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What is your FAVORITE 4 cyl for a HotRod project? MPG-HP !

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by AHotRod, May 28, 2004.

  1. Darwin
    Joined: Oct 14, 2002
    Posts: 505

    Darwin
    Member

    I or someone else may have mentioned this in the early days of this thread but I'd like to put a plug in for the GM 3000 industrial engine. It's HP spec is pretty low because its only rated at 3000 rpm but it'll rev quite a bit more than that. The real advantage is that it's a torque monster--well over 160 lb/ft--and the curve is pancake flat. It's huge for a 4, 181cu.in., and it seems more useful in automotive terms than the relatively peaky and much more expensive marine versions. Chevy bellhousings will bolt right up so sticking a T5 or Tremec behind it would be easy. It's not a flyweight but it's over 200 lbs lighter than an SBC so in a light car it should really scoot and likely get 30 plus mpg. The icing on the cake is that with minimal muffling it would sound much more hot roddy than any of the much smaller import bangers. After all it's basically half of a 350 Chevy. It should last forever to boot and although it's a bit pricey at 18-1900 bucks new it might be a bargain compared to chasing all the parts needed to adapt many of the more exotic engines touted in this thread. It's the grunt hog of 4 bangers and as my tag says--torque is king.
     
  2. ProtoTypeDesignFlauz
    Joined: Jul 29, 2007
    Posts: 1,194

    ProtoTypeDesignFlauz
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    A friend of mine, a fellow H.A.M.B., would not let me put a 153 Nova 4 banger into a hot rod. Thus the engine is still setting in the corner of my garage/shop. He said that hot rods don't have 4 cylinder engines. I guess the real thing to do is drop in a V-8 and pull off 4 of the plug wires. I do remember articles in car magazines during the gas wars of the 70's showing how to make the v-8 SBC run on only 4 of it's cylinders.
     
  3. Glenn, yesterday on the way home from the grocery store, we went through the Pinellas Park/Burger King cruise night. There was a guy that from TN that builds tuna towers and rails for big boats here half the year. He had a turbo VW 1600/914 transaxle, he mounted in a double tube ALUMINUM frame that followed the countours of the 'glass 32 3 window body that was sitting on it. He says 1200lbs, 200 hp, 28 mpg, and it has A/C. he was running aluminum sand rail wheels with 5.60 15s and ProTracs. I'm going to bring the camera with me from now on.
     
  4. Rex Schimmer
    Joined: Nov 17, 2006
    Posts: 743

    Rex Schimmer
    Member
    from Fulton, CA

    Just a quick update on my Zetec power for my roadster. Here are a couple of pics with the Hilborn injection.

    Rex
     

    Attached Files:

  5. nexxussian
    Joined: Mar 14, 2007
    Posts: 3,240

    nexxussian
    Member

    He's right about that. I thought I should mention something about how good the engine must be. At the cargo airline i work for we have Daewoo forklifts (Yes from Korea) and I figure it says alot about an engine when even a cheapie import uses it. We have had our share of teething problems with these, but never with the engine. I don't know if these are rated the same (they run on propane) but imagine how much torque you need to move 30,000 Lbs + of forklift and pallet.
     
  6. DirtyThirty
    Joined: Mar 8, 2007
    Posts: 2,396

    DirtyThirty
    Member
    from nowhere...

    4 cylinder + "hot rod" ??? I don't get it?
    o.k., fire away...
     
  7. Phil1934
    Joined: Jun 24, 2001
    Posts: 2,717

    Phil1934
    Member

    I've been looking at this and my first choice would be the Nissan followed by the Dodge.
     
  8. tjm73
    Joined: Feb 17, 2006
    Posts: 3,404

    tjm73
    Member

    The 2.3 DOHC Ford in the current Ranger delivers 143 hp at 5250 rpm with a peak of 154 ft·lbs of torque at 3750 rpm. That toque curve, however, is supposed to be quite flat.
     
  9. Darwin
    Joined: Oct 14, 2002
    Posts: 505

    Darwin
    Member


    I think they are slightly down on power & torque with propane but only a tick. As far as its torque curve goes it is not only flat but it peaks at only 1600 rpm! The ancestor of the engine, the Chevy 153, was put in midsize sedans with only a 3 speed trans. These cars were gutless to be sure but dropping the 153's modern larger cousin into a trackster or bucket that's a half a ton lighter changes the picture dramatically. In a 1500 lb car even an old Saginaw 3 speed would be adequate gear reduction and a modern 5 sp. would be almost overkill. With a 29" tall tire and a 3.00 rear axle you'd only see about 2400 rpm at 70mph. Sub in a mild .77 OD and a 3.50 gear and it drops to a leisurely 1900rpm. This is barely above the torque peak so it should move out well enough to not need a downshift out of OD all the way down to 40-50mph. Its running characteristics would be a lot like a hopped-up Model A motor and ain't nuttin' wrong with that.

    Addendum: In the above scenario with a 3.0 gear and a 29" tire with 1-to-1 top gear at the "rated" top rpm of 3000 of the 3.0 you'd see 86mph. That'd feel like lightspeed in a bucketish car.
     
  10. hambnbeans
    Joined: Aug 1, 2007
    Posts: 47

    hambnbeans
    BANNED
    from wyoming

    4 Cylinder? Hotrod?
     
  11. Flat Ernie
    Joined: Jun 5, 2002
    Posts: 8,406

    Flat Ernie
    Tech Editor

    Yeah, they're called Bangers - first hot rods. Ts & As.

    FNGs...:rolleyes:
     
  12. DirtyThirty
    Joined: Mar 8, 2007
    Posts: 2,396

    DirtyThirty
    Member
    from nowhere...


    :D :D but why would anyone want one today? ( actually, they do break up the monotony, a bit, in an old Modified, or early hot rod...but why would anyone want a late model, or foreign one in their hot rod??? beyond me...If you want good gas mileage, I would not be worried about a "Hot" rod...build an Electric Datsun!:D

    but, of course...to each their own...
     
  13. Flat Ernie
    Joined: Jun 5, 2002
    Posts: 8,406

    Flat Ernie
    Tech Editor

    Nothing looks better in a little modified or speedster than a banger...

    I think this thread started (some 15+ pages ago) on building something small & light to have fun with & still get good fuel economy....I'm too lazy to actually look.

    I'm with you - just build what you want... ;)
     
  14. Sour Kraut
    Joined: Jun 17, 2007
    Posts: 72

    Sour Kraut
    Member

    M.P.G.!!!!!!! How cheap can you be? If you really want to save money, don't build a rod! Buy a Japanese shit box that only fits two midgets and only drive it when the distance is greater than your legs or your Schwinn can take you. Be sure to only shop at Wal-Mart so we continue this country's economic slide into third world status!
    Remember, when we become a 100% consumer society no one will have a job. Not even the minimum wage box store jobs because no one will have any money to buy anything!
    The Devil resides in Bentonville Arkansas!!
    Now the banger opinion. Model B Ford with an overhead conversion, two 97s and a 3" straight pipe. Or a 2.3 ford stroked to 2.7 with a Eslinger head, mechanical fuel injection on alcohol with a 3" straight pipe!
    The name is spelled HOT ROD !!!!!!!!
     
  15. tjm73
    Joined: Feb 17, 2006
    Posts: 3,404

    tjm73
    Member

    If you can't post anything that add's to the conversation, keep your mouth shut.

    How's the saying go... Better to keep your mouth shut than broadcast your ignorance.... something like that. Close enough.
     
  16. 41woodie
    Joined: Mar 3, 2004
    Posts: 1,095

    41woodie
    Member

    Volvo B-18 or B-20, dual SU's, 4-speed good little torquer and will run forever with little or no maintenance. Had one in a '24 T full fendered roadster p/u. Drove from Minneapolis to eastern Oklahoma on one tank of gas, cruising at 75 mph. Absolutely bullet proof engine.
     
  17. I had a Volvo B-20 go 265,000 before it dropped a valve. Good reliable engines and they'll respond to mods about as well as anything. I had that 'ol 142 up over 115 once or twice but it got real light in the front end and I started to smell poop so I backed off.
     
  18. tjm73
    Joined: Feb 17, 2006
    Posts: 3,404

    tjm73
    Member

    I found a website that is in the UK that caters to The Lotus 7 guys, but they have a bunch of stuff for the Duratec Ford 2.0's and 2.3's.

    With just a 4 into 1 header and a base stand alone EFI kit they made 208hp and 174 ft/lbs. Pretty serious for a 2.0 liter. In a light weight car it would scoot.
     
  19. greasel
    Joined: Jan 24, 2007
    Posts: 325

    greasel
    Member
    from Fresno, CA



    "better to keep your mouth shut and be thought a fool than to open it and remove all doubt" is the one I'm familiar with. :D


    Anyone see the hot rod a while ago with the gasser chevyII on the cover and a bunch of turbo tech inside? guy got a 2.3L/5 speed from a ranger, gave it a light 6 psi turbo and some other stuff and put it in his '63? Falcon.

    the 2.3 Fords and the 2.0 Ecotec chevys are both decent platforms and have quite a bit of aftermarket support. hell, John Lingenfelter died racing a 2.0...SLIGHTLY modified, of course but it's a good platform.

    small turbo'd engines are pretty bitchin...anyone ever had a ride/driven a psyclone/typhoon? turbo 4.3 hooked through an AWD drivetrain, those things are pretty dang fast for 'just a six cylinder'...
     
  20. Silhouettes 57
    Joined: Dec 9, 2006
    Posts: 2,791

    Silhouettes 57
    Member

    If I had to put a "BANGER" in my Hot Rod I'd go with the Pinto/Ranger.
    But this is a hobby and I don't want to have a high dollar car with a low dollar motor just for gas mileage.
     
  21. GeeRam
    Joined: Jun 9, 2007
    Posts: 435

    GeeRam
    Member

    Hmmmm......BDA/BDG in a rod........interesting thought, but a sodding expensive one, and can't really agree with the outstanding durability bit......not in 250hp race/rally spec.....:eek:

    Unless you are real lucky with cheap parts over there. Parts alone for a BDA/BDG rebuild here in the UK would cost the equivilent of US$10k.......

    However, the turbocharged Cosworth YB from the rwd Sierra RS Cosworth and awd Escort RS Cosworth would be my candidate for a 4-pot.
    Stock was around the 220hp mark but there's a huge amount of competition parts available to get an easy and reliable 350hp out of them.

    That's soft tune as well, the Group A racing RS500 Sierra's in the European Rallycross Championship back in the late 1980's were churning out almost 600hp........:D
    There are a large number of road going cars here in the UK running 500hp+ Cosworth YB engines.

    Here's a Cossie YB stuffed into a Ford 105E Anglia taken at the Street Rod nationals a few years ago.

    [​IMG]
     
  22. RichFox
    Joined: Dec 3, 2006
    Posts: 10,020

    RichFox
    Member Emeritus

    When Doc Jefferies had the Ford Sierra powered G/G roadster record I tried a 2 liter Ford Pinto. Liked it a lot, but wasn't fast enough, so I got a Lotus 907 from a Jensen-Healey and ran the number. Held the record for some years until the S2000 Honda motor came along and put around 15 mph on my speed.
     
  23. I have a chehII in my track t 153" powerglide and 26 MPH
    dirt t
     
  24. Fourbanger? What do you want?

    For reliability, spell V-o-l-v-o! That's Volvo! Just check the Guinness Book of world records 1998- the car, driven longest, is a Volvo P1800 with a B18 engine, owned by Irv Gordon, East Patchogue, New York...

    With some tuning - bigger bore, a setup of Weber carburators, sharper cam - it is possible to get up to 200HP out of the old fart! :D :D :D
     
  25. 2"
    Joined: Aug 27, 2006
    Posts: 92

    2"
    Member

    Rover K-Series engines can pack a serious punch. It is possible for them to hit 270 hp in full race trim.
     
  26. Phil1934
    Joined: Jun 24, 2001
    Posts: 2,717

    Phil1934
    Member

    I was looking at a possible future build and the 2.0 Zetec Ford is one late model that can be done without spending thousands on computer controls and custom bellhousings. It can use a Pinto bellhousing if you swap alignment dowels and a stand alone Ford CVH ignition module with a $150 MegaJoltLiteJunior custom advance box if you want to fine tune. Just add some motorcycle carbs. The engine is only 250#, less than 20" long x 24" high x 14" wide.
     
  27. Paul Y
    Joined: Dec 29, 2006
    Posts: 633

    Paul Y
    Member

    IF you can resist the temptation to wind th eboost all the way to the sky then I would suggest the Cosworth twin cam. Turbo injected 2L which had a very unstressed 215hp from the factory. Had a Sierra Cosworth in the mid 80's that ran like stink and pulled 25mpg+ on the motorway.

    Also managed to get it down to 6mpg by driving it like I stole it....

    You pay your money you take your choice....

    P.
     
  28. pompadour
    Joined: May 9, 2006
    Posts: 558

    pompadour
    Member

  29. Honda B-series would be my pick, dependable as hell at least 170hp, plus tons of aftermarket parts sound wicked good spinning at 9000rpm plus below 5000rpm average 34 mpg.
     
  30. tjm73
    Joined: Feb 17, 2006
    Posts: 3,404

    tjm73
    Member

    Which Pinto engine? 2.0 EAO or 2.3 Lima?
     

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