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Technical What is wrong here?

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Moore87, Oct 15, 2020.

  1. Moore87
    Joined: Oct 15, 2020
    Posts: 7

    Moore87
    Member
    from Waco, TX

    New to the board, first post here.

    1936 Ford 5 window, Flathead V8. Inherited from my grandpa when he passed and am working on small projects to make it more reliable and drive a bit better. I needed to replace the rear leaf spring shackles and decided to clean up and lube the rear spring while i was at it. Car has been sitting crooked for a while and i decided to dig into that as well.

    My question is, what do I have going on here? The center spring clamps are not "clamping" the spring. There is a gap between them and the spring. I have searched around and have seen some images where it appears these should be contacting the spring...

    I have pulled the spring and the anti-squeak pad is missing. There are no parts between the spring and the crossmember. Looks like there should be as there are 2 holes that seem to align with the U-bolts.

    Any help would be appreciated. Also, any good reference manuals or assembly books I should buy? 2.png
     
    chryslerfan55 likes this.
  2. Atwater Mike
    Joined: May 31, 2002
    Posts: 10,227

    Atwater Mike
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    As long as you're 'cleaning your spring', count your leaves in the spring pack.
    My '36 3 window had 9 leaves, but my bud Billy's had 10.
    Pretty sure a 'search' will tell how many are (proper, needed, etc.)
    There will be a stretch between required thickness and softness of ride...
     
    chryslerfan55 likes this.
  3. BJR
    Joined: Mar 11, 2005
    Posts: 6,441

    BJR
    Member

    Looks like the spring pack is not thick enough to fill the space in the crossmember without a spacer under the spring. Then the U bolts would be able to clamp the spring to the crossmember.
     
    porknbeaner and dirty old man like this.
  4. Moore87
    Joined: Oct 15, 2020
    Posts: 7

    Moore87
    Member
    from Waco, TX

    It has 10 leaves. From my searching that should be correct. After cleaning it up, I don't see any wear marks or patterns to lead me to believe there have been any removed.

    Exactly what I'm thinking. The only piece between the spring pack and the crossmember is the squeak pad correct? I may just have to add a spacer as you mention
     
    chryslerfan55 likes this.

  5. alchemy
    Joined: Sep 27, 2002
    Posts: 15,768

    alchemy
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    If grandpa hot rodded the car he may have removed a leaf or two. You can fix the problem by welding a little 3/8 steel bar to the tops of the crossbars to take up the slack.
     
    dana barlow likes this.
  6. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 46,695

    squirrel
    Member

    the huge gap between the castellated nuts and the cotter pin holes should give you a clue about how far off it is?

    Lots of things could have been changed over the years.
     
  7. flatheadpete
    Joined: Oct 29, 2003
    Posts: 9,823

    flatheadpete
    Member
    from Burton, MI

    First off...wlecome to the HAMB. Second...How about pics of the car? We love pics!
     
    lothiandon1940 likes this.
  8. Moore87
    Joined: Oct 15, 2020
    Posts: 7

    Moore87
    Member
    from Waco, TX

    Thats what I am thinking. I was first making sure that there are no parts missing before I modify anything.

    Thanks. Here are a few pictures. 53 Merc Flathead, hydraulic brakes, electric fan. Pretty simple so far. I am enjoying it as I am a truck guy (truck in the pics below)

    So far I have completely re-wired the car with a universal painless kit, replaced the gauges (the stock gauges did not work) run all new brake lines and M/C, new weatherstripping and front window seal, and adapted the stereo to power a modern digital radio.

    10.png 11.png 12.png 13.png 14.png
     
  9. Greg Rogers
    Joined: Oct 11, 2016
    Posts: 243

    Greg Rogers
    Member

    That is sweet!!
     
  10. 6sally6
    Joined: Feb 16, 2014
    Posts: 1,213

    6sally6
    Member

    Purty nice-purty nice!!!
    6sa;;y6
     
  11. FalconMan
    Joined: Sep 9, 2008
    Posts: 1,330

    FalconMan
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from Minnesota

    Awesome car ! Doing all the right things. You are one lucky guy to get that from your grandpa . You're making him proud :)
     
  12. Neat car and good job updating it so you can enjoy driving it.
     
    Hnstray and seb fontana like this.
  13. Moore87
    Joined: Oct 15, 2020
    Posts: 7

    Moore87
    Member
    from Waco, TX

    Thanks guys. Appreciate the comments. I’m trying to do the things he wanted to do to it but never could.

    looks like I will just make new spring clamps to hold everything properly. I will add pictures when I’m done and maybe add a few more as I complete the projects.
     
  14. You could just add some flat stock to the bottom of the spring pack to take up the slack. Doing so would not change the ride height or quality but enable you to lower the nuts and insert cotter pins as Squirrel mentioned.
     
  15. Mr48chev
    Joined: Dec 28, 2007
    Posts: 27,327

    Mr48chev
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    This is what I would do. Cut a short spacer out of an old leaf spring that was just a bit longer than the spread of your spring clip bars Or enough to get the correct thickness, place them on the bottom side and put a new bolt in and the ride height or ride won't change.

    I don't think you can remove the U bolts without removing (raising) the body off the frame but you might see if you can tell if the crossmember is worn or damaged on top.
     
    chryslerfan55 likes this.
  16. flamedabone
    Joined: Aug 3, 2001
    Posts: 4,786

    flamedabone
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    That little car is a beauty, your grandpa must have been pretty cool. Looks like you have a good handle on it but always remember, a nice dropped axle goes well with everything.

    Welcome to the HAMB.

    -Abone.
     
    -Brent- likes this.
  17. NashRodMan
    Joined: Jul 8, 2004
    Posts: 1,608

    NashRodMan
    Member

    Wow, thank you Grandpa!! Cool car and cool truck.
     
  18. Nice car - nice motor - great grandpa !
     
  19. Moore87
    Joined: Oct 15, 2020
    Posts: 7

    Moore87
    Member
    from Waco, TX

    Thanks guys. I actually just put 4" lowering leaves on the 71 GMC truck so I can use them as a shim as they are the exact same width as the Ford springs. Will post some pictures when I finish up this weekend.

    I am hoping to keep the old car interests moving down in generations. I am 33 years old and this is my hobby-not video games ha. These cars will have a great family legacy as the GMC came from my other grandpa which he purchased new and has been in the family ever since. We are a bit of a car family
     
  20. Steve '36 5W Cp
    Joined: May 8, 2018
    Posts: 5

    Steve '36 5W Cp

    My '36 5W has a different rear spring shackles than yours does. Your rear shackle looks like my front spring shackle. Best to see some photos of other 36 5Ws to do some comparison. Also, I see that there is a lot of room between your castle nut and the cotter pin hole, maybe the u-bolts are incorrect too.

    Oh, I also have an 8BA motor, what did Gramps do for a fan? Is it in front of the radiator? That is where I had to put mine.
     

    Attached Files:

    Hnstray and chryslerfan55 like this.
  21. There is definitely something missing and it appears to be more than one spring, notice how far the castle nuts are above the hole where the cotter pin is suppose to go, the nut should be over the hole and the cotter pin keeps the nut in place.

    Possibly time to purchase a new spring. HRP
     
    chryslerfan55 likes this.
  22. Damn! How'd I miss that ? ? !
    :eek:
    My "eagle eyes" must need a tune-up. Or maybe I should just upgrade to some new "squirrel-eyes".:oops:
     
    chryslerfan55 likes this.
  23. lippy
    Joined: Sep 27, 2006
    Posts: 4,836

    lippy
    Member
    from Ks

    Neat car. You need the u-bent cotter pins. :D
     
  24. Oh! . . And be careful that you don't over-modernize the car too much. It looks like it's got a pretty tasty vibe going on already. :cool:
     
  25. Viewing the pictures from post #20 maybe the wrong clamp was used. Take a look at your front spring and see if it matches those pictured from that post. Your rear definitely looks like that front and is not the same as that rear. Steve '36 5 W CP.s looks tight and correct as compared to yours.
     
    chryslerfan55 likes this.
  26. Moore87
    Joined: Oct 15, 2020
    Posts: 7

    Moore87
    Member
    from Waco, TX

    dont worry about that. Just fixing at this point and making everything that’s there work and look ok.

    the interesting thing about the attached image is it doesn’t look like the replacement from Mac’s. The website shows a picture that looks like what I have installed

    8F2534C4-2233-4CC5-A56D-6A3ABB549E6B.jpeg
     
    chryslerfan55 likes this.
  27. alchemy
    Joined: Sep 27, 2002
    Posts: 15,768

    alchemy
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Ford made many different height tie bars. They fit the various spring packs, as some springs used more leaves than others. Just because Mac's lists only one part don't take it as gospel.

    There might be a real live Ford part that will fit your situation exactly. Finding it might be hard though. Personally I'd fix the problem out in the garage with some steel stock, a welder, and half an hour's time.
     
  28. That part from Macs is cast iron, unlike original Ford parts which were forged. People have broken the new cast ones with little tightening force. Including HAMB members.

    (A lot of what were forged parts are now reproduced in cast iron. They look okay but...)
     
    chryslerfan55 likes this.
  29. They made a couple different tie bars and U-bolts because of different thicknesses of springs because pickup and panel trucks were built on the same chassis as the passenger car (minus the body mounts riveted to the outside of the rails), and the pickups and panels had more leaves in the rear spring for more weight carrying capacity.
    Also--this is very important--clean and carefully check the center of your crossmembers where the spring attaches. You will often find cracks. Maybe the more accurate word would be "usually" unless you have a car that was only driven around town on paved roads. Most of these old Fords were banged around on rough, rutted dirt roads that gave the suspension a beating. Hit a pothole hard in one of these old Fords, and all of the impact is transferred through the suspension to the center of the crossmember, which eventually translates into stress cracks. If no chunks are missing, just weld up the cracks. It's less work than replacing the crossmember even if you have a NOS crossmember on hand. On the front crossmember, you'll have to pull the engine to get good access to it, and of course you'll have to dress the welds down with the grinder so the U-bolts will fit right.
    I had the good fortune to find a NOS front spring for my '38 pickup and installed new shackles. I changed the rear to parallel leaf springs.
    You are fortunate to have a beautiful '36 5 window that looks very straight and solid, and the fact that it belonged to your grandfather makes it even more special.
     
  30. Moore87
    Joined: Oct 15, 2020
    Posts: 7

    Moore87
    Member
    from Waco, TX

    thanks for the helpful advice. I will check this all out tomorrow when I work on it


    Thanks again guys
     
    warhorseracing likes this.

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