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What flathead is this?

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by FunkyHunk, Mar 9, 2011.

  1. Heo
    Joined: Jan 8, 2010
    Posts: 524

    Heo
    Member

    here is the 36 matford engine see same numbers of headbolts
    and 2 exhaustports maby ford tested a 60 hp prototype
    in france
     

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  2. shmoozo
    Joined: Aug 14, 2007
    Posts: 672

    shmoozo
    Member
    from Media, PA

    Wow, that's the closest I've seen yet. I think maybe you found it.

    :cool:
     
  3. That's what I was saying on page 1.

    The interesting thing about this engine with the two exhaust poirts is the fact that the inlet /exhaust valve layout is different from conventional flatheads with the 3 exhaust ports.

    Looking at the pics in post one suggest the inlets are at the very end of the block and in the middle. This means the vavles locations are the reverse of the conventional flathead. Hence the exhausts are in pairs and siamesed to produce two exhaust outlets .

    I would be keen to see that inlet manifold removed .
     
    Last edited: Mar 10, 2011
  4. tubman
    Joined: May 16, 2007
    Posts: 5,856

    tubman
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    After being on here a few years, I wonder if anyone looks at any of the previous posts before responding. Other than this one, I will refer to the number of 4, 5, or even 6 year old posts that have gotten new life over the last couple of weeks because some newb dug them up and then all kinds of folks jump on them. Please people, read the post before you jump in.
     
  5. shmoozo
    Joined: Aug 14, 2007
    Posts: 672

    shmoozo
    Member
    from Media, PA

    Yeah, it'd have to be.

    Yeah, the valve order on one bank of cylinders for a conventional Ford Flathead would have to be E-I-I-E-E-I-I-E which gives you 3 exhaust ports because they pair the exhaust ports for the two middle cylinders together. In contrast the valve order on one bank of cylinders for a this Flathead would have to be I-E-E-I-I-E-E-I which pairs the exhaust ports for the first two cylinders together and the exhaust ports for the last two cylinders together so you end up with just the two exhaust ports.

    Needless to say, most of the performance engine parts made for a conventional Ford Flathead aren't going to fit on this engine, but if you can get the parts needed to rebuild it you can probably get it running, and a lot of the same tricks that would improve the performance of a conventional Ford Flathead could work on this engine, too.

    I suppose a guy could fabricate a "log style" intake manifold of some sort to allow the use of more than one carb, get a custom ground cam, port and relieve the thing, and build some custom headers, too. It would cost quite a lot and you'd likely end up with something that didn't really put out all that much horsepower compared to even a more conventional, larger flathead, much less an overhead valve V8, but it would be a neat conversation piece in a hoodless roadster.

    Now mind you, a lot of guys would walk right by it not even noticing anything was different about it, but the flathead enthusiasts would spot the differences immediately and stop to chat.
     
  6. 51 MERC-CT
    Joined: Apr 5, 2005
    Posts: 1,594

    51 MERC-CT
    Member

    Got to go with the Matford:)
     

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  7. FunkyHunk
    Joined: Mar 9, 2011
    Posts: 8

    FunkyHunk
    Member

    So, I guess that's it then. Matford V8.
    I wonder about the displacement.
    Maybe it's the same 2.3l v8 used in the early vedettes?

    Wonder if it's rare, and where to find parts?
     
    Last edited: Mar 10, 2011
  8. ScottV
    Joined: Jul 18, 2009
    Posts: 819

    ScottV
    Member

    Okay I am probably the last person here that would know, but I remember when I was stationed in England in the '80s we were at a breakers yard called "Bloxham's"(?) and we looked at a stepvan/bread truck kinda thingy. As I remember it had a very similar engine and I was intrigued that something so old and european was a V8 and used so much aluminum. I also remember it had body panels that seems to have bead rolling in them and wheels that were tall and skinny around a 22" x 4" ish range. I don't know if this helps or not.
     
  9. miwi
    Joined: Nov 10, 2010
    Posts: 136

    miwi
    Member
    from Germany

  10. FunkyHunk
    Joined: Mar 9, 2011
    Posts: 8

    FunkyHunk
    Member

    Some info from Wikipedia:
     
  11. Slick Willy
    Joined: Aug 3, 2008
    Posts: 3,012

    Slick Willy
    Member

    HUH?? this thread is less than 24 hours old??:confused:
    How's the view from your soap box?
     
  12. rustyford40
    Joined: Nov 20, 2007
    Posts: 2,168

    rustyford40
    Member
    from Mass Bay

    Slick= after riding with me one time, now you are starting to sound like me.
     
  13. Stone
    Joined: Nov 24, 2003
    Posts: 2,279

    Stone
    Member

  14. Slick I hope the soap box has wheels on it so he can just keep going :)
     
  15. Heo
    Joined: Jan 8, 2010
    Posts: 524

    Heo
    Member

    No not the same as in the vedettes the vedette engine
    is very similar as the american 60 hp and it later got
    modernised like the 49-53 flathead =separate bellhousing
    conventional distributor non floating rodbearings and it got single vaterpump bigger intake valves and smaler exhaust valves
    better exmanifolds think the most hp it got was 82

    Ithink your engine is wery rare my dad told me he think
    he saw a engine like that in some german military vehicle
    in norway in the 60-70s

    ps shmoosos pictures is of a later vedette engine
     
  16. ventilo
    Joined: Aug 25, 2009
    Posts: 247

    ventilo
    Member

    I'm not aware of any German military vehicle using the small V8-60 design engines.
    Ford of France produced for the Wehrmacht during German occupation in all plants, but all military vehicles like "Maultier" and "schwerer Einheits-PKW" used the larger 3.6 and 3.9 litre Ford flatheads.

    However it was common that confiscated and captured vehicles ended up in Wehrmacht use.
     
  17. fullhouse296
    Joined: Jan 30, 2009
    Posts: 398

    fullhouse296
    Member
    from Australia

    You are all , Wrong , It is a Standard motor company V8 that was a very small run in pommy land , around 38 . Sorry.
     
  18. Heo
    Joined: Jan 8, 2010
    Posts: 524

    Heo
    Member

    Yes i know my father have an Indian Prince that wehrmacht had in
    Finland original from France
    Two guys from Sweden crossed the Finisch border one night and
    stole it from the Germans!!!!!gues you got to have lot of balls
    to do that. He bought it from one of them in the 60s
     
  19. Heo
    Joined: Jan 8, 2010
    Posts: 524

    Heo
    Member

     
  20. Rem
    Joined: Mar 6, 2006
    Posts: 1,256

    Rem
    Member

    Scott, were you based at Upper Heyford? The yard you mention sounds like Smith's at Bloxham village. Great place - in the '80s we'd be over there regularly grabbing any SBC, 9" Ford axle, and anything else of use we could find, from scrapped cars left behind by returning servicemen. The yard is still there, but since Heyford has been closed for a few years there's no US stuff in there anymore.
     
  21. Heo
    Joined: Jan 8, 2010
    Posts: 524

    Heo
    Member

    Maby we are wrong but i think you are wrong to
    here is a pic of the standard V8 .Exhaustports
    exit the top of the block single waterpump water
    entering block different and so on
     

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  22. FunkyHunk
    Joined: Mar 9, 2011
    Posts: 8

    FunkyHunk
    Member

    Got some better pics yesterday.
    Sadly they are from my phone, so the quality is questionable.
    It is definately a Ford engine:

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    I think that Matford 1936 V8-62 is the closest so far.

    Now... where to get parts?
    I need a gearbox, a dizzy and a starter.
    The other parts is salvable. No rust found on any of the internals that we saw anyway.
    The gunk you see inside the cylinders is oil to free the piston rings.
     
  23. Heo
    Joined: Jan 8, 2010
    Posts: 524

    Heo
    Member

    I think regular ford 60 hp or early vedette parts fitts
    or you can adapt a Volvo m40 box to the engine
    if the clutch disc is same as vedette it fits the
    volvo splines
     
  24. That's early pre war french MATFORD (Mathis-Ford). You know..........
     
  25. EZrider
    Joined: Jan 19, 2006
    Posts: 46

    EZrider
    Member
    from Waco, TX

    Looks like A German (Ford of Germany) Taunus engine (pre-war).
    Bob
     
  26. seb fontana
    Joined: Sep 1, 2005
    Posts: 7,155

    seb fontana
    Member
    from ct

    Welded block sides like the early v8-60...I'm surprised they knew how to do that back then...
     
  27. the-rodster
    Joined: Jul 2, 2003
    Posts: 6,838

    the-rodster
    Member

    "Streetrodded" 1936 Matford Cabriolet....

    pretty little car

    [​IMG]
     
  28. ventilo
    Joined: Aug 25, 2009
    Posts: 247

    ventilo
    Member

  29. fullhouse296
    Joined: Jan 30, 2009
    Posts: 398

    fullhouse296
    Member
    from Australia

    anymore teardown pics of this strange beast .I have a feeling it may have more than the normal three main bearings .HMmmm
     

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