got introduced to the old car world. They are the 18-20s group. It is rewarding to see their faces when they get to sit in a 57 Chevy . I watch as they grab the big steering wheel and look all around . Then they say wow this is really cool and the questions keep coming. Three on the tree seems to make them smile . A few comments have been "I want to have a cool car some day" . So I planted a seed in their minds . I tell them about the Hamb and tell them to read and learn . The traditional cars will be around for them Dreams are to go after. We all had them, it all starts somewhere . From putting a baseball card or balloon in the bike spokes for the sound to adding a fart can to the Honda the enthusiasm is there and can develop . I applaud the young guys for their ideas of hot rodding . It may take awhile for tradition to set in for them so the site shall remain "traditional" with its guidelines. Go forth and inspire the young.
     
  19. AldeanFan
    Joined: Dec 12, 2014
    Posts: 482

    AldeanFan

    I like the era and type of cars discussed on this board but I understand the confusion to the uninitiated.

    The confusion comes from using a non-specific term “traditional” to define a specific time period.

    If you told anyone unfamiliar with the HAMB that you are building a traditional car they would have no idea what you are talking about because traditional does not refer to a specific era or style of car outside of this place.

    On most other forums it is much more clear what they are dealing with just from the forum name, for example foureyedpride is a forum for early foxbody mustangs and fords, ‘79-86’ when they had four headlights.
    If they had called it the traditionalmustangforum they would have daily posts asking why an earlier or later car is not traditional.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     

  20. Only if it Chrome paint !


    OH WAIT ! was it, if it dont go chrome it
     
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2020
  21. Jalopy Joker
    Joined: Sep 3, 2006
    Posts: 23,975

    Jalopy Joker
    Member

    x2
     
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  22. Traditional - The HAMB is dedicated to spreading the gospel of traditional hot rods and kustoms to hoodlums world wide. That's right; TRADITIONAL. If you've come here to discuss anything other than Hot Rods or Customs built in a style representative of 1965 or before, you've come to the wrong forum.

    With Ryan's opening statement it is apparent that here on the Hamb the traditional moniker apply's to 65 and earlier and I'm all good with that, beyond that time period was the muscle car era. HRP
     
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  23. Rickybop
    Joined: May 23, 2008
    Posts: 5,937

    Rickybop
    Member
    from Michigan

    I do applaud the young guys for whatever efforts they make.

    As Greg said, it's gotta start somewhere.

    Sent from my VS835 using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
     
  24. ramblin dan
    Joined: Apr 16, 2018
    Posts: 1,801

    ramblin dan

    I have a guy in my area who brings a P.T Cruiser to local car shows all dolled up with flames, whitewalls and he is proud as a peacock with it. Not my cup of tea but it's funny when I look through old hot rod books and you consider at the time guys were buying new cars and then taking them to customizers and having all this work done to them and at the time that was accepted. You see cars and trucks back then only a few years old getting the works done to them and it would be the same as someone bringing a new Mustang or Challenger in and having the same done today.
     
  25. anthony myrick
    Joined: Sep 4, 2009
    Posts: 5,043

    anthony myrick
    Member

    I think the young man was referring to other folks using the term “traditional” outside of the hamb defined era.
    The hamb does not define traditional outside of this forum.

    Or that’s how I interpreted the intent of this discussion anyway.
     
    K13 likes this.
  26. You are correct to a degree, those guys buying new cars back in the day and taking them to custom shops and having major body work preformed, chopped tops, sectioned, wild paint, ro day a change of wheels and some racing stickers don't really speak for that era.

    BTW, I think there is a yokel in every town that has a PT cruiser all decked out with add on's. HRP
     
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  27. Anthony, my friend surely you jest, are you saying that there is anything even remotely interesting outside the narrow focus as defined by the Hamb Collective? :D

    I am aware there are other sites out there but the thought of a 70's car being considered a traditional car just goes against every thing I believe to be considered traditional.

    To me it's like the national origination, NSRA that many of us supported for a very long time, then the big change and the day of the pre 49 went down in flames, as far as I was concerned the had ignored customs for years and had they had Ryan's vision things wouldn't have been so appalling to their members.

    If the HAMB was to announce tomorrow that it has come to the attention that a lot of members want to include later model cars and Ryan had made the decision to open up the flood gates I'm afraid I would have to find another place to hang my hat.

    I know I'm a curmudgeon and I don't like change, I don't have to support any automotive origination or internet website for that matter, but I do have a string interest in the style and era of cars here on the hamb, I am a hot rod guy but I also love customs.

    Anthony, I am just replying to your statement, I have absolutely no beef with you, your one of the good guys in my opinion. HRP
     
  28. anthony myrick
    Joined: Sep 4, 2009
    Posts: 5,043

    anthony myrick
    Member

    No beefs implied or taken
    The car organizations should have changed the dates for rides a decade before in my worthless opinion.
    The reason is this. The average 20 something can’t afford a 32, but they can a fox body or C10. Allowing these into the big shows will allow a younger generation to be exposed to cars that they never see. Face it, how many hot rods to you see on the road? Probably very few. Changing the dates will only help expose younger people to a larger group of rides
    Honestly, I wouldn’t have a problem if the NSRA and Goodguys opened up to foreign rides.
     
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2020
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  29. porknbeaner
    Joined: Sep 12, 2003
    Posts: 41,391

    porknbeaner
    Member

    I think is the strictest sense what we consider to be traditional hot rodding will never expand. We consider traditional to basically stop when factory hot rods hit the showroom floor.

    That said we all come from different backgrounds and so we all come from different traditions. So we may consider our roots to be traditional. In that sense we can all determine what is traditional to us separately. Here is an example, my dad drove a nail head powered roadster when I was a little guy (early '60s). he ran radial tires (Dunlops or Pirellis as I recall) and disc brakes from a euro car (this is all pre steel belted radials). His take on it is that the euro cars handled well and so should his. That does not fit into our collective tradition, but for me it is a tradition. Do I push it here? nope I do not. But I could say that it is where I come from.
     
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  30. AldeanFan
    Joined: Dec 12, 2014
    Posts: 482

    AldeanFan

    I do t think the HAMB should change, I like it here,
    But it’s difficult for me to accept using the term “Traditional” to describe such a narrowly defined group of cars.

    I have a similar disagreement with my friends who race cars they describe as nostalgia cars. I was born in 1982 and still have the 1983 mustang I drove in college. When I drive it I feel nostalgic and it is built in a traditional late 80’s early 90’s style but it is clearly way outside the definition of traditional here or the definition of nostalgia per my drag racing friends.

    And that’s ok! I hang out here for the cars I like that are here and I’m glad this place is not polluted with other stuff.




    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
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